Has any Marine here ever been cursed with a Plt. Cmdr. like 2ndLt. Wolfe?

[Protoman2050]

Has any Marine here ever been cursed w/ a Plt. Cmdr. like 2ndLt. Wolfe in "Platoon"? Conversely, have you ever been blessed w/ a Plt. Cmdr. --a 2ndLt., of course-- that was so excellent at his job, you'd follow him through Hell and back?

Do you think I'd be the former, or the latter?

[Echo_Four_Bravo]

I never had a 2nd Lt. platoon commander. Always a 1st Lt, even a Capt. for a short period of time. I had a great Lt. and a pretty bad Lt. and one that was somewhere in the middle.

As for you, it is impossible to tell. You have a lot of growing up to do before it is really an issue.

[Phantom Blooper]

Where do you get your questions from? Do you sit around and think of something to ask?:evilgrin:

[Protoman2050]

Where do you get your questions from? Do you sit around and think of something to ask?:evilgrin:

Yes. I've got nothing of interest to do, since I'm waiting for my exam results that'll let me enroll in community college; I should be getting them on the 21st. Until then, nothing but free time.

[Protoman2050]

I never had a 2nd Lt. platoon commander. Always a 1st Lt, even a Capt. for a short period of time. I had a great Lt. and a pretty bad Lt. and one that was somewhere in the middle.

As for you, it is impossible to tell. You have a lot of growing up to do before it is really an issue.

What were the great Lt., and the bad Lt. like? What did the former do that made him so great, and what did the latter do that made him so bad?

And that was kinda the answer I expected.

[Big Jim]

if You Want To Be A Marine, First Go And Talk To A Recruiter And Then Ask These Questions That Will Be Pertinent To Your Future Because, Right Now, All Of This Discussion With You Is Just Academic. I Want To Help You If You Have A need To Know...not If You Have A Need To Be Entertained. Come Back And Ask Questions When You Have A Ship Out Date!!

[Protoman2050]

if You Want To Be A Marine, First Go And Talk To A Recruiter And Then Ask These Questions That Will Be Pertinent To Your Future Because, Right Now, All Of This Discussion With You Is Just Academic. I Want To Help You If You Have A need To Know...not If You Have A Need To Be Entertained. Come Back And Ask Questions When You Have A Ship Out Date!!

SIRYESSIR!!!!!!

[sgttaz1965]

Can't say I was cursed with a bad one. Had several platoon commanders most of which were 1stLt's. The most exceptional platoon commander I remember was a 2ndLt who just reported aboard Camp Pendleton just after I did, he was my first. The kicker was he was a Reservist. He was of a group of officers who would do their mandatory 3-4 years active duty then accept their Reserve commissions. When I mean exceptional he earned the respect of all the enlisted Marines as well as the active duty officers. He had alot talent. The higher ups were sad to see him go play Marine only on the weekends.



There is an old saying I was told about that has been passed down for many years....good lieutenants are rare, good sergeants are priceless. He was one of the rare ones.:flag: :thumbup:

[thewookie]

Where do you get your questions from? Do you sit around and think of something to ask?:evilgrin:

Classic, I just spit my drink onto my computer screen after seeing that one.

[Protoman2050]

Classic, I just spit my drink onto my computer screen after seeing that one.
ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!

[Protoman2050]

Can't say I was cursed with a bad one. Had several platoon commanders most of which were 1stLt's. The most exceptional platoon commander I remember was a 2ndLt who just reported aboard Camp Pendleton just after I did, he was my first. The kicker was he was a Reservist. He was of a group of officers who would do their mandatory 3-4 years active duty then accept their Reserve commissions. When I mean exceptional he earned the respect of all the enlisted Marines as well as the active duty officers. He had alot talent. The higher ups were sad to see him go play Marine only on the weekends.



There is an old saying I was told about that has been passed down for many years....good lieutenants are rare, good sergeants are priceless. He was one of the rare ones.:flag: :thumbup:

I hope I mature into tht 2ndLt.!!!

[BR34]

Yes. I've got nothing of interest to do, since I'm waiting for my exam results that'll let me enroll in community college; I should be getting them on the 21st. Until then, nothing but free time.

Free time for a wannabe should be spent PT'ing.

[Protoman2050]

Free time for a wannabe should be spent PT'ing.

Good advice. I do my PT before bed, b/c then I'm tired enough to sleep.

[Echo_Four_Bravo]

You could always do more PT. As for what made the bad Lt. bad, it isn't something I wish to talk about in a public forum. I have a great deal of respect for Marines, and I don't wish to speak poorly of any of them in public.

The great Lt. was a female. She was simply amazing. She was the one person we all knew we could trust. She could run us into the ground and keep running. She went out of her way to understand the technical aspects of our job, even though that wasn't her job. And, she would stand up for her Marines, even if it would cause problems for her. There are few people I would follow without question, she is one of them.

[Protoman2050]

You could always do more PT. As for what made the bad Lt. bad, it isn't something I wish to talk about in a public forum. I have a great deal of respect for Marines, and I don't wish to speak poorly of any of them in public.

The great Lt. was a female. She was simply amazing. She was the one person we all knew we could trust. She could run us into the ground and keep running. She went out of her way to understand the technical aspects of our job, even though that wasn't her job. And, she would stand up for her Marines, even if it would cause problems for her. There are few people I would follow without question, she is one of them.

What happened to her? Is she now a Captain or Major? What was you guys' job? I now idolize her.

But isn't running something into the ground A BAD THING; please elaborate?

[Quinbo]

I think what E4B meant was that on PT runs she could run way beyond many under her's personal limits of endurance.

Proto in the future I recommend you come up with questions that don't involve an actor playing the role of Army Lt. in a war movie. He was an actor get it? Not the real deal. His character was written to be terrible.

I can recall two 1st Lieutenants that stand out in my mind as being well above their peers in knowlege, leadership, and experience. Both were mustangs.

[Protoman2050]

I think what E4B meant was that on PT runs she could run way beyond many under her's personal limits of endurance.

Proto in the future I recommend you come up with questions that don't involve an actor playing the role of Army Lt. in a war movie. He was an actor get it? Not the real deal. His character was written to be terrible.

I can recall two 1st Lieutenants that stand out in my mind as being well above their peers in knowlege, leadership, and experience. Both were mustangs.

Ah, thanks. But why was the average lifespan of a 2ndLt. in Veitnam 4 days? In every fiction, there's a little truth.

[HardJedi]

I had a HORRIBLE 2nd lt platoon commander. most of my platoon commanders WERE 1st lt.s though.

this guy, fresh out of VMI would not listen to ANYONE about the way things should be done. he wouldn't listen to Staff NCO's with 16 years in. he thought he knew it all. He got alot of people hurt with his screwed up way of doing things, so we fixed his little wagon, and got him in big trouble. he was then deemed unpromotable and was finished.

[Protoman2050]

I had a HORRIBLE 2nd lt platoon commander. most of my platoon commanders WERE 1st lt.s though.

this guy, fresh out of VMI would not listen to ANYONE about the way things should be done. he wouldn't listen to Staff NCO's with 16 years in. he thought he knew it all. He got alot of people hurt with his screwed up way of doing things, so we fixed his little wagon, and got him in big trouble. he was then deemed unpromotable and was finished.

How do you think he got commissioned? Shouldn't he have been kicked out during TBS?

[Zulu 36]

How do you think he got commissioned? Shouldn't he have been kicked out during TBS?
Here's a thought: He might have played the party line during TBS, but thinking all the while, "This is ****. I'll do it my way when I get to the fleet."

OK, he did, and his troops screwed him. He found out his way didn't work and the Marine Corps wasn't going to change just for him.

Most 2d Lt's I knew had been told by the CO to run everything past their platoon sergeants first before announcing decisions. Not to lose face, but to save face by learning from the greater knowledge and experience the platoon sergeant has. Teaching 2d Lt's their job is one of the main jobs of a platoon sergeant. Woe to the 2d Lt who does not accept this.

[Echo_Four_Bravo]

I don't know what happened to her. Last I heard she was a Major. I would assume she is probably a Lt. Col or Col. now unless she left the Marine Corps.

And by running into the ground I mean she could take the platoon on a run that would kill us. She could make the entire platoon drop out if she felt the need. Often, when she was done running us, she would go on her own run. Her physical fitness was far beyond any other Marine in our platoon.

My job was multi-channel radio. To save time, it is just a communications job that deals with large and complex radio systems.

[Protoman2050]

Here's a thought: He might have played the party line during TBS, but thinking all the while, "This is ****. I'll do it my way when I get to the fleet."

OK, he did, and his troops screwed him. He found out his way didn't work and the Marine Corps wasn't going to change just for him.

Most 2d Lt's I knew had been told by the CO to run everything past their platoon sergeants first before announcing decisions. Not to lose face, but to save face by learning from the greater knowledge and experience the platoon sergeant has. Teaching 2d Lt's their job is one of the main jobs of a platoon sergeant. Woe to the 2d Lt who does not accept this.

Yeah, I'd make sure to run ALL my decisions and plans, esp. tactical and strategic ones, past my Master Gunny before making my orders.

If I was that 2ndLt.'s commander, I'd summary court-martial him for conduct unbecoming an officer and a gentleman.

[HardJedi]

No need to go all the way up to a Master Guns for advice. just stick with your platoon Staff Sgt. :yes:

[Protoman2050]

No need to go all the way up to a Master Guns for advice. just stick with your platoon Staff Sgt. :yes:

Then I'd run it past both. Good to get at least three guys making decisions. Hopefully I won't turn into the reverse of that 2ndLt....command by committee ;-)

And what of summary court-martialing that idiot 2ndLt.?

[RYDERKUR]

Protoman, no offense and with all respect, but all this about what you're "going to do" is a little ridiculous. Anybody can sit there and play this game of what they're are going to do when they're a commander of Marines, but until you earn the title and position please, just ask pertinent questions and absorb information from many of these fine Marines. Best of luck in all of your endeavors.

[Protoman2050]

Protoman, no offense and with all respect, but all this about what you're "going to do" is a little ridiculous. Anybody can sit there and play this game of what they're are going to do when they're a commander of Marines, but until you earn the title and position please, just ask pertinent questions and absorb information from many of these fine Marines. Best of luck in all of your endeavors.

None taken. At all. At least you Marines are honest and says things to my face. I respect you for that. I'm just an oddball that wants to excessively plan things out. And you're not the first one to have said that. Thanks.

[Echo_Four_Bravo]

It isn't as if every platoon has a Master Guns. I think I knew 2 in all my time in the Marine Corps. As a 2nd Lt. you'd probably be better off not trying to talk to one anyway. Just stick with the Platoon Sgt. and everything would be fine.

However, he is right. Until you're in a position to actually lead Marines, worrying about how to do so is a little silly.

[Protoman2050]

It isn't as if every platoon has a Master Guns. I think I knew 2 in all my time in the Marine Corps. As a 2nd Lt. you'd probably be better off not trying to talk to one anyway. Just stick with the Platoon Sgt. and everything would be fine.

However, he is right. Until you're in a position to actually lead Marines, worrying about how to do so is a little silly.

I know. But it could be useful in other secnarios, like if I were a manager of some engineers at a corporation, and I had no idea what to do.

[Protoman2050]

It isn't as if every platoon has a Master Guns. I think I knew 2 in all my time in the Marine Corps. As a 2nd Lt. you'd probably be better off not trying to talk to one anyway. Just stick with the Platoon Sgt. and everything would be fine.

However, he is right. Until you're in a position to actually lead Marines, worrying about how to do so is a little silly.

And what do you mean "I'd be better off not trying to talk to a Master Gunny"? What would he do to me?

[SlingerDun]

Has any Marine here ever been cursed w/ a Plt. Cmdr. like 2ndLt. Wolfe in "Platoon"?Nope but one of my ex-brothers in law may have been that guy. He was a 90 day Army wonder with Americal Division 1969. He lost alot of men in his command to the point his platoon was declared unfunctional and absorbed into the rest of the company. He did make 1stLt but resigned his commission as soon as he could and his hair was snow white in his early thirties.

--->Dave

[Protoman2050]

Nope but one of my ex-brothers in law may have been that guy. He was a 90 day Army wonder with Americal Division 1969. He lost alot of men in his command to the point his platoon was declared unfunctional and absorbed into the rest of the company. He did make 1stLt but resigned his commission as soon as he could and his hair was snow white in his early thirties.

--->Dave

What does "absorbed into the rest of the company" mean?

[grampsdw251]

What does "absorbed into the rest of the company" mean?

They eat YOU, 'cause they ran out of food, 'cause the 2ndLt.placed the rations order to arrive where he WAS, instead of where he planned to BE on that crucial day, 'cause he didn't know WHERE he was gonna BE, 'Cause he never talked to the Plt.Sgt. about WHERE he was in the first damn place,'cause he was busy trying to get..........
The BEST way to learn to LEAD one, is to BE one....Dare ya.

[HardJedi]

if a 2nd Lt hassals a Master Guns about stuff, he'll more than likely just say " sir, go ask your platoon Sgt." Master guns are not platoon level Staf NCO's

[Protoman2050]

if a 2nd Lt hassals a Master Guns about stuff, he'll more than likely just say " sir, go ask your platoon Sgt." Master guns are not platoon level Staf NCO's

Ah.

[Quinbo]

I've seen more than one 22 year old second Lt call a 50 year old Master Guns sir then beat feet out of his office. ;)

[chili77bowl]

Goes back to the old Marine Corps Legend about the Master Guns that was standing outside the PX and a 2nd LT walked by and asked "Master Guns, don't I rate a salute?" and the Master Guns replies "Sure do sir, just climb up my service strips, over my rockers and get it."

[Zulu 36]

Then I'd run it past both. Good to get at least three guys making decisions. Hopefully I won't turn into the reverse of that 2ndLt....command by committee ;-)


Whether you have contact with a Master Gunnery Sergeant on a regular basis will depend heavily on your MOS and unit of assignment. As an infantry officer, the only MGySgts around would, maybe, be at battalion level. Woe betide you if, as a 2d Lt, you jumped up to BnHQ with platoon level stuff.

Your platoon sergeant would eat your ass, then your company commander, XO, and First Sergeant would eat your ass - IF the Master Guns left anything for them to chew. Hope the Battalion Sergeant Major wasn't around the Master Gun's office, because he'd have a go as well. :evilgrin:

If your platoon sergeant isn't sure how to help you, he will go to the company gunny for advice and get back to you. If your platoon sergeant isn't available, you would go to the company XO for advice (or perhaps a 1stLt fellow platoon leader). But it better be for advice on a subject beyond the knowledge and authority expected of a 2d Lt (except for quizzing your platoon sergeant - that's what he is there for).

Remember too, Master Guns are specialists in their MOS field. Very few, if any, are in infantry. Most E-9s in infantry units are sergeants major (only at battalion, regiment, division). You will never find one at infantry company level, except when he's visiting for some sort of inspection or having coffee with his old friend, the First Sergeant.

As a 2d Lt, follow a piece of advice often given junior enlisted Marines: Stay out of the head shed and far away from any E-9s.

Also, remember the difference between a 2d Lt and a PFC: A PFC has been promoted once. :marine:

[Protoman2050]

Whether you have contact with a Master Gunnery Sergeant on a regular basis will depend heavily on your MOS and unit of assignment. As an infantry officer, the only MGySgts around would, maybe, be at battalion level. Woe betide you if, as a 2d Lt, you jumped up to BnHQ with platoon level stuff.

Your platoon sergeant would eat your ass, then your company commander, XO, and First Sergeant would eat your ass - IF the Master Guns left anything for them to chew. Hope the Battalion Sergeant Major wasn't around the Master Gun's office, because he'd have a go as well. :evilgrin:

If your platoon sergeant isn't sure how to help you, he will go to the company gunny for advice and get back to you. If your platoon sergeant isn't available, you would go to the company XO for advice (or perhaps a 1stLt fellow platoon leader). But it better be for advice on a subject beyond the knowledge and authority expected of a 2d Lt (except for quizzing your platoon sergeant - that's what he is there for).

Remember too, Master Guns are specialists in their MOS field. Very few, if any, are in infantry. Most E-9s in infantry units are sergeants major (only at battalion, regiment, division). You will never find one at infantry company level, except when he's visiting for some sort of inspection or having coffee with his old friend, the First Sergeant.

As a 2d Lt, follow a piece of advice often given junior enlisted Marines: Stay out of the head shed and far away from any E-9s.

Also, remember the difference between a 2d Lt and a PFC: A PFC has been promoted once. :marine:

Great advice, but what's the last line supposed to mean...Pvt to Pfc is pretty much automatic; 2ndLt to 1stLt requires some competition.

[Zulu 36]

Great advice, but what's the last line supposed to mean...Pvt to Pfc is pretty much automatic; 2ndLt to 1stLt requires some competition.

So is the promotion to 1st Lt, it just takes longer. Of course, a private or 2d Lt could really screw up and not see their first promotion.

The meaning behind the saying is this: A PFC has been promoted once, the 2d Lt has not been promoted at all. Thus in the greater scheme of things enlisted, the PFC has at least managed to get promoted, but the 2dLt has not. It's a diss on 2dLts.

[Protoman2050]

So is the promotion to 1st Lt, it just takes longer. Of course, a private or 2d Lt could really screw up and not see their first promotion.

The meaning behind the saying is this: A PFC has been promoted once, the 2d Lt has not been promoted at all. Thus in the greater scheme of things enlisted, the PFC has at least managed to get promoted, but the 2dLt has not. It's a diss on 2dLts.

Ah...but isn't making Pfc easier then making 1stLt?

[Zulu 36]

Ah...but isn't making Pfc easier then making 1stLt?

I sent you a PM.

[Protoman2050]

I sent you a PM.

Received. And responded to.

[FistFu68]

:evilgrin: WHY DO YOU THINK FRAGGING WAS INVENTED??? :evilgrin:

[Protoman2050]

:evilgrin: WHY DO YOU THINK FRAGGING WAS INVENTED??? :evilgrin:

And this responds to...?

If I was a Company Commander, and a 2ndLt. of one of my platoons was making life Hell on earth for my Marines, I'd summary court-martial him and ask for the maximum sentence --30 days in the Marine Corps Brig w/ hard labor --I'd also ask for that 2ndLt. to be placed in Special Quarters 2--, is it? What is "hard labor"; stupid question, I know--. If that doesn't work, special court-martial and ask that that 2ndLt. be given a Big Chicken Dinner. Or just have him "disappear" in the night.

[Wyoming]

.

This kid acts like this is his own private chat room.

Jeez!!

[Protoman2050]

.

This kid acts like this is his own private chat room.

Jeez!!

Okay then, I'll stop, Corporal, sir. Tell me what I'm doing wrong so that I may remedy it, sir.

[Zulu 36]

Okay then, I'll stop, Corporal, sir. Tell me what I'm doing wrong so that I may remedy it, sir.
Proto,

We discussed this in the PM. You know not of what you speak, so keep opinions like this to yourself. A court martial is a criminal trial, not some place to publicly spank a lieutenant who doesn't listen to his NCOs. There are other ways to take care of that kind of problem.

No, Fist, not necessarily fragging. ;)

[Protoman2050]

Proto,

We discussed this in the PM. You know not of what you speak, so keep opinions like this to yourself. A court martial is a criminal trial, not some place to publicly spank a lieutenant who doesn't listen to his NCOs. There are other ways to take care of that kind of problem.

No, Fist, not necessarily fragging. ;)
I'll try my best to keep my mouth shut, then.

[Echo_Four_Bravo]

I really think you should keep your mouth shut about what you think you would do until you understand what it is you're talking about. You don't know enough about the Marine Corps, the UCMJ, or life in general to even make a guess as to what the proper course of action would be in any situation.

[Isrowei]

And this responds to...?

If I was a Company Commander, and a 2ndLt. of one of my platoons was making life Hell on earth for my Marines, I'd summary court-martial him and ask for the maximum sentence --30 days in the Marine Corps Brig w/ hard labor --I'd also ask for that 2ndLt. to be placed in Special Quarters 2--, is it? What is "hard labor"; stupid question, I know--. If that doesn't work, special court-martial and ask that that 2ndLt. be given a Big Chicken Dinner. Or just have him "disappear" in the night.

I hope for your sake and the sake of the Corps that you do not become an officer.

You're living in a dream world of imagination about what you would do or not do... 10 years in the future. This isn't a game or a movie and things don't work like that.

Marines, things that we talk about over a beer or in the confidence of other Marines have no place being posted here to bolster the whims of a child. Plenty of legends exist about "fragging" and "friendly fire" but whatever the case may be, it doesn't belong here. If you want to discuss, I'd be happy to in PMs.

We have a responsibility to represent the Marine Corps. That includes the PFCs, LCpls, and even the 2ndLts. Remember that even though a child is prompting this... young impressionable Marines are also reading it. What example are YOU setting for them?

Protoman, you are not officer material. You are not even Marine material at this point. Maybe in a few years you will be, but not now. Go experience some life. Grow up. Then go talk to a recruiter.

[Big Jim]

g**d*** Right!

[Phantom Blooper]

I still say.....like I told you in another post you need to do some chores,study for the next exam,get a job,go run PT,get laid or do something productive.Questions are great,but this is getting ridiculous! The Marine Corps isn't and never has been movies. If I came out of retirement and you were my platoon commander I would turn off my hearing aids! :evilgrin:

[rvillac2]

Time to lock it up, mods. What is that, 4 of this kid's posts locked up?

He likes to hear himself talk. I also think that the depth of his knowledge is a product of google and some bad movies.

A fine candidate for snipe hunting.

[Camper51]

I hope for your sake and the sake of the Corps that you do not become an officer.

You're living in a dream world of imagination about what you would do or not do... 10 years in the future. This isn't a game or a movie and things don't work like that.

Marines, things that we talk about over a beer or in the confidence of other Marines have no place being posted here to bolster the whims of a child. Plenty of legends exist about "fragging" and "friendly fire" but whatever the case may be, it doesn't belong here. If you want to discuss, I'd be happy to in PMs.

We have a responsibility to represent the Marine Corps. That includes the PFCs, LCpls, and even the 2ndLts. Remember that even though a child is prompting this... young impressionable Marines are also reading it. What example are YOU setting for them?

Protoman, you are not officer material. You are not even Marine material at this point. Maybe in a few years you will be, but not now. Go experience some life. Grow up. Then go talk to a recruiter.

My feelings exactly....

Speak NOT of that which you know absolutely nothing.

It is better to be silent and thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt...

I think you are a know it all..........and it shows

[Protoman2050]

My feelings exactly....

Speak NOT of that which you know absolutely nothing.

It is better to be silent and thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt...

I think you are a know it all..........and it shows

You're all right. I get *very* full of myself...many times. I'm sorry. I definitely wouldn't cut it as a Marine...or in the Armed Forces at all. Thank you for showing me my own reflection...my countenence is horribly marred and dirty, and I must remedy my many defects. I'd rather be rejectd for a job I can't do, rather than attempt to do a job which I cannot, and fail miserably at it. Maybe in 6-8 years I'll be ready...maybe I won't. Thank you...

[Big Jim]

finally...some Peace!

[Achped]

Ugh, this thread kinda made me feel sick...