Cindy Sheehan

[Joseph P Carey]

Originally posted by enviro
Speaking of reading things right, maybe you should take your own advice. My post had nothing against any of yours. I brought up facts that can be verified.

I have no problem "questioning events" as you say, but you take it a step further and come up with your "own answers".

I neither disputed nor defended you. I quoted radio quoting you.

Comparing me to an Islamic Fundamentalist is unexcusable. I'm suggesting that you go do something vile to yourself.

Up until now I thought you had your head screwed on right, but with a worthless comment like that, your true colors show through.

Are you making this a religious thing now? Are you saying I am anti-Jew? Are you denying that the Israelis murdered the US Sailors and US Marines on board the USS Liberty?

Many of the Israeli leadership were terrorists, including Begen, ben Gurion, and Sharon. Their government policy is terrorism. And, if you think that the Israelis speak for all the Jews of the world, you are so very wrong. Most of the Jews I know are embarrassed by the actions of Israel. It is not a religious thing. It is a theocracy thing, whereby a group comes to power, and takes the rights away from all that do not believe as they do, similar to the Taliban.

I would prefer a government by all the people, not just the chosen few!

Again, I said: On August 26 2005 03:37 PM, on this thread, I wrote: “As far as I am concerned, Israel has killed more Americans than many an Islamic Country ever has, and not indirectly, but with malice and aforethought behind what they did. They murdered our Sailors and Marines on the USS Liberty.” This has nothing to do with the charges you are leveling at me. Get your head out of your butt.

At worst, my remarks are anti-Israel, a country that is supposed to be an ally of the USA, and not one step farther. If I said the same against the Country of Ireland, or the Country of Italy, would you accuse me of being anti-Roman Catholic? The Country of Israel is not a good Ally! They murdered our Sailors and Marines with malice aforethought and their courts refused to make the perpetrators of that action and others like it to be held accountable for such murders.

I am an American, and I still see that the intentional bombing and the machine-gunning of a US Flag Ship and its crew is an act of war! I don’t care if they are Catholic, Buddhist, Islamic or Jewish, it is their country that committed the MURDER of relatively unarmed (Four .50 Cal guns wiped out in the first pass of the Jet Bombers) Americans in the service of the United States of America!

Again, I will bring this back to the reason we are on this thread, the parents of US Service people and their right to say what they wish in support of their children, our men and women in the service. If you shouold want to continue thiis in a thread entitled Joe Carey is a Racist, or anti-Jew, or anything like that, knock yourself out! I will be glad to post what I have on the subject of Israel as a bad ally to the USA, but I will have no one call me anti-Jew. That is just a 'buzz word' for, "I can't fight what you have to say, so I will accuse you of being something you are not!"

[enviro]

Good God Almighty! Where the hell do you come up with this crap?

Who said you were racist? Who said this is about religion? Show me where I have defended Isreal or said you were wrong about it....

I personally never attacked you or your position. I stated a few facts about death during warfare and you say I'm comparable to an Islamic Fundamentalist. For that you can kiss my ass!

Check your meds dude - you misinterpret everything that's been said and you spend most of your time defacing others who don't see it your way.

Chill out and debate this like a MAN. You've twisted everything into an argument. I for one haven't got the time to debate with someone as volitile as you. ESPECIALLY since you have questioned my loyalties and patriotism. You don't know me. You don't my career. You haven't the slighest f****** clue - do you?!

[thedrifter]

enviro you said it all Chill out and debate

Couldn't say it any better


Ellie

[Joseph P Carey]

Originally posted by enviro
Good God Almighty! Where the hell do you come up with this crap?

Who said you were racist? Who said this is about religion? Show me where I have defended Isreal or said you were wrong about it....

I personally never attacked you or your position. I stated a few facts about death during warfare and you say I'm comparable to an Islamic Fundamentalist. For that you can kiss my ass!

Check your meds dude - you misinterpret everything that's been said and you spend most of your time defacing others who don't see it your way.

Chill out and debate this like a MAN. You've twisted everything into an argument. I for one haven't got the time to debate with someone as volitile as you. ESPECIALLY since you have questioned my loyalties and patriotism. You don't know me. You don't my career. You haven't the slighest f****** clue - do you?!

Your problem was you relied on Radio for an accurate quote without ascertaining the true statement I made, you said, "I quoted radio quoting you."

That is how vicious rumors get started! Even when I re-posted (Time stamp added) my original statement, you went on with your diatribe. You deserve what you got from me, because you were easily led by another's falsehood! It was not so much your loyalty that I questioned, as I mostly questioned your intelligence to see things as they really are.

Now, as I have tried to do unsuccessfully on several other occasions, back to the Parents! They are what this thread is about!



EDITED..by Ellie

NOW PLAY NICE

[KingDonkeyPunch]

Just thought that I would share this with all of you. This is from the latest Stars and Stripes: Letters to the Editor. I can't believe a military-based newspaper would even print a letter like this, but hey everyone is entitled to their opinion right?

"Bush should see Sheehan"

I wanted Cindy Sheehan to let her know that she has not only my respect, but my admiration.

Out of more than 1,700 grieving parents, many of whom I’m sure do not agree with the whole Iraq situation, Sheehan is the only one who has had guts enough to ask questions. Too many people are “silently” disagreeing with what is going in Iraq, and until things start to go public, I doubt we will see any change. Sheehan is doing the only thing she can do — go public.

I find it hard to believe that the sacrifice Sheehan has made is not worthy of an hour of Bush’s precious time. I agree that this is a very awkward situation, and I’m not sure there is anything that Bush can say that will be satisfactory. However, because Sheehan is the mother of a son killed in war, President Bush owes her the courtesy of a meeting. When, as president, you decide to go to war without (1) ascertaining that the intelligence is accurate, (2) obtaining congressional approval and (3) having a workable postwar plan, you should expect to have to answer some difficult questions.

As to the idiots in Texas who are protesting Sheehan — shame on you. She has suffered a loss that only those who have suffered that loss can understand. Go home, sit down, shut up and turn on the news so that you can see firsthand the senseless loss of American life you are supporting.

Debbie Ray
Lawton, Okla.

[Joseph P Carey]

Originally posted by KingDonkeyPunch
Just thought that I would share this with all of you. This is from the latest Stars and Stripes: Letters to the Editor. I can't believe a military-based newspaper would even print a letter like this, but hey everyone is entitled to their opinion right?

"Bush should see Sheehan"

I wanted Cindy Sheehan to let her know that she has not only my respect, but my admiration.

Out of more than 1,700 grieving parents, many of whom I’m sure do not agree with the whole Iraq situation, Sheehan is the only one who has had guts enough to ask questions. Too many people are “silently” disagreeing with what is going in Iraq, and until things start to go public, I doubt we will see any change. Sheehan is doing the only thing she can do — go public.

I find it hard to believe that the sacrifice Sheehan has made is not worthy of an hour of Bush’s precious time. I agree that this is a very awkward situation, and I’m not sure there is anything that Bush can say that will be satisfactory. However, because Sheehan is the mother of a son killed in war, President Bush owes her the courtesy of a meeting. When, as president, you decide to go to war without (1) ascertaining that the intelligence is accurate, (2) obtaining congressional approval and (3) having a workable postwar plan, you should expect to have to answer some difficult questions.

As to the idiots in Texas who are protesting Sheehan — shame on you. She has suffered a loss that only those who have suffered that loss can understand. Go home, sit down, shut up and turn on the news so that you can see firsthand the senseless loss of American life you are supporting.

Debbie Ray
Lawton, Okla.

I think that the writer of this letter, Ms Ray, is very ill informed. Ms Sheehan has already had her drink at the well. She already met with the President once before. Added to that, the bond between her son, Casey, was not as strong as others want to portray hers to be.

She has a second son that despises her for her actions, and it may go deeper than just that, as may have been the case with his brother, Casey.

She has a husband that seems to think that Ms Sheehan is being used and he is currently divorcing the US Soldier's mother in California.

So? What is her agenda? She has advisors from the Howard Dean for President campaign in her midst, as well as representatives of Move-on dot Org. This is not so much about her son as it is the left wing's vile attempt at winning at any cost.

Ms Sheehan is a wonton fool; she is a Useful Idiot of the Left Wing. She is fodder for personal and political leaders of another agenda. She is a symbol for the people that can not see through to the truth, and they are as blind as people can be to such treachery.

This is simply the case of the wolf pulling the fleece over the eyes of the sheep.

[Old Marine]

Originally posted by Joseph P Carey


Old Marine,

The remarks I made were 'petty', and they were made to be 'petty' to show Radio that not all people had the same lots in life. He put down the parents of these young men and women, saying they did not have the same voice here, because they did not serve. If I understand the mission statement of the Marines, it is 'to protect and serve the Constitution and the people of the United States at the direction of the civilian government.'

This, to me, means to protect the people that can not protect themselves. We were all fine physical specimens going into the Corps, made better through the training we received in the Corps. Others were not so lucky as were we through no fault of their own, and it was our duty to secure the rights of liberty for them, not just ourselves.

Radio wrote on August 26 2005 02:57 PM, and I quote word for word: "To various Marine Dads. I'm very thankful that you have raised sons who have shown the strength of charactor to become Marines. I also think you have every right to be in a Marine oriented discussion forum…

...However, having said that, I still wonder why you, yourselves did not do the same? I.E. serve our country in the military…

...It kind of strikes a sour note with me when people justify their own lack of military service by saying that some other relative served. It's as though that gives them a bye…

...I'm sure it's not what you intend, but it sounds as though you are somehow putting yourself on equal footing with someone who has put on the uniform and given years of their lives (and in some cases, much more) to defend our country, and our way of life."


Yes, I was petty, but no more petty than he was. I have no problem with Radio's serving in a blockhouse Radio Station in Vietnam safely behind the Grunt's bayonet and rifle that protected him at his work, and he should have no problems with people, who for one reason or another that could not serve, as they defend and support their children they have raised with justified pride to protect this country.

Radio has often said, he would never allow his children to do the same.

You are right though, I was a Grunt, and I took all my shots in the front, and the campaign awards I received were for the benefit of 'being in the soup' so to speak of my MOS. I can not judge what I did in comparison to what he did not have the oportunity to do. I apologize! After all, our job was to protect those that could not protect themselves.

Every Marine is a grunt first and some have other duties and different MOS's, but even cooks are basic grunts as you should well know. Just because you were an 03 doesn't make you a better Marine than a non 03.

[rayearley]

HEY JOE;I'M DISAPPOINTED IN YOU,HERE I THOUGHT I WAS TALKING TO SOMEONE EDUCATED,BUT I SEE YOUR NOT.WELL I'M JUST THE MAN TO HELP YOUR OLD IGNORANT SELF OUT. ANYTIME YOU WANT I WILL COME AND PICK YOU UP,TAKE YOU OUT TO STANDING ROCK SO.DAKOTA AND INTRODUCE YOU TO MY OL AUNTY,SHE IS SITTING BULLS GRANDDAUGHTER,SHE AND SOME OF HIS OTHER CLAN WOULD BE HAPPY TO EXPLAIN IT TO YOU,AND I KNOW IT WOULD BE DONE RIGHT,WHY THEY GOT VETERANS OF EVERY WAR WHO WILL WHOLE HEARTLY EDUCATE YOUR OL IGNORANT SELF.NAQUONABE

[Joseph P Carey]

Originally posted by Old Marine


Every Marine is a grunt first and some have other duties and different MOS's, but even cooks are basic grunts as you should well know. Just because you were an 03 doesn't make you a better Marine than a non 03.

Again, Old Marine, This thread is not the place for this. Should you want to change the mission statement of the Corps, do so in another thread. The fact that he (Radio) did not have to pick-up a rifle to defend himself sings loudly of the job that the Grunt did in protecting him so he could accomplish his mission for the Corps. The fact that, with the enemy all around us in Vietnam, our cooks, and our yeomen, and our Airedales did not have too many occasions to go to the pits in a defense of their units is more about the good work that other Marines did at their jobs, that enabled others to do theirs. Anyone that served in the Marines knows that all in the Marines are 0300 first, it is just that those trained everyday at being 0300s do the job so much better. It is like taking an 'AAA' Baseball team and playing them against the likes of the Yankees or the Bosox. They all know the game; some do it better than others.

But, this is a thread dedicated to the Parents of the service men and women who now serve this country, and their right of input, whether they served in the service or not.

The fact that these very same people were told by Radio that they do not have the right and the privilege to speak in a forum of this nature, and should not take pride in what their children's, our men and women's, accomplishments was both wrong and insulting, and it sure has Hell isn't what the Marines are all about when it comes to families of Marines. They may be Marines, one and all to all of us, but they are these people's children.

[Joseph P Carey]

Originally posted by rayearley
HEY JOE;I'M DISAPPOINTED IN YOU,HERE I THOUGHT I WAS TALKING TO SOMEONE EDUCATED,BUT I SEE YOUR NOT.WELL I'M JUST THE MAN TO HELP YOUR OLD IGNORANT SELF OUT. ANYTIME YOU WANT I WILL COME AND PICK YOU UP,TAKE YOU OUT TO STANDING ROCK SO.DAKOTA AND INTRODUCE YOU TO MY OL AUNTY,SHE IS SITTING BULLS GRANDDAUGHTER,SHE AND SOME OF HIS OTHER CLAN WOULD BE HAPPY TO EXPLAIN IT TO YOU,AND I KNOW IT WOULD BE DONE RIGHT,WHY THEY GOT VETERANS OF EVERY WAR WHO WILL WHOLE HEARTLY EDUCATE YOUR OL IGNORANT SELF.NAQUONABE

For the record, Sitting Bull sat out the Custer battle. Crazy Horse was the war chief, Sitting Bull was the Admin Chief, so to speak. Explain it to me if I am wrong, but do so on another thread, this is not the place for it.

[radio relay]

Nice to see that the brawl is still going on...

Hey Joe, medal flames are low class, and the mark of desperation.

I don't doubt that you have more medals than me. Almost everybody does.

Why don't you post some pictures of them? Man, we would all be so impressed and love to admire them with you.

Nope, I was not a hero. Just did my job and came home.

It don't mean nuthin'.

Ya know, I've never mentioned anything on this forum about my children (other than I raised a couple of them). So, your little lie about what I have said about my own kids does not hold an ounce of water, and once again, shows your desperation.

Looks like you're getting it pretty good now from others you've rubbed the wrong way. So, I'll be on my way...

Just a word of freindly advice. Stop trying to be such a know it all show off, and lighten up on the stuff from the lunatic fringe. We want to hear what you have to say, but we are not going to allow you to keep posting baloney, and go unchallenged.

See you in another thread someday soon.

[Joseph P Carey]

Originally posted by radio relay
Nice to see that the brawl is still going on...

Hey Joe, medal flames are low class, and the mark of desperation.

I don't doubt that you have more medals than me. Almost everybody does.

Why don't you post some pictures of them? Man, we would all be so impressed and love to admire them with you.

Nope, I was not a hero. Just did my job and came home.

It don't mean nuthin'.

Ya know, I've never mentioned anything on this forum about my children (other than I raised a couple of them). So, your little lie about what I have said about my own kids does not hold an ounce of water, and once again, shows your desperation.

Looks like you're getting it pretty good now from others you've rubbed the wrong way. So, I'll be on my way...

Just a word of freindly advice. Stop trying to be such a know it all show off, and lighten up on the stuff from the lunatic fringe. We want to hear what you have to say, but we are not going to allow you to keep posting baloney, and go unchallenged.

See you in another thread someday soon.

Radio,

You seem to want to take this to another level. Start a thread! If I could find the text you wrote about you not wanting your children to serve in the US Military service under President Bush in the archives I would produce it, but I can not, so you can have that. I remember it, but if you can not be a man about it, and you say you did not, so be it. It is just like what you said about me, but in this matter I could prove what I said was not what you accused me of saying. You were very wrong and very false in your quoting of me. You did this intentionally for just that effect, and no apology has come forward from you for the intentional misquoting of me.

Getting back on subject, you wrote: on August 26 2005 02:57 PM: "...However, having said that, I still wonder why you, yourselves did not do the same? I.E. serve our country in the military...
...It kind of strikes a sour note with me when people justify their own lack of military service by saying that some other relative served. It's as though that gives them a bye...
...I'm sure it's not what you intend, but it sounds as though you are somehow putting yourself on equal footing with someone who has put on the uniform and given years of their lives (and in some cases, much more) to defend our country, and our way of life."

As far as what I said about awards, that was almost as mean spirited as what you said to the fathers and mothers of these fine young Marines. You should be ashamed of yourself, and you should run away from your words that were spoken without thought. The truth of the matter is that you were just not in position to do what I did, so be it, and based solely on your good health, you were able to join the military, where others were not. You owe these fathers and these mothers an apology for what you said of them. Any man, any Marine, would apologize for his bad choice of words when confronted with them. You did not!

But, I see you have run away! Goodbye!

Maybe, you have lost the idea of a debate. It is a formatted question of which people argue the pros and cons of an issue. The object is not to be a mutual admiration society, but to present different views. I don't particularly care what you, Enviro, or Early write about me, neither of you have come close to addressing the issue on the board. The issue is the parents.

[Wyoming]

You know, Joseph P Carey, I used to enjoy reading your posts.

Now, I find you to be a lonely, lonely person.

I apologize for utilizing this thread in this manner and strongly feel that JPC is one of those who needs to check in at the VA and get his meds adjusted.


On another note, I recommend this thread cease, since it has become a leg-****ing forum.

You want to read or write of Sheehan, go here -
http://www.leatherneck.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=139929#post139929

Maybe this one will stay on track.

[Joseph P Carey]

Originally posted by bigalholmes165
You know, Joseph P Carey, I used to enjoy reading your posts.

Now, I find you to be a lonely, lonely person.

I apologize for utilizing this thread in this manner and strongly feel that JPC is one of those who needs to check in at the VA and get his meds adjusted.


On another note, I recommend this thread cease, since it has become a leg-****ing forum.

You want to read or write of Sheehan, go here -
http://www.leatherneck.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=139929#post139929

Maybe this one will stay on track.

You have the right to your opinion, I thought it was wrong what he said about the parents of the Marines, but so be it!

[yellowwing]

I applaud both sides of the ideological aisle on this one. Apathy is the real killer.

We've all put in our blood sweat and tears to continue this great nation. Not caring is the biggest sin IMHO.

But we still have some great progeny to continue our legacy. Lance God Lake is soon ending his combat tour. Young Shawn Seeley is set to go relieve him. The Parrish Brothers are due to graduate, and will most likely relieve Seeley next year.

It is within all Marines to step forward and make a difference. Out of 260 million, we've got the greatest 130 thousand.

I thank the Good Lord for seeing fit that I am counted as a United States Marine.

Semper Fidelis to all!