War In Iraq

[Born2Kill]

Yeah so my parents and I have been having some battles on some things. like...

Who agrees that George W. Bush is doing a good job and reasons?
They dont agree at all, they think hes an ******* etc, I agree that hes a good guy.

They also think that every soldier in Iraq is dieing which is stupidity.

So pretty much, they're completly against the military, they told me to join the navy and be a squid, I told them I wanna fight for my country, not sit on a boat.

They've also gotton most of they're information from Farenheight 9/11, which I do not believe a thing in that movie.

What do you guys think I should do to get my parents to agree with me to join the corps?

John

[Tallboot]

Im my opinion .. if you beleive going to war with Afganistahn and Iraq is wrong .. then your saying you like 9/11 and you want more airplanes in our biuldings and them to attack us .. because thats what will happen. Movies are usually just a view of the producer trying to make a statement. I would tell your mom thats what you want to do (if you want to) you dont need parent permission to sign the dotted line .. Also i would tell them about the benifits after bootcamp. Bush is a good president .. maybe not the smartest .. but he made the right decisions at the right time. We have beenattacked by terrorists mulitple times since G bushes father was president. anyway hope my advice helps

[cgkades]

just a small correction... soldiers are army. Marines are Marines.

i'll leave my opinions out of this.

if you want to join, then give your parents the facts, and talk to a recruiter (they can talk to them as well). do some research about who actually is dieing out there. though every Marine IS a rifleman first, not all of us are shooting and being shot at. you cannot force your parents to agree with you, you MIGHT be able to convince them. and if you cant........ it's your life isnt it? if you do not follow your heart in life, you will hate your life and be resentfull and hatefull. choose carefully, but choose what you believe is best for you, your parents can give you guidence but cannot make you happy, and in the end that is what matters

[PooleeNGN]

dude i agree with tallboot. bush might not be the brightest president but he is th only one that didnt push the snooze button like every other president since 89. true Marines and Soldiers are dying but in the end they will be celebrated for what they have given up. people didnt believe in the vietnam war but now almost everyone is honoring those soldiers and Marines, im pretty sure. if not, well what good are we if we are attacked *again* and dont do anything about it. Marines arent called heros bc of what they or who they are. They are called heros bc of what they have done.

[Brooklyn]

Im my opinion .. if you beleive going to war with Afganistahn and Iraq is wrong .. then your saying you like 9/11 and you want more airplanes in our biuldings and them to attack us.

What are you talking about? What did Iraq have to do with 9/11? Fact of the matter is, there are more terror attacks within Iraq now then there were before we got there. Another fact, Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11. Another fact, Iraq had no capabilities to attack the U.S. Another fact, no WMDs were ever found, and G.W. has since called the search for them off.


Marines and Soldiers are dying but in the end they will be celebrated for what they have given up



This is true. They will be honored for their sacrifices.



people didnt believe in the vietnam war but now almost everyone is honoring those soldiers and Marines


Honoring the soldiers and Marines doesn't give any validation to the war itself. It means that people have opened their eyes and realized the sacrifices those men and women made to serve this country, regardless of what they felt of the war.

I haven't talked with, or read about, or seen on t.v. many people, vet or not that actually agreed that the Vietnam War was a worthy cause, especially considering the politicians refused to allow the U.S. to actually decimate the N.V. AND they made the vets pull out and give up the country that over 50K American men died protecting.

[yellowwing]

Another fact is our love for the Corps. That has been true for 230 years. There will always be a small percentage of us that are willing to do what it takes, no matter what, to be United States Marines.

In 2008, it won't matter if a Genghis Khan type or a complete wussy is elected. The President will always send in the Marines. And we'll be there.

[Brooklyn]

Another fact is our love for the Corps. That has been true for 230 years. There will always be a small percentage of us that are willing to do what it takes, no matter what, to be United States Marines.

In 2008, it won't matter if a Genghis Khan type or a complete wussy is elected. The President will always send in the Marines. And we'll be there.

Absolutely! No matter if I agree with whatever conflict we may face or not, I will follow my orders and get whatever the job may be done.

[DuckSauce]

I stand behind my commander in chief, do you want to fight on your own soil, in your own houses, or do you want strike fear into the heart of your enemy in his own backyard?

[Brooklyn]

I stand behind my commander in chief, do you want to fight on your own soil, in your own houses, or do you want strike fear into the heart of your enemy in his own backyard?

What means did Saddam have to attack us "on our own soil"?

[The Sandman]

well as far as Iraq's involvment in terror it was confirmed that the anthrax came from Iraq. Now, most likely, this was given to the terrorist and Iraq had no direct role. That being said in the U.S. thats called aiding in the commision of a crime. Not to mention he killed countless of his own people. Why is it ok to go into Kosovo and Bosnia/Herzigovina but not Iraq. On top of all this saddam hussein has a history of being outspoken about the "destruction of Israel and the United States of America." Finally let us not forget that all he had to do to avoid war was give unfettered access of all facilities to U.N. weapons inspectors which he refused to do for 11 years.

[Brooklyn]

well as far as Iraq's involvment in terror it was confirmed that the anthrax came from Iraq. Now, most likely, this was given to the terrorist and Iraq had no direct role. That being said in the U.S. thats called aiding in the commision of a crime. Not to mention he killed countless of his own people. Why is it ok to go into Kosovo and Bosnia/Herzigovina but not Iraq. On top of all this saddam hussein has a history of being outspoken about the "destruction of Israel and the United States of America." Finally let us not forget that all he had to do to avoid war was give unfettered access of all facilities to U.N. weapons inspectors which he refused to do for 11 years.

When was it confirmed that anthrax came from Iraq? I think you may have imagined that. But let's say, for the sake of argument that it's true. You say Iraq didn't have anything to do with it, yet they aided in a crime because it was in their possession first? Well, let me ask you, where do you think Iraq got their chem/bio weapons from in the first place?

Yes, he killed his own people. But are we there resurrecting them? Lots of heads of state are outspoken about our destruction. That doesn't mean they have the means to act on it. It's words. If we were to attack every country that ever said "mean words" towards us we'd all be drafted and dead by now.

U.N. Inspectors were actually in Iraq in the time leading up to the war. He gave in to G.W.'s request. He even provided those thousands of documents the U.N. asked for the day of the deadline. The U.S. advised the U.N. Inspectors to get out of the country because an attack was imminent, because Iraq had failed to provide info. on what it did with the weapons it already had.

G.W. told Saddam to get out of the country or go to war. So, if it were about WMDs why was Bush willing to halt the invasion if Saddam would leave the country? The weapons would still be there, Bush just wanted his arch nemesis gone.

I've said to much. Believe whatever FOX News tells ya. This is one discussion I refuse to get further into. on this site.

[DuckSauce]

What means did Saddam have to attack us "on our own soil"?

I was only speaking hypothetically...and I didn't necessarily mean just Saddam.

[Smalcom]

there are al-quaeda in Iraq... its a terrorist breeding ground now... so brooklyn it is a ligitament war, we havent been attacked again on US soil since the Wars started, its not all about the US, its about helping people who need it... think as a person of the world ... not just as a citizen of America, make other peoples lives better not just Americans.

[Lithium]

While I might not agree with everything Bush says or does, I do agree with the war in Afghanistan. In my opinion, Iraq didnt do anything to provoke our invasion. In no way am I saying the Saddam was a good leader and In no way am I saying I support Al Quaeda, But whether or not I disagree with the war is another story. I dont agree with the politics, but I will serve my country.

I dont like this thread...it is just going to get people's blood boiling and p**s people off.

[Brooklyn]

there are al-quaeda in Iraq... its a terrorist breeding ground now...

The key word in that post is "now". It wasn't a "terrorist breeding ground" before we invaded. It was just Saddam's personal playground, which in no way shape or form effected the National Security of this country. But as you said, NOW it's a terrorist breeding ground.

Before anyone says it, I'll stress to you that Saddam didn't tolerate Al-Queda or any other terrorists groups in Iraq. They were viewed as a threat to his power and as we know, anyone viewed as such were swiftly dealt with.


its not all about the US,

That's very naive of you, it is all about the U.S. The U.S. Gvt. doesn't spend billions to help people unless it will also help the U.S. Gvt. It is ALWAYS about the U.S. There ain't a war we have ever fought that hasn't been about us in one way or another.


its about helping people who need it

There are countless genocides that have and are going on worldwide, as well as cruel leaders of foreign nations. The U.S. Gvt. turns a blind eye to them repeatedly...why? Because there is nothing for the U.S. to gain by stopping them.


Okay, I'm done again.

[Lithium]

see thats why i dont like this thread and I think it should be deleted.

[yellowwing]

Its just another phase of a war that has been going on for awhile. Its just hotter now. Cruise missiles and smart bombs only work short term. Sooner or later you need boots on the ground somewhere.

I think when your enlistment is up, it still will be going on. And we'll still answer the call and obey whoever is in office.

[Smalcom]

after Somalia BROOKLYN, the clinton admin. promised never to interevene in African foreign affairs.... study up a bit and get back to me...

why do you want to be a MARINE....

dont start attacking me, this is ligitament, Iraq was fu**ed up before we got there.... dont argue just accept that we are there... and we should go to help all our future Marine brothers if it was a mistake or not

[Brooklyn]

after Somalia BROOKLYN, the clinton admin. promised never to interevene in African foreign affairs.... study up a bit and get back to me...

why do you want to be a MARINE....

dont start attacking me, this is ligitament, Iraq was fu**ed up before we got there.... dont argue just accept that we are there... and we should go to help all our future Marine brothers if it was a mistake or not

1st. Genocides aren't limited to Africa. ( thanks for capping my name, I appreciate it )

2nd. The Clinton adminstration isn't in office anymore.

3rd. I have various reasons for wanting to be a Marine, but I don't feel the need to justify myself to you, especially now that you are upset, for whatever reason.

4th. I didn't attack you. Didn't even come close to attacking you. Toughen up.

5th. I never said we shouldn't "help our future Marine brothers".

Loosing control of your emotions is a sign of weakness. Try to maintain, will ya?

[Lithium]

Somebody please delete this thread so there isnt anymore bickering...

[cgkades]

Somebody please delete this thread so there isnt anymore bickering...

lol

[HopefulGrunt2Be]

Diddo

[Smalcom]

6th.... will u please continue... i love this.... would you stop this its not gonna end.... and ur and me are gonna end up going so theres no point in aruguing against it.... and beleive me im not "weak"

[Lithium]

I think you both need to settle your difference and stop fighting. You are both entitled to your opinions, keep in mind that men have fought and died so that you could be safe to have them, so dont trample on each other's

[Radiofantry]

http://sf.indymedia.org/uploads/domesticethug.jpeg

http://www.clarisita.org/media/1/0496.jpg

Y'all done?

We all have opinions on the War, and the Commander and Chief. All that is important is that we answer the call if and when it comes. Whether you are serving because you believe that everything the adminstration does is right, or because you want to do what you can to help your brother and sister Marines, all that matters is that you give it your all.

[Brooklyn]

6th.... will u please continue... i love this.... would you stop this its not gonna end.... and ur and me are gonna end up going so theres no point in aruguing against it.... and beleive me im not "weak"

To get the record straight, I wasn't debating if you're a good or a bad person. I was talking politics. Lots of times there are people that can't handle political discussions, which is why I kept trying not to say anymore. I have no problem with you.

And I didn't say you are weak, I said it's a sign of weakness, don't be so sensitive.

[Smalcom]

and please do delete this

[Brooklyn]

I think you both need to settle your difference and stop fighting. You are both entitled to your opinions, keep in mind that men have fought and died so that you could be safe to have them, so dont trample on each other's

Hey now. I never said he couldn't voice his opinion. I welcome it. I was looking forward to seeing some of the views of the diff. poolees on this topic. Didn't expect anyone to think I was attacking them though. And I'm not fighting.

[Smalcom]

BROOKLYN JESUS ... sensitive.... wtf.... JUST STOP

[Radiofantry]

http://sf.indymedia.org/uploads/domesticethug.jpeg

http://www.clarisita.org/media/1/0496.jpg

Y'all done?

We all have opinions on the War, and the Commander and Chief. All that is important is that we answer the call if and when it comes. Whether you are serving because you believe that everything the adminstration does is right, or because you want to do what you can to help your brother and sister Marines, all that matters is that you give it your all.

READ THIS AGAIN PLEASE

[The Sandman]

why is it not ok to argue on the net? so one thread out of 10 is an argument waiting to happen. People are supposed to fight for freedom but not excersize them?

Brooklyn. It was confirmed through genetic testing that it was the same string that we sent to Iraq. Not the American government but a biological facility out of the U.S. (i believe it was in Utah.) Your argument is that because someone made the gun that they should be at fault instead of the thug that sold them gun knowing full well he was going to use it to shoot one. kind of a half assed argument if you ask me.

Also, yes there are genocides around the world and we do pick our battles. we picked this one and there are at least 25 million Iraqis that appreciate what the Americans have done and are still doing for them.

Yes saddam was his nemisis, and his fathers. He was also one of the U.S. a very outspoken one. Not to mention he was firing SAMs at American planes trying to enforce the no fly zone. Act of war? i think so

all in all i dont care if you support the war or not. i do and ill go fight in it if given the chance. what you do is your choice. your freedom. do what you want.

Oh and that little remark about Fox news..... dont speak to me like that again. you want respect start giving it.

[cgkades]

there is no reason to delete the thread yet, after all this IS a discussion board... there is no disrespect as far as i can see though i havent read ALL the posts


and if you think the thread sucks then dont read it

[yellowwing]

there is no reason to delete the thread yet, after all this IS a discussion board... there is no disrespect as far as i can see though i havent read ALL the posts
So far so good.

[jinelson]

Brookyn for someone who is not debating you have sure fooled the hell out of me. I sure hope that you are not of the opinion that you can draw a lawful order out like you have this thread, because if you are you are not going to like the results you get at all. Lets go back to the question posed by the thread starter and try to be a team here and help him with his problem.

MKocher man you cracked me up!

[Brooklyn]

why is it not ok to argue on the net? so one thread out of 10 is an argument waiting to happen. People are supposed to fight for freedom but not excersize them?

Brooklyn. It was confirmed through genetic testing that it was the same string that we sent to Iraq. Not the American government but a biological facility out of the U.S. (i believe it was in Utah.)

My understanding is that it was a university professor that the FBI wanted for those attacks. Which would explain if the string came from a facility on U.S. soil. He had access to a universertie's bio/chem. lab ( not sure what state it was in ).


Your argument is that because someone made the gun that they should be at fault instead of the thug that sold them gun knowing full well he was going to use it to shoot one.



If I bought a gun from a guy, who bought it from a guy, and killed a little ole' lady with it, who are ya gonna blame? Me, the guy I bought it from, or the guy he bought it from? I wasn't saying it's the U.S.'s fault, I was merely adding to your "aiding" argument.


Yes saddam was his nemisis, and his fathers. He was also one of the U.S. a very outspoken one. Not to mention he was firing SAMs at American planes trying to enforce the no fly zone. Act of war? i think so



Yes, he was a nemisis and a loud and obnoxious guy, but I don't think that is justification for war. I also don't think those SAMs are a reason for 2300 Americans to have lost their lives in that pit. ****, we coulda just bombed the hell out of them. We launched an all out invasion.


all in all i dont care if you support the war or not. i do and ill go fight in it if given the chance. what you do is your choice. your freedom. do what you want.




If I'm given the order "Go to Iraq and stop the insurgents from killing your brothers" I'll pack my bags and go, simple as that. I'll fight to help the forces that are there now following orders, but that doesn't mean I agree with the reasons that we are there.


Oh and that little remark about Fox news..... dont speak to me like that again. you want respect start giving it.



You know as well as I do that FOX News is extremely right leaning.

[Brooklyn]

Brookyn for someone who is not debating you have sure fooled the hell out of me. I sure hope that you are not of the opinion that you can draw a lawful order out like you have this thread, because if you are you are not going to like the results you get at all. Lets go back to the question posed by the thread starter and try to be a team here and help him with his problem.

MKocher man you cracked me up!

I said I wasn't debating with him if he's a good person or not. I don't want anyone to think I'm trying to attack them.

I will follow whatever order I am given. See my above post.

*edit* that still doesn't sound right. How can I rephrase...I'm was telling him that I'm not arguing with him over him being a good or a bad person. I think that's better.

[cgkades]

ok, i have a really short attention span, can we PLEASE keep the posts to a 5 line minimum... pleeeeeeeeeeease



:)

[The Sandman]

its not about what what you said about Fox. you implied that i was regurgitating media garbage as my argument. This would in and of itself imply that i dont have the intellect or education to come up with my own argument.

[Born2Kill]

wow, I was gone for like 5 hours and look wat happened to the thread.. lol.. plenty of comments and flaming :banana: Anyway thanks for your comments and flames?? Other than that, my opinion is this. The war in Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11 I know that, So what got us in Iraq? For some reason I think bush wanted revenge for his father cas Saddam threatened his dads life when he was in office.

John

[outlaw3179]

Brooklyn

1. If you dont like the war in Iraq , cool, dont join the Marines...cuz thats where your going. and then when your over there and you complain to someone, the only thing your going to see is the cutting edge of a pizzed off corporals boot.

2. When you do get over there and you are.....youll see that every lunatic who ever had a beef with the U.S. or its ally is over there training , learning , and practicing. So yes eventually I think that if we dont stop it over there, it will be over here. Its just a matter of time.

So just keep watching the Fox news, or the Communist News Network and youll get all your info. or dont , cuz obviously you know everything already.

[Brooklyn]

Brooklyn

1. If you dont like the war in Iraq , cool, dont join the Marines...cuz thats where your going. and then when your over there and you complain to someone, the only thing your going to see is the cutting edge of a pizzed off corporals boot.



I will follow whatever order I am given. See my above post.





If I'm given the order "Go to Iraq and stop the insurgents from killing your brothers" I'll pack my bags and go, simple as that. I'll fight to help the forces that are there now following orders, but that doesn't mean I agree with the reasons that we are there.





Absolutely! No matter if I agree with whatever conflict we may face or not, I will follow my orders and get whatever the job may be done.




So just keep watching the Fox news, or the Communist News Network and youll get all your info. or dont , cuz obviously you know everything already.

I appreciate the compliment, but I don't know everything, nor do I claim to. And if it makes me a Communist to have a difference in opinion then those that lean right, color me red and call me Gustov.

[Radiofantry]

I think that you are making the mistake of assuming that being against the war means for pulling out of there completely. <br />
<br />
I was totally against the war before we started it, and I still firmly...

[Cory12231]

Go with what your heart is Saying.

Marine

[outlaw3179]

Geez....I never knew it was so simple. Hell we should get you over there right away so you can start showing everyone how its done. Obviously you have alot of experience from your book that you read. Never mind all the variables, like being careful not to disrespect the sensibilities of your average Muslim or the fact that you have Iraqis fighting you because they want you out of their country, or Syrians or Iranians fighting you because its a good way to learn, or just the common criminal who is making a quick buck . Yeah forget all that , we should just kick in every door kick some ass! yeah!
Theese arent the bannana wars and sure as hell isnt Nicaragua. IN order for you to have any kind of success you have win the hearts and minds of the common person. but you knew that already.
You cant be a part of the team if your hearts not in it. So ask yourself that before you become part of the best fighting orginization in the world. Maybe the Marine Corps. is not what your suited for. Have you ever thought of the peace corps? I think theyre hiring .

[Radiofantry]

Geez....I never knew it was so simple. Hell we should get you over there right away so you can start showing everyone how its done. Obviously you have alot of experience from your book that you read.

I never claimed to have any experience. Don't put words in my mouth. All I said was that there are lots of parallels with wars we have fought in the past, and that we ought to consider using tactics that have worked in similar situations in the past. This isn't exactly new territory that we're in here, we've been in these types of wars before, especially in Haiti.


Never mind all the variables, like being careful not to disrespect the sensibilities of your average Muslim or the fact that you have Iraqis fighting you because they want you out of their country, or Syrians or Iranians fighting you because its a good way to learn, or just the common criminal who is making a quick buck . Yeah forget all that , we should just kick in every door kick some ass! yeah!

And I wasn't forgetting all of those things. If you look at the Small Wars manual you'll notice that a big part of it is embedding in communities and doing public works projects, as well as defending them from insurgents so they are comfortable helping us root out the terrorists and insurgents. That sounds like winning their hearts and minds to me. It just starts with a door kicking operation, because you have to get them out before you can keep them out.


Theese arent the bannana wars and sure as hell isnt Nicaragua. IN order for you to have any kind of success you have win the hearts and minds of the common person. but you knew that already.
I think that's exactly what I said. I didn't say it was the banana wars, I said there were a lot of parallels with wars that have already been fought. What is the point of having history if you can't learn from it?

[PooleeNGN]

everyone is entitled to their own opinion. true the Marines here have a great point, we poolees dont understand **** unless we were out there fighting and seeing our brothers die b4 our eyes or in our arms. it isnt the first time we have been attacked by terrorist, Marines have been killed by them since 1989, no one really cared for it much until now. if we pull out now, eventually they will attack us on or soil. we would have shown them that not only are we incompetents for not succeeding, we are pansys for giving up. they will take it to their advantage. every Marines who have died for their country and love ones will have been in vain. we fight for rights and freedom. not just for us but for everyone, stop being selfish

[Zippo]

my argument for the Iraq War is this:

1) A style of government should be chosen by the people.
2) Saddam Hussein used military power to control the people.
3) If Hussein uses military to control the people, the people are not choosing the style of government.

at that point i think we should intervene. it doesn't matter if he has a WMD, or a water pistol. if he is oppressing millions of people, it's our job as the superpower to atleast give these people the option of how they want to live.
i will never be part of a country who forces anything on any group of people.
if they WANT to be controlled by Hussein, thats fine! but i hope you can understand my objection where the 10% with weapons are controlling the 90% who won't stand up and fight.

in other words, i totally support the decision to invade Iraq.

[Lithium]

to bring in a different side of things...Im not supporting this at all, im just bringing it up for debate cause I read it somewhere (yes maybe the Fox aka Communist News :D) quote: Iraq was more stable under Saddam Hussein, by going in there, many people that had running water and electricity now dont have it. Sure Saddam Killed what a hundred-2 hundred innocent people (probably more), but now thousands of americans and Iraqis alike are dying.

^^^that is the main points of what I read, It isnt a direct quote from anywhere and I dont agree with it, but I would like to hear other's take on it. In my opinion, we didnt have a reason to be in Iraq at the start, but now that we are there we as American should make good in Iraq. Thats what I will be fighting for, for every one of those innocent people over there who are now being murdered by the insurgents/terrorists.

[GriT]

My opinion, countries, city's, towns are not meant to be built in deserts lol

Its very debatable and we could go on for months on this topic, but the fact is we have to stop kickin the horse and look at where we are NOW. Yea. Shoulda, coulda, woulda but we need to look at how we can get our family back home safely and bring some sort of orginization for the Middle East to progress on.

[Lithium]

^^^^Agreed^^^^

[Tallboot]

In my opinion, if we didnt go to war over there .. it was going to be on our own soil .. before 9/11 we were attacked 11 times before

1. 1970 Terrorists hijack Airplanes to jordan
2. 1979 52 americans held HOSTAGE in iran for more then a year
3. 1983 Bombing of US MARINE barracks in Beirut, lebanon kills 241 Marines
4. 1985 TWA flight 847 hijacked for 17 days
5. 1986 Bombing in berlin killed 3 injured 150
6. 1988 bomb on pan am flight 103 kills 270 Americans in lockerbie scotland
7. 1993 Bomb at WORLD TRADE centers KILLING 6 (still no action takin)
8. 1995 Truck bomb destroys a FEDERAL biulding in Oklahoma killin 168 injures 500
9. 1996 Bomb at US complex in Dharan Saudi Arabia kills 19 Soldiers
10. 1998 Bombing of Us embassies in Kenya and Tanzania kills more tehn 200
11. 2000 Bomb kills 17 american Sailors (navy) and injures 39 USS cole
~~~

12. 9/11 2001 --World trade centers, Pentagon, a field in Pennsylvania killing THOUSANDS

Yes bush 100% made the correct decision to fight this back, at this rate they would have brought the war to our soil ... Bush is a great president, maybe he isnt the Smartest, be he has alot of logic.

[yellowwing]

my argument for the Iraq War is this:

1) A style of government should be chosen by the people.
2) Saddam Hussein used military power to control the people.
3) If Hussein uses military to control the people, the people are not choosing the style of government.
Its more than that, Zippo. If you substitute "Saddam Hussein" with "Pakistan" you still have true statements. And Pakistan is an ally. Maybe not a great ally, but we'll take what we can get.

Dig a bit deeper. :)

[Radiofantry]

Its more than that, Zippo. If you substitute "Saddam Hussein" with "Pakistan" you still have true statements. And Pakistan is an ally. Maybe not a great ally, but we'll take what we can get.

Dig a bit deeper. :)

So are Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Morocco.

:)

[Radiofantry]

*snip terrorism dates*
Yes bush 100% made the correct decision to fight this back, at this rate they would have brought the war to our soil ... Bush is a great president, maybe he isnt the Smartest, be he has alot of logic.

See, that's all well and good, except that Iraq had nothing to do with any of those attacks. In fact, many of the people who made those attacks(Libya, Saudi Arabians, Osama bin Laden, etc) were mutual enemies of ours and Saddam Hussein.

Remember, Saddam Hussein had a secular government, that didn't rule by shar'ia(Islamic law), and that ****ed a lot of fundamentalist Muslims off. Saddam had as many enemies in the Middle-East as we did, and recall that a big part of his arsenal was from us, arming him to fight Iran.

Attacking Afghanistan was 100% the right decision, the Taliban was directly responsible for giving comfort to Al Qaeda, who attacked and murderd thousands of US citizens, all over the world.

Invading Iraq, a sovreign nation, on evidence that turned out to be false, against international law, was the wrong decision. And that is just his screwups on Iraq.

The largest budget deficit in history, wholesale assaults on the consitution that all of us, even those of us in the DEP, swore to defend, and even now he is talking about how a free press, one of those things guaranteed in the constitution, is helping the terrorists.

Bush is the not the worst President, that's for sure, but he's definately not a great President, and nothing he does makes any sense.

For a perfect example look at the ports deal. He spends 4 years of his Presidency making sure that every single American is terrified of people of Middle-Eastern decent, they might all be part of a sleeper cell, or terrorists, or whatever, and then he goes and tries to sell our port operations to a company based in the United Arab Emirates.

How does that show a man who uses logic?

[Born2Kill]

Tallboot, your completly wrong.

Bush did the wrong thing to invade Iraq, Afganistan did the 9/11 attack, not Iraq.

We're really in iraq for no reason right now, just shooting insurgents, but they keep coming back because the civilians would get ****ed if one of those insurgents were they're family member.

What im gettin at is, we made a wrong move to go in Iraq. Now were ****ed.

John

[Zippo]

Its more than that, Zippo. If you substitute "Saddam Hussein" with "Pakistan" you still have true statements. And Pakistan is an ally. Maybe not a great ally, but we'll take what we can get.

Dig a bit deeper. :)

understood. but i fully support the liberation of any country where a majority are being controlled against their will by a minority.
that's all i meant.

[LittleDevilDog]

Tallboot, your completly wrong.

Bush did the wrong thing to invade Iraq, Afganistan did the 9/11 attack, not Iraq.

We're really in iraq for no reason right now, just shooting insurgents, but they keep coming back because the civilians would get ****ed if one of those insurgents were they're family member.

What im gettin at is, we made a wrong move to go in Iraq. Now were ****ed.

John
First of all, those are ALL opinions. Dont ever tell a fellow Marine or Poolee, or any other citizen for that matter that their OPINION is WRONG. There is no such thing.

Second of all, is it you or your anti-Bush, anti-Military parents typing this for you? If not, they definitely did a number on you.. sorry to say.

When I read your posts, I feel like I'm reading a liberal message board.

REMEMBER BOY, "FREEDOM ISN'T FREE," and we're definitely not gonna stay free if we sit on our ***.

We're ****** now? Alot of faith in our Marines over in Iraq right there. If you're going to enlist or even thinking of it, get some better logic and positive thinking.

Sorry... this topic gets me going.... but I don't take back a word. Nothing personal bro.

[SAMMIJ87]

Yeah so my parents and I have been having some battles on some things. like...

Who agrees that George W. Bush is doing a good job and reasons?
They dont agree at all, they think hes an ******* etc, I agree that hes a good guy.

They also think that every soldier in Iraq is dieing which is stupidity.

So pretty much, they're completly against the military, they told me to join the navy and be a squid, I told them I wanna fight for my country, not sit on a boat.

They've also gotton most of they're information from Farenheight 9/11, which I do not believe a thing in that movie.

What do you guys think I should do to get my parents to agree with me to join the corps?

John
HEY JOHN,
I THINK YOU SHOULD TELL THEM THAT, UNFOURTUNATLEY, FREEDOM IS SOMETHING THAT NEEDS TO BE FOUGHT FOR. AND IN ORDER TO STOP US ALL FROM BEING FORCED TO SPEAK ARABIC AND WEAR SCARVES ON OUR HEADS, WE NEED YOUNG MEN AND WOMAN, LIKE YOU, TO JOIN THE CORPS AND FIGHT FOR IT. THERFORE ANY SOLDIER JOINING THE CORPS AND DIEING, AS HORRIBLE AS IT MIGHT BE, IS A NECESSITIY TO KEEP LIVING THE LIFE WE ARE.

[jryanjack]

Wow - lots of good stuff here.

John - you need to make your own decision and we and your parents cannot make it for you.

I personally believe that you do not have to believe that the US invading Iraq was the right thing to do, what you need to believe is that fighting for your country, your borthers, and our way of life is not only right, but an obligation that all Marines are called to do.

At the time of the invasion I agreed with the decision - we were going to Iraq to keep WMD's from falling into the hands of terrorists. However, one way or another the US failed in that mission. Either there were no WMD's to get rid of, or they are in terrorist's hands now, either way mission not accomplished. That being said, we have to live with the reality that we are in Iraq and we now have to clean up our mess for lack of a better term. To pull out now accomplishes nothing and will subject the good and decent Iraqi people to a worse rule than they had before we got there. How do we do that - got me, I'm not a General! But I think the answer lies somewhere between Outlaw's winning of hearts and minds, and MKocher's kicking the door down!

[Radiofantry]

*snip*

I personally believe that you do not have to believe that the US invading Iraq was the right thing to do, what you need to believe is that fighting for your country, your borthers, and our way of life is not only right, but an obligation that all Marines are called to do.

*snip*

That being said, we have to live with the reality that we are in Iraq and we now have to clean up our mess for lack of a better term. To pull out now accomplishes nothing and will subject the good and decent Iraqi people to a worse rule than they had before we got there.

Sir, you said what I was trying to say, but with much more eloquence and a lot clearer.

I agree on all points.

Thank you.

[Radiofantry]

anti-Bush

When I read your posts, I feel like I'm reading a liberal message board.


I was under the impression that this was a MARINE CORPS message board, not a liberal or conservative message board.

Being a liberal does not mean that you do not believe in fighting for your country, or joining the armed forces. Need I remind you that Eisenhower, Kennedy, even Jimmy Carter, were all members of the military fighting for our country?

Many former democratic senators and representatives were also veterans, many of whom fought in World War II, Korea, Vietnam, etc.

And need I remind you that in the last Presidential election one of the candidates had served in Vietnam, and fought when his country asked him, and another pulled strings to stay home in Texas.

I'm not anti-Bush, because I'm not an idiot. The fact that I don't like his decisions, and I don't like where he has steered this country, does not mean I dislike him as a person, or that I'm "against him". I believe in the democratic process, and the people elected him President, for better or worse. Honestly, I think he'd be a helluva guy to go mountain biking with on his ranch. That does not, however, mean that just because he is the President he is above criticism.

Remeber, our government is BY THE PEOPLE and FOR THE PEOPLE. The government serves us, not the other way around.

[thedrifter]

was under the impression that this was a MARINE CORPS message board, not a liberal or conservative message board.

Yes it is a Marine's Corps Board...and that is they key word here. Marine....;)

Everyone has a right to their own opinion...Just because they don't agree with YOU...doesn't give You a Right to put them down...

I can see in the Near Future Someone needs to Learn a Key Word...
RESPECT....

Ellie

[jgorosco]

I think that this thread has gotten way off track from the original question. If you want to voice your opinions for or against the war fine but give the person the respect that posted this thread and do it on another thread. Me personally I could give a good rats azz on why we are over there. What I care about is the Marines and Soldiers that are fighting over there to help the people of Iraq that appreciate it. You don't like Bush fine, you like Bush fine. You have opinions voice them ON ANOTHER THREAD! But the funny thing is everyone thinks their news info is the correct info and the other station is wrong or bias. Best thing is to get the info from all angles before saying someone else is wrong. Another thing I have never seen a person in politics really care about the American people once in office. And that is MY opinion. Start a new thread and answer the poolees question.

[Radiofantry]

Yes it is a Marine's Corps Board...and that is they key word here. Marine....;)

Everyone has a right to their own opinion...Just because they don't agree with YOU...doesn't give You a Right to put them down...

I can see in the Near Future Someone needs to Learn a Key Word...
RESPECT....

Ellie

Please show me where I have put anyone down in this thread?

Also, who am I not respecting? As far as I knew I was having a discussion with a fellow poolee.

[yellowwing]

Just a reminder:

"I do solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; That I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the order of the officers appointed over me, according to the regulations and the Uniform Code of Milutary Justice. So help me God."

[Radiofantry]

Just a reminder:

Sir, I was wondering if you might have some insight into something. This is something I've always wondered about. What would happen in a situation where the President abolished the constitution, essentially. Since the first thing we swear to do is to defend the constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic, would that mean that everyone in the armed forces would be sworn to remove the President from power and reinstate the constitution?

Note: I'm not saying that we are in anything even approaching that sort of situation right now, that possibility has just always intrigued me.

[yellowwing]

In the event of Martial Law, more than ever we would need the Fidelity and Abilities of the Marine Corps. Whether it is to restore order and safety as soon as possible, or as you theoretically put it, remove a tyrant.

The United States has the best form of government ever devised my mankind to prevent the ascension of a tyrant.

[Focus Fate]

No offence, but **** what your parents think. If you want to serve in the Marine Corps, and fight for your country then sign the damn contract. You've done all you need to do; inform them of your choice in life. Weather they agree or not, they'll be proud of you when you graduate from Recruit Training.

Sorry if this came across as harsh, but I'm an *&#*&!@%* by nature.

[LittleDevilDog]

Like I said earlier, bro.

"Do it for you, not for ANYONE else."