When does someone earn the title Marine?

[LCPLE3]

I have been reading the threads in the open squad bay forum (Famous Marines: and Marine recruit dies after four years in coma).I read that some believe that your not a Marine until you graduate from bootcamp.In the Famous Marines thread it was about Dan Rather not graduating from bootcamp so he's not a Marine.But what about this recruit (and others in the past)that died from injuries during recruit training?Are they not Marines?

[davblay]

L/Cpl we have to look at the facts in each case. If the recruit would have completed Boot Camp, had it not occured, then yes he can be considered a Marine, in my book. Dan Rather did not complete it and he is still alive, sooooo!

[3077India]

I may be wrong for saying this, but I feel that those who die during basic should, at the very least, be granted the title Honorary United States Marine.

[LCPLE3]

What about Marines before Parris Island?Those guys that signed up at Tun Tavern did not graduate.

[RON 68]

everybody who makes it through boot and graduate's is a Marine. at Tun Tavern, just drunken Marine's. RON 68

[LCPLE3]

everybody who makes it through boot and graduate's is a Marine. at Tun Tavern, just drunken Marine's. RON 68

Have to agree with you on Marines from Tun Tavern.

But this kid that died from injuries from boot training is a Marine IMHO and should be honored as such!

[davblay]

No one is debating that fact, L/Cpl, as a matter of fact you seem to have only support for your statement! What exactly are you saying or looking for here?

[LCPLE3]

No one is debating that fact, L/Cpl, as a matter of fact you seem to have only support for your statement! What exactly are you saying or looking for here?

That most Marines today believe that your only a Marine if you graduated from boot camp (Parris Island or San Diego).I'm trying to point out that there are exceptions to this.I feel that most Marines would agree that recruit Josh Isaac has earned the title Marine even though he did not graduate from boot camp.But what about others such as Dan Rather who was a medical discharged from boot camp?What about Marines that have brought shame upon themselves after their service (Oswald,Whitman ect..)?Do you consider Corpmans Marines?What about the Marine Corps Band?None of them graduated from boot camp!So I say again....

When does someone earned the title Marine?
Can or should the title Marine be taken away?

[yanacek]

Completion of boot camp is not necessarily required for someone to have earned the title Marine.

Following World War II, civilians could enlist directly into the Marine Corps Reserve without going to boot camp. These young men were trained at local reserve units by World War II veterans. After a specified number of hours of training, they we deemed "Marines." When Korea broke out in August 1950, many of these young men went directly overseas as part of the 1stMarDiv. They saw fighting at Inchon and at Chosin Reservoir.

As far as bandsmen, all go to boot camp except those selected for the "President's Own." Those in the "President's Own" are appointed to the grade of Staff Sergeant and are given orders directly to 8th & I. There, they receive instruction on being a member of the U.S. Marine Corps Band. Are these folks Marines? The Commandant considers them Marines and that's good enough for me.

Corpsmen--As much as I appreciate them, they are not Marines in my opinion.

[Namvet67]

I agree with Yanacek! There are several threads on other web sites about his very subject and it has been discussed in detail by many combat Marines that never set foot in boot camp. I wouldn't want to tell these men that they are not Marines! You are a Marine if the Corps says you are. Boot camp or no boot camp! Crimes commited by Marines after they got out does not take away their title. We got good Marines and bad Marines! How long does it take to make a Marine? 12 weeks? 8 weeks? More or less? Recruit training has taken on many forms over the years and those that were in charge of training had to make that call. Graduate you or fail you. If you failed then you did not get the title.

[Sgt Leprechaun]

Correct by both esteemed SNCO's. In the days prior to Recruit Training as we know it today, the standards were different. Applying todays standards to historical Marines would be wrong on several different levels.

[jetdoc]

When we were down in PI last month we saw some bldg had the Marine Corps band on the side..something like that. I didn't pay much attention to it to be honest with you.

[sgt tony]

When the Marine Corps says you are a Marine then you have that title. If they died in boot camp and they were not going AWOL and they were giving there all then YES they are Marines. If you got out on a medical out of boot camp you are just a wanta be.

[1LONGSHOT]

As far as "Doc's " being Marines i say yes. They live ,eat, drink, sweat and Die with and for us. They may have U.S. NAVY on there cameo's but to me they have earned it. Thanks to all the Doc's out there. And Sgt Tony my wife got out on a medical not that she wanted it, and NO she isnt a wanta be.

[maverickmarine]

I have to say that I can't agree with being considered a Marine if you die in bootcamp. Whether you may or may not have completed bootcamp doesn't matter because you didn't. I understand that it is hardcorps for that to happen in bootcamp and you may think in honor of that "sacrifice", maybe they should be considered a Marine but the fact of the matter is that they did not graduate bootcamp, which is how you earn the title, so they are not Marines. Maybe they could've been or would've been but they are not.

I do feel our Docs deserve a great deal of respect and they do train with us side by side and go into combat with us side by side but still they did not graduate bootcamp so can't be considered Marines. I would put them as close as you can be without actually being one though.