Fake Marines

[ohyes]

Phone number for the Sacramento FBI Field Office,that's as close as I could get to Bakersfield

(916) 481-9110

Call them and explain what's going on. But have your facts straight.

Thanks..will call them.

[Mongoose]

hate to say it but I have seen a few Drivers come in at Mach 2 40 feet off the ground also watched a 16 lose his bomb set on a mountain at Range 51 Fallon. Be sure you know the whole story before you Condem a Marine

If in fact he could reach out and touch the water with his hand, wouldnt the jet be mostly under water? Thats what I was laughing at.

[johnry]

We had a masster gunny flying c-47's out of iwakuni in 1969

[USNAviator]

How did they get the picture of her?

You know Al, another member brought that same question up today. I'd like to know the answer to that as well but I suspect we won't

[USNAviator]

He had to fly low to get under the radar. Told them he flew so low from the carrier to the main land. He used to put his canopy up and put his hand down and touch the ocean. I just walked off laughing.

Well I've heard of Feet Wet, Feet Dry but never Knuckles Wet!!! He must have been inverted Billy, to touch the ocean like that. Nothing like being inverted, 10 ft off the deck, open canopy, the salt spray hitting you in the face. It must have been exhilerating.......

[Mongoose]

Being serious now Dan. If you were inverted, could you actually fly that close to the ground and still recover?

[HOWARDROARK3043]

One day I was thinking,,,, how can I get women without trying,,, so I thought ill buy a set of dress blues ---but then i thought ---i might get beat up if i wear them -----so then I thought why dont i just join the Marine Corps so i can wear the blues,,,,,,,,, I saw a recruiter and he told me i could run all i want in the Marines---- hell yeah 0000dress blues and i get to run ------ and free food,,,,,

4th MLG??? isnt that like 4th bn???

[USNAviator]

Being serious now Dan. If you were inverted, could you actually fly that close to the ground and still recover?

You couldn't Billy,you blink you die. We all blink so, he's dead. Even coming in at 40ft, balls to the wall is extremely dangerous. Any driver who does/did that is most likely not flying any more

They don't invest nearly three years of training, give you the keys to a $50 million aircraft, in my case give me three lives to be responsible for, so I can act like an idiot

[Wyoming]

You know Al, another member brought that same question up today. I'd like to know the answer to that as well but I suspect we won't

Exactly Dan. She is 15. Where is the parent that gives a ****?

[USNAviator]

Exactly Dan. She is 15. Where is the parent that gives a ****?

My thoughts as well Al. Internet jail bait!. Don't know how much you read about all this but it leaves a bad taste for me. Doesn't ring true, at least from the story the father is telling. I may be wrong but my gut says bilge water

[AdminAssassin]

4th MLG is the reserve logistics group. My unit is part of 4th MLG, we do comm work for them.

[R Landry]

FYI, Here's some internet scuttlebutt on enlisted pilots.

Bluejacket.com Enlisted
Naval Aviation Pilots (NAP)
USN, USMC & USCG
1916-1981

ABC DEFG HIJK LMN OPQR STU VWXYZ
Roster of known United States Navy, Marine Corps and Coast Guard enlisted pilotsNaval Aviation Pilots
The Early Years: 1916-1918
"On the first of January 1916, a class of enlisted men was formed and placed under instruction in flying. These men were selected from the Bluejackets and Marines already on duty at Pensacola or on board the North Carolina. They are making excellent progress", wrote Captain Mark L. Bristol, Director of Naval Aviation in memorandum to the Secretary of the Navy.
The first group of enlisted pilots are Navy Petty Officers, A. P. Bauer, A. A. Bressman, A. F. Dietrich, P. J. Dunlevy, F. Grompe, A. Hayes, and L. A. Walty, and Marine Corps Sergeants J. Makolin and W. E. McCaughtry. A second group began training on March 21, 1917 and includes Walter D. Bonner, Clarence A. Hawkins, Oliver F. Kilmer, Guy McLaughlin, Thomas H. Murphy, Peter Talbot, Ciochino Varini and Guy A. Walker. A. A. Bressman is in both the first and second class.
Most of the initial enlisted pilots are promoted to warrant officer, then to commissioned officer status, and designated Naval Aviators. In addition, a few enlisted men receive instruction and qualify as pilots, but do not receive any designation. Two in this category are Charles T. Briar and Carlton Palmer. With the advent of World War One, enlisted pilot training is discontinued at Pensacola.
In March 1917, a recruiting program is implemented to enlist 200 men specifically for aviation duty. The plan is to enlist 100 Landsman to train for Quartermaster (Aviation) and 100 Landsman to train for Machinist's Mate (Aviation). This first aviation rate training is in Pensacola. The bluejackets are schooled in five basic subjects and detailed to serve in ground maintenance.
The Navy's first Aeronautic Detachment leaves for France in June 1917 and is led by Lieutenant Kenneth Whiting. The detachment consists of seven officers and 122 enlisted. The unit's mission is to prepare bases and receive additional training in mechanics and flying. In the initial group are 50 Landsmen in training for Quartermaster (Aviation) and 50 Landsmen in training for Machinist's Mate (Aviation). Approximately 33 of the Quartermaster (Aviation) trainees complete flight training in France and a few in Italy. Harold H. Karr and Clarence Woods, Quartermaster (Aviation) trainees, receive both French and Italian wings.

After flying as Quartermaster (Aviation) first or second class petty officers, most are advanced to commissioned officer status. Twenty are known to remain in enlisted pilot status.

Edward J. Bamrick Charles J. Boylan D. D. Chaplin Joseph C. Cline Harold A. Elliott Paul E. Gillespie Foss M. Hardendorf Robert H. Harrell Harold H. Karr George W. Knowles

Robert E. Lee Francis E. Lovejoy Edwin Nirmaier Erlon H. Parker Walter V. Seiler F. H. Tuttle Charles E. Wardwell Mac Weddell Clarence Woods Franklin Young

The Middle Years: 1919-1940
The Bureau of Navigation decrees in October 1919, "In the future, it will be the policy of the Bureau to select a certain number of warrant officers and enlisted men for flight training and duty as pilots of large heavier-than-air craft and directional pilots of dirigibles."
The enlisted pilot designation Naval Aviation Pilot (NAP) is first used in January 1920. NAP certificate number one, dated January 22, 1920 is issued by the Bureau of Navigation to Harold H. "Kiddy" Karr, CQM (A) (NAP) USN. NAPs continue to retain their specialty rates and perform rating duties as well as fly.
Qualifications for pilot training are further elaborated. Applicants must be a chief warrant officer, warrant officer, chief petty officer, or petty officer first class. The age limit of thirty years old narrows the field as warrant officers and chief petty officers rarely achieve the required grade by that age. A clear record, high moral character and excellent physical condition are additional stipulations and the instruction states "no waivers to be granted." Later clarification details that upon completion of training the candidates are to be ordered to flying duty. Warrants are titled "Student Naval Aviators," while enlisted men are "Student Airmen" to distinguish them from the officer Naval Aviators. A Pensacola Station Notice of 06 February 1920 lists Class 1 with thirty-six enlisted men in heavier-than-air and four in lighter-than-air training.
In 1921 three NAP designations are made - seaplane, ship-plane and airship. Balloon pilots are not considered NAPs although some wear the one winged badge for a short season. The Bureau of Navigation directs all enlisted men who have been designated Naval Aviator to request the proper designation of Naval Aviation Pilot (NAP). They are authorized to continue to wear their specialty rating badge on their sleeve and Naval Aviator wings on the upper left chest.
An additional school is established at North Island, California, to increase the number of ship-plane pilots. Normal attrition keeps the number of NAPs between 100 and 130 with about two-thirds of those in fleet squadrons and the remainder in shore based squadrons. To improve the number of bluejacket pilots, Congress passes legislation requiring the ratio of enlisted pilots to officer pilots be thirty percent.
The Marine Corps offers a small number of enlisted Marines "in-the-field" instruction governed by a training syllabus issued in 1923. The Marine Corps Order authorizes those who complete the course to be designated Naval Aviation Pilots. "Any enlisted man who could qualify in practical and theoretical flying as outlined in the syllabus could be recommend for designation at once." Hence, in mid 1923, First Sergeant Benjamin F. Belcher and four Gunnery Sergeants, Neil W. Abbott, Archie Paschal, Millard T. Shepard and Peter P. Tolusciak are designated USMC NAPs one through five. Tolusciak is a former pilot in the French Army and officer in the Polish Army.
The Navy enlisted rating of Chief Aviation Pilot (CAP) is established in 1924 for those qualified in heavier-than-air craft. The rating badge for AP uses a replica of Naval Aviator wings. The Aviation Pilot First Class (AP1c) rate is added in 1927.
All enlisted flight training is discontinued in 1932 and the AP rate is discontinued in 1933. Chief and First Class APs are required to convert to technical aviation ratings or Radioman. The designation NAP added after the rating is again used to note enlisted pilot status. With World War Two, the Aviation Pilot (AP) rating is re-established in 1942, but now includes chief petty officer through third class petty officer. With many enlisted pilots receiving officer commissions and a decline in the number of enlisted pilots, the AP3c is soon discontinued. Student pilots are advanced to AP2c upon graduation of flight training.
The enlisted pilot attrition rate during training in the 1920's and early 1930's is problematic. In 1927 a study recommends that potential NAPs be high school graduates, in aviation ratings, be on at least their second enlistment and meet the same age requirement of the officer pilot candidate program. Some qualified fleet sailors are sent to elimination training to better improve the pass rate, while others are sent directly from the fleet to pilot training. A more radical recommendation involves sending volunteers straight from initial recruit training to ten weeks of elimination training. The goal is ten recruits per week qualified to enter pilot training. The boot camp to pilot program is approved in January 1929.
One of the amusing stories from the recruit to pilot program involves George W. Webber Seaman 2c (NAP). In the first class of recruits to graduate from the program, Webber is ordered to VS-3 aboard the USS Lexington for duty involving flying. Berthing space is scarce and Webber is assigned a cot on deck. Each squadron is required to supply messcooks to assist the ship's cooks in the galley. VS-3 being short of non-rated men sends their newest Seaman 2c to messcooking duty. Webber does his galley duty, flies with his squadron off the carrier, and spends nights on his cot on deck. Webber's messdeck shipmates are concerned that he is impersonating a pilot and advise him he will be in big trouble if caught wearing aviator wings. Webber invites his fellow messcooks topside to observe one of his flights and put their concerns to rest. When the Lexington's Commanding Officer, Capt E. J. King, (later Admiral), learns that one of his carrier pilots is messcooking, Webber's mess duties quickly end. Commander Webber retires in 1959.
The Navy finds the thirty percent enlisted pilots requirement difficult to maintain and recommendation is made to Congress to decrease the number of NAPs from thirty percent to twenty percent. Congress legislates the change in 1932. With a lowered percentage requirement, the economic depression, and a Navy's economy drive, all NAP training ceases from 1932 to 1936. A trickle of bluejackets are added to the training pipeline from 1936 on to maintain the twenty percent level.
The Late Years: 1941-1981
With the build up of forces immediately preceding World War Two the number of NAPs increases in proportion to commissioned pilots. The requirement for more officers finds a ready source in the NAP community and an increasing number of NAPs are commissioned as Naval Aviator. During World War Two, commissioning of enlisted pilots continues with estimates that ninety-five percent of the NAPs are given temporary officer commissions during their military career. A number of commissions are made permanent with completion of college education programs.

The assignment of NAPs to duties other than piloting aircraft is not limited to Navy messcooking. In the early days of the 1942 battle for Guadalcanal Marine Air Group 14, sorely in need of combat pilots, found they were missing two NAP sergeants in their forward deployment. A search of the records reveals that Sergeants Ollie Michael (left) and Rohe C. Jones (right) have been ordered to latrine digging duties on New Caledonia. The two leathernecks are hastily cut orders back to their squadron and pilot Douglas SBDs in the fierce contest for possession of the Solomons. Jones is killed during his third combat tour. Michael is credited with sinking three Japanese ships in November and December 1942. (Photo by Perry N. Colby, Nov 42. NNAM)
In flight operations, while airborne, experience dictates the position of enlisted pilots. A bluejacket pilot of a single pilot aircraft may lead a section and have an officer flying in his section. In multi-engine aircraft it is not uncommon for an enlisted pilot to be plane commander with a less experienced officer in the right seat. On the ground, the normal officer and enlisted status resume.
The Enlisted Flight Training Program is cut following World War Two. A few enlisted pilots receive training after the war, but in 1948 Congress ends the requirement for enlisted aviators. Whereas, some hold 1948 as the termination of the NAP program, in fact many enlisted pilots continue their careers in the Navy, Marine Corps and Coast Guard in the following decades. With the reduction in forces, temporary officer commissions are relinquished and a number of NAPs returned to their permanent enlisted status.
When the Korean War began in June 1950, the Marine Corps has 255 NAPs. By the ceasefire in July 1953 the number of NAPs in the Corps had dropped to 137. At the advent of Vietnam in 1964 the number of NAPs in Marine aviation is 27. The last four U.S. Marine Corps enlisted pilots, Master Gunnery Sergeants Joseph A. Conroy, Leslie T. Ericson, Robert M. Lurie and Patrick J. O'Neil, simultaneously retire on February 1, 1973.
The Coast Guard's unofficial roster lists 216 NAPs. All but 37 are trained during the forty-four months of World War Two. ADCM John P. Greathouse, the last Coast Guard enlisted pilot, retires in 1979.
In 1955 the number of non commissioned Navy pilots in flight status hovers around 300. Retirements coupled with advancements into Limited Duty Officer status continually cut into the number of bluejacket aviators. The last enlisted pilot on active duty is ACCM Robert K. "NAP" Jones, who retires from the Navy on January 31, 1981.

Sources:
(1) The Silver Eagles Association (SEA). LCDR Robert Buchal, USN (Ret), sentinel of the SEA files, undated and provided the NAP roster.
(2) TheNational Naval Aviation Museum (NNAM), NAS Pensacola, Florida. NNAM archives hold SEA records including a limited number of biographical questionnaires submitted to the SEA by NAPs.
(3) Naval Aviation News (see in particular NAN, September 1967)
(4) United States Naval Aviation 1910-1995, Roy Gossnick

[EGA1957]

While still at PI (Aug., '57), 6 members of my platoon who had scored above a certain score on all our written tests were asked if they wanted to apply for NavCad, but 4 declined and the other two were disqualified for vision issues (though corrected to 20/20 with glasses).

So at least in the late 50's, presumably a boot could be considered for flight school.

It would have been really interesting if one of the four had taken up the offer, just to see what enlisted rank they would have reverted to, especially with the "With the reduction in forces, temporary officer commissions are relinquished and a number of NAPs returned to their permanent enlisted status" provision since that person would have been a Private E-1 when he entered the NavCad program.

[ohyes]

http://theschweitzerstrollminors.blogspot.com/

[ohyes]

Here is what this marine does when he is not being a marine



http://theschweitzerstrollminors.blo...kersfield.html