Lets Brainstorm a little here?

[SuNmAN]

After I read Staff Sergeant Nelson's article about Somalia, it would seem more apparent than ever that we need to win the war of terrorism. It doesn't matter if you're democrat or republican, Muslim, Christian or Buddhist, white, black, brown or whatever. The common enemy of citizens of the free world and the oppressed world is AL QAEDA and Islamic extremism.

How can we defeat them? I maintain that winning hearts and minds is fundamental to winning this war. What do you guys think?

Oh yeah, and Merry Christmas !!

[rb1651]

SuNmaN, I agree the common enemy is Al Qaeda and Islamic extremism, but you will never win the "hearts and minds" of them because their only objective is world domination, by any means necessary to achieve their goals. You defeat these animals by eliminating them one 10 ring at a time.

Merry Chirstmas!!

[Sgt Leprechaun]

Islamism isn't like nazism or communism or any of the other 'ism's. It's a weird cult all on it's own. Those who drink from the cup of it will never, for the most part, be willing to co-exist with others. Unlike the hard core bible thumping Christians, who will try and convert you, but will basically leave you alone if you choose not to convert to 'their' church, Islamists seem to feel personally insulted and immediately inflamed, to the point of removing your head from your body, if you choose not to convert.

There is the difference. Nazism was defeated by overwhelming force. Communism was defeated by captialism; one could comfortably say in later years "I served with the 21st Panzer Division" while selling you a BMW. A former Communist could say "I was in the 321st Guards Tank Regiment in the GSFG in 1986" while giving you a tour of St. Petersburg.

The death cult of Islam is kinda like a gang; you get jumped in, and the only way out is jail, or death.

[10thzodiac]

It's quite simple to me, if we weren't over there meddling in someone else's affairs and minded our own God dam business, we would not have a bunch of p*ssed off "Fanatics' flying jets into American buildings.

I find it difficult that intelligent people cannot see that they are being duped !

Henrey Kissenger Quotes

“OIL IS MUCH TOO IMPORTANT A COMMODITY TO BE LEFT IN THE HANDS OF THE ARABS.”

“MILITARY MEN ARE JUST DUMB, STUPID, ANIMALS TO BE USED AS PAWNS IN FOREIGN POLICY.”

HENRY KISSINGER (ex American Secretary of State as a member of the Trilateral Commission & Bilderberger Group. Henry Kissinger appointed Paul Bremer to oversee the conquest and occupation of Iraq on 5/6/2003. Living. Quotes 1991 & 1990)

SF
10thz

[Sgt Leprechaun]

Hey, 10th, Merry Christmas! LOL

Hang on, tho, 'cause our 'footprint' in the middle east prior to 9/11 wasn't that great. IIRC, UBL wanted us out of Saudi because that is where Mecca is located, that was one of his *****es. Eventually, after Afganistan and now Iraq, we've left Saudi, at least, militarily I believe.

However, I will go along with Kissingers first quote LOL

[yellowwing]

I think the quickest way for them to achieve their goals is to overthrow Saudi Arabia. That is in fact the first demand of Osama Bin Laden, that we leave Saudi Arabia.

Like it or not, one of the main pillars of the WORLD economy is oil. Saudi Arabia earns about $150 billion a year on exports. Look what Al Qaeda has achieved in Afghanistan lately running on $7 billion in heroin money.

Maybe Osama would be satisfied with that. Or it could be his interim objective. He's been successful in splintering NATO. Splintering world opinion, and finally he's got us quibbling at each other now.

Objective one for us should be to truly reunite. Left and Right need to cut a deal with themselves.

[Sgt Leprechaun]

Fair enough....but how? Who gives what up to meet in the middle?

[10thzodiac]

Hey, 10th, Merry Christmas! LOL

Hang on, tho, 'cause our 'footprint' in the middle east prior to 9/11 wasn't that great. IIRC, UBL wanted us out of Saudi because that is where Mecca is located, that was one of his *****es. Eventually, after Afganistan and now Iraq, we've left Saudi, at least, militarily I believe.

However, I will go along with Kissingers first quote LOL

Merry Christmas Jason !

I personally believe prior to 9/11 we have/had an 'enormous footprint' there, e.g. we support/supported oppressive regimes like Israel, Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Afganistan and gave/giving financial aid to Egypt, Palestine and others. Not to mention our pre 9/11 attacks in Lebanon and Libya.

I 'm still entirely convinced the Industrial Military Complex has gotten us into this quagmire, just like Vietnam.

"In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the Military Industrial Complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist." ~ President Dwight D. Eisenhower

Eisenhower warns us of the military industrial complex.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8y06NSBBRtY

SF
10thz

[Sgt Leprechaun]

I have to disagree that Isreal is "an oppressive regime". Same goes for Lebanon; we went there in the early 80's in an attempt to stop two warring sides from massacring one another and ended up gettin caught in the middle...of course, we did the same recently in Kosovo, fighting on the side of the muslims, basically, and look what that's gotten us. Nada.

[FistFu68]

YO~SUNBOY,YOU FORGOT THE (YELLOW MAN);IN YOU'R RAINBOW OF HUMANITY!!!

[yellowwing]

Fair enough....but how? Who gives what up to meet in the middle?

I'm working on it!

[SkilletsUSMC]

After I read Staff Sergeant Nelson's article about Somalia, it would seem more apparent than ever that we need to win the war of terrorism. It doesn't matter if you're democrat or republican, Muslim, Christian or Buddhist, white, black, brown or whatever. The common enemy of citizens of the free world and the oppressed world is AL QAEDA and Islamic extremism.

How can we defeat them? I maintain that winning hearts and minds is fundamental to winning this war. What do you guys think?

Oh yeah, and Merry Christmas !!

Good Post Sunman.

#1: We have got to get our **** together back home. The biggest problem is american self loathing. People believe that america is bad, and have no back bone anymore. We need to have the guts to back up our threats. Another big part of getting our **** squared away would be to not act like such an economic and political juggernaut all the time. In that way we do definately need to be holding the moral high ground.

#2: We need to elect a LEADER. Not a leftwing appeasement monkey, and definatley NOBODY with any ties to big oil. no matter how true GWB is in his heart, no one can trust him deep down.

#:3 Once we have our **** back together, we have to do small military ops into ANY country where Al qaeda is operating and destroy them. Not huge invasions like Iraq. MAKE the world know that we are serrious about fighting terroisim. Afgansitan would be in so much better shape had there never been an Iraqi war. Second and most importantly, the US and the world needs to take a no BS approach to acts of terroism. Make Islamics accountable for their actions. List off some but not all potential targets that would be struck within 48 hours of any terrorist attack. Think M.A.D. for the 21st century.

[SuNmAN]

SuNmaN, I agree the common enemy is Al Qaeda and Islamic extremism, but you will never win the "hearts and minds" of them because their only objective is world domination, by any means necessary to achieve their goals. You defeat these animals by eliminating them one 10 ring at a time.

Merry Chirstmas!!

I don't want the hearts and minds of Al Qaeda and Islamic extremists. I want the hearts and minds of the common folk who just want a peaceful life.

[Sgt Leprechaun]

Realistically, the only way we can do that is by longevity and staying power. Right now, if you were a 'little guy' on the street (ANY street in any country), would you be willing to put your trust in Uncle Sam for the long term?

If so, why? Over the past 20 years, if we've proven one thing, it's the fact that 'we' have just about zero staying power. Blame both sides, the risk averse Republicans, and the "Wave the white flag" Democrats. Had we gone in with massive, overwhelming, crushing force in the days after Blackhawk Down, it would be a different world today.

"Train like you fight" means what it says, and so very much more.

[SuNmAN]

It's quite simple to me, if we weren't over there meddling in someone else's affairs and minded our own God dam business, we would not have a bunch of p*ssed off "Fanatics' flying jets into American buildings.

I find it difficult that intelligent people cannot see that they are being duped !

Henrey Kissenger Quotes

“OIL IS MUCH TOO IMPORTANT A COMMODITY TO BE LEFT IN THE HANDS OF THE ARABS.”

“MILITARY MEN ARE JUST DUMB, STUPID, ANIMALS TO BE USED AS PAWNS IN FOREIGN POLICY.”

HENRY KISSINGER (ex American Secretary of State as a member of the Trilateral Commission & Bilderberger Group. Henry Kissinger appointed Paul Bremer to oversee the conquest and occupation of Iraq on 5/6/2003. Living. Quotes 1991 & 1990)

SF
10thz

I disagreed wholeheartedly.

As a HUMAN BEING I would feel very ashamed if we just insulated ourselves from the rest of the world and did not try to help others who are struggling.

A large portion of the world lives on less than $1 a day

A large portion of the world lives with very few rights and freedoms and face oppression daily

As the world's sole superpower and by far the world's most military powerful and wealthiest state, we have a duty to lend a helping hand to those who need it.

Yes, Iraq may have been more than we can chew. We cannot do everything, but we must try.

10thZodiac, I feel like a lot of Marines here are overly conservative, but based on my personal opinion, you are overly liberal. Globalization is occurring whether we like it or not. We cannot live in insulation and isolationism. It does not work like that.

I will close by leaving you with two quotes:

"With great power comes great responsibility"
"All that is required for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing"