View Full Version : Help! (Army or USMC?)
Navyurf
06-24-15, 04:01 AM
Hello all, I'm about a week away from enlisting into the Army DEP with an Airborne Ranger contract. I've already been to MEPS for my physical and ASVAB, I just had to get some medical stuff cleared. You're probably thinking why am I here if I'm enlisting in the Army? Well I'm someone who really values espirit de corps, and if I wash out of Ranger selection I'll be sent to the 82nd Airborne, where it's not exactly great. Instead of taking the risk with the Ranger contract, should I just join the USMC with an 03XX contract? I need some guidance because I'll have to tell my recruiter to cancel the MEPS appointment where I'll swear in.
Respectfully,
Luke
USMC 2571
06-24-15, 06:28 AM
How can we advise you about what YOU would like to do? That's not possible.
irpat54
06-24-15, 06:57 AM
Hello all, I'm about a week away from enlisting into the Army DEP with an Airborne Ranger contract. I've already been to MEPS for my physical and ASVAB, I just had to get some medical stuff cleared. You're probably thinking why am I here if I'm enlisting in the Army? Well I'm someone who really values espirit de corps, and if I wash out of Ranger selection I'll be sent to the 82nd Airborne, where it's not exactly great. Instead of taking the risk with the Ranger contract, should I just join the USMC with an 03XX contract? I need some guidance because I'll have to tell my recruiter to cancel the MEPS appointment where I'll swear in.
Respectfully,
Luke
if you are not sure you can make it through the Rangers, you won't make it through Marine Corps boot,,, IMO,,
Marine Corps Boot Camp is worse the Ranger School,, That is for sure and for certain,,
no Brag Just Fact..
Navyurf
06-24-15, 10:10 AM
Apples and oranges, irpat54.
Tennessee Top
06-24-15, 10:11 AM
USMC active duty 03XX contracts are few and far between (because everybody wants one). There is a real good chance a USMC recruiter does not have one to offer you and won't till October 1st when the new MOS allocations come out. Don't make any decisions without talking to one first (and get anything they offer you in writing). Your options may go from bad to worse. They're pushing the reserve side right now so don't be surprised if they say they can get you a reserve 03XX contract but not an AD one.
Navyurf
06-24-15, 10:18 AM
USMC active duty 03XX contracts are few and far between (because everybody wants one). There is a real good chance a USMC recruiter does not have one to offer you and won't till October 1st when the new MOS allocations come out. Don't make any decisions without talking to one first (and get anything they offer you in writing). Your options may go from bad to worse. They're pushing the reserve side right now so don't be surprised if they say they can get you a reserve 03XX contract but not an AD one.
Thanks for the helpful reply, if infantry's full, how's the intelligence field?
joseywales
06-24-15, 10:59 AM
Why don't you try all the services?
Tennessee Top
06-24-15, 03:20 PM
Visit a recruiter and see what they have to offer. You don't have much leverage since you only have a week to work with. You'll need to make some decisions quickly. Let us know what they say.
MunkyVsRobot
06-24-15, 04:01 PM
Why dont you make your own decision. We aren't car salesmen here its your time you are doing not anyone elses.
Marine1011
06-24-15, 05:19 PM
Just when we think we've heard everything......
Navyurf
06-24-15, 06:10 PM
Visit a recruiter and see what they have to offer. You don't have much leverage since you only have a week to work with. You'll need to make some decisions quickly. Let us know what they say.
Will do.
Marine1011
06-24-15, 06:14 PM
Troll? You be the judge.
Navyurf
06-24-15, 06:52 PM
Troll? You be the judge.
How am I trolling? What reason would I have to troll? I'm a week away from making one of the biggest decisions of my life and I'm having second thoughts, didn't any of you feel the same way or did you just shoot straight into the USMC without a second glance?
USMC 2571
06-24-15, 07:33 PM
Sounds to me like he just threw that out there, because he specifically asked others to be their own judge, so he didn't say you are a troll.
Anyway, tough to suggest what to do, as it all depends on what you want. If someone asked you, what should I have for lunch tomorrow, chicken or steak or a roast beef sandwich, what would you advise them?
Surely it would be something along these lines: You know what foods you like, how can I advise you about something so subjective?
Kegler300
06-24-15, 07:39 PM
If you are this concerned, and decide to join the Army, you will later regret that decision. You can't get any more elite than the Marine Corps.
Navyurf
06-24-15, 07:42 PM
Sounds to me like he just threw that out there, because he specifically asked others to be their own judge, so he didn't say you are a troll.
Anyway, tough to suggest what to do, as it all depends on what you want. If someone asked you, what should I have for lunch tomorrow, chicken or steak or a roast beef sandwich, what would you advise them?
Surely it would be something along these lines: You know what foods you like, how can I advise you about something so subjective?
Do Marines still do sea related stuff? I love being in the water and if I could get an 03XX contract I'd hop on it instantly, but it doesn't seem like Marines have been doing that kinda stuff lately with Iraq and Afghanistan n all. In the Army I'd be doing Airborne related things, but I'd rather be in the water
Kegler300
06-24-15, 07:45 PM
Do Marines still do sea related stuff? I love being in the water and if I could get an 03XX contract I'd hop on it instantly, but it doesn't seem like Marines have been doing that kinda stuff lately with Iraq and Afghanistan n all. In the Army I'd be doing Airborne related things, but I'd rather be in the water
Why of course. We are Department of the Navy ... the men's department. (;
Navyurf
06-24-15, 08:01 PM
Why of course. We are Department of the Navy ... the men's department. (;
Seriously though, what kind of sea related stuff do Marines do besides MEU's?
I heard there was a great ping pong tournament on the deck of a LPH last week.
Tennessee Top
06-24-15, 09:18 PM
While you're at it, may as well talk to the Navy recruiter too. You're going to be busy this week.
mexbearlll
06-24-15, 09:34 PM
Just join the army and be 2nd best... if You are this worried.
Just join the army
be 2nd best... if You are this worried.
I don't think any of us here give a Ratza$$
what you do, Sweetpea.....
Just don't be late getting home, yer momma
'll kick yera$$,
Navyurf (http://www.leatherneck.com/forums/member.php?116078-Navyurf)
http://www.leatherneck.com/forums/images/leatherneck/statusicon/user-offline.png
little friggin troll anyway
rumor is navytrolls bite the bubbles
from farts in the tub....
silveradomick
06-25-15, 07:40 AM
The Rangers I have met during and after my time in the Corps have been some of the most professional, well trained, and knowledgeable warfighters I've had the pleasure of knowing. That includes Marines. Marines love to talk **** and buy into their own propaganda, but the truth is that 03xx in the Corps or Ranger Battalion is going to give you the "espirit" you are seeking.
I'd be worried about that "if I wash out" attitude though. Not many people make it where they want to go when they are planning for failure preemptively.
LCPL1341
06-25-15, 09:31 AM
I disagree with Marine bootcamp being harder than Ranger school; not just anyone gets a Ranger tab. You have to actually be proficient to make it through, bootcamp on the other hand (in ALL branches) just pushes people through regardless of how f*cked up they are. I've seen some weak **** heads make it through Marine Corps bootcamp. As far as your dilemma goes, only you can answer that. No one here can tell you what you want to do.
silveradomick
06-25-15, 09:36 AM
What he said ^
Basic recruit training is just that, basic. Ranger school (to my understanding, having never been through it) is quite a bit more than basic.
Everybody on here likely can name a handful of recruits they graduated boot camp with who should never have made it. The system just isn't designed to wash you out, it's designed to train you basically as a Marine.
Navyurf
06-25-15, 12:03 PM
Hello all, I spoke to a Marine recruiter today and I'm in the process of transferring all of my Army paperwork to the Marine Corps. I was told to pick any 3 jobs and I'll be guaranteed one of those jobs since my ASVAB score was an 84. Looks like I'll be a poolee in a week or so.
silveradomick
06-25-15, 12:34 PM
Make sure you get your 03xx contract in writing before you sign anything man. Good luck.
Navyurf
06-25-15, 12:36 PM
Make sure you get your 03xx contract in writing before you sign anything man. Good luck.
Thanks! My top 3 jobs in order are Intelligence specialist, Rifleman, MSG
Tennessee Top
06-25-15, 09:56 PM
If by MSG, you mean Marine Security Guard, that job is not a primary MOS (it's a secondary MOS) and not something one is eligible for out of bootcamp. There is no MOS school for it. Normally, one must be a Lance Corporal (E3) to be eligible to apply. You can see the eligibility requirements on their homepage at www.mcesg.com (http://www.mcesg.com) (Become a MSG tab). To get orders to MSG school, Marines must be personally screened and approved by the MSG screening team (not a recruiter).
Navyurf
06-25-15, 10:24 PM
If by MSG, you mean Marine Security Guard, that job is not a primary MOS (it's a secondary MOS) and not something one is eligible for out of bootcamp. There is no MOS school for it. Normally, one must be a Lance Corporal (E3) to be eligible to apply. You can see the eligibility requirements on their homepage at www.mcesg.com (http://www.mcesg.com) (Become a MSG tab). To get orders to MSG school, Marines must be personally screened and approved by the MSG screening team (not a recruiter).
Thanks for clearing that up, my recruiter told me it was its own MOS.
irpat54
06-26-15, 09:44 AM
Apples and oranges, irpat54.
at this you are wrong.. when I was stationed in Panama, the "Rangers" used to come to our unit for training.. by us,,
The Marine Corps Boot Camp is the toughest and most complete in the world, so don't try to tell me what is apples and oranges,,
you haven't been their or did that. and until you can earn the Title, you have no Idea.
Navyurf
06-26-15, 11:32 AM
at this you are wrong.. when I was stationed in Panama, the "Rangers" used to come to our unit for training.. by us,,
The Marine Corps Boot Camp is the toughest and most complete in the world, so don't try to tell me what is apples and oranges,,
you haven't been their or did that. and until you can earn the Title, you have no Idea.
With all due respect, I find it hard to believe Rangers would be trained by any sort of Marine because MARSOC is being modeled after the 75th Ranger Regiment. I don't doubt Marine Corps recruit training is some of the most difficult in the world, and I do hope to earn the title and I respect you for your service and accomplishments but Marines and Rangers have different missions and comparing them truly is like comparing apples and oranges.
josephd
06-26-15, 02:43 PM
at this you are wrong.. when I was stationed in Panama, the "Rangers" used to come to our unit for training.. by us,,
The Marine Corps Boot Camp is the toughest and most complete in the world, so don't try to tell me what is apples and oranges,,
you haven't been their or did that. and until you can earn the Title, you have no Idea.
well on the other side of that coin...Marines train at Army Airborne school, Ranger School, Sapper school, Officer/leaders course, etc.....
I love the Marine Corps and being a Marine but comparing Marine Corps boot camp to Army Ranger school IS apples to oranges
And Navyurf, while I understand what you are getting at....MARSOC is NOT modeled after 75th Ranger Regiment....MARSOC has its very own doctrine which takes the best of all branches and their capabilities
silveradomick
06-26-15, 07:09 PM
What he said ^^^^
Navyurf
06-26-15, 08:17 PM
Thank you for all of your posts in this thread, Marines. I'm supposed to go back to the recruiter on Wednesday because he has to pull all my paperwork from the Army and I'll continue the enlistment process. I'd like to go for the intelligence field, and I'm wondering if I may pm a Marine who worked in intel to get some information about it? Also, may I have this thread deleted since my issue has been resolved and I've decided to go with the Marine Corps?
TolzerVman
06-26-15, 10:46 PM
Here is some history: The Marine Corps trained the first Army Drill Sergeants.
That is why the Army Drill Sergeants wear the same campaign hat. So the Army came to the Marine Corps to learn how to conduct basic combat training.
silveradomick
06-26-15, 11:03 PM
Here is some history: The Marine Corps trained the first Army Drill Sergeants.
That is why the Army Drill Sergeants wear the same campaign hat. So the Army came to the Marine Corps to learn how to conduct basic combat training.
I'd like to see a source for that info. I always thought the campaign cover evolved around the turn of the century because troops (both Army and Marines) who were involved in various campaigns needed a more functional hat. By 1911 or so both branches were wearing campaign covers in slightly different variants.
Thats a cool story though Tolzer, I'd love to find out if there's any truth to it.
TolzerVman
06-26-15, 11:13 PM
Silveradomick, I sent you a pm and an email with my address. Send me an email and I will email you the sources.
TolzerVman
06-26-15, 11:24 PM
Sources:
1. Army Magazine, August 2004, Basic Combat Training: Flashbacks and Forecasts by COL John M. Collins, US Army Retired.
2. Fort Jackson website (not sure if still active): US Army Garrison>Post Museum>History Chapter 4: 1964-1967 and beyond. It was the paragraph JACKSON SERGEANTS GET MARINE INSTRUCTION.
3. From Leatherneck Magazine:
Here is what was written with the picture.
Let's Clear Up the Drill Sergeant and Drill Instructor Question
The question concerning the drill instructor/drill sergeant designation (August 1999) seems to arise periodically. Perhaps the following will put the matter to rest.
Drill instructor is firmly embedded in the Marine Corps lexicon by virtue of usage dating back at least three-quarters of a century to a time when the position and duties were more likely filled by corporals and even privates first class.
In 1965, I was director of DI school at Parris Island, S.C. when the Army requested a feasibility study regarding the training of Army noncommissioned officers with Marine candidates for Drill Instructors School. As a result of this study, 10 of the top NCOs in the Army entered and completed the training to provide a cadre of men to standardize training throughout the Army.
The term drill sergeant was deliberately selected by the Army to reflect the highest degree of maturity and military leadership necessary in the Army task organization. When they graduated, they were presented the same distinctive field hat (campaign hat) that identifies the Marine drill instructor.
The picture, left, depicts 10 Army NCOs and part of DI Class 3-65 on March 12, 1965. As far as I know, this was a onetime effort.
Retired Maj John F. Shovar, Lincoln, R.I.
Taken from Leatherneck Magazine, October 1999
As provided earlier from the Fort Jackson website, there was one more class of 10-Soldiers, which graduated on 21 May 1965.
silveradomick
06-26-15, 11:34 PM
That's interesting stuff! Hadn't heard of that before. Thanks for sharing it publicly so that others can enjoy.
Tennessee Top
06-27-15, 07:12 AM
Besides Ranger School (where our CMC graduated from), the fact is, many Marines go to Army schools to be trained. Off the top of my head, I can think of Fort Sill, OK for artillery. Fort Leonard Wood, MO for MP, NBC, and Heavy Equipment Operator. Fort Benning, GA for armor (tanks). Fort Lee, VA for Bulk Fuel, Food Service, Small Arms Repair, Ammo Tech, and Metal Worker (welder). I'm sure there's more I can't think of right now.
s3ction8
06-29-15, 05:09 PM
Get out.
Navyurf
06-29-15, 05:21 PM
Get out.
I'm really confused, who are you?
Tennessee Top
06-29-15, 09:57 PM
Troll. Profile says he joined in 2005 and is still a private.
Navyurf
06-30-15, 12:35 AM
Troll. Profile says he joined in 2005 and is still a private.
Thought so, thanks. Tennessee Top, do you know any Marines in intelligence I may speak to? I can't decide whether I should go intel or infantry.
Tennessee Top
06-30-15, 05:59 PM
No. I retired in 1995. Know a few active duty Marines but none in the intel field.
Do you have the GT score required for intel (I believe it's 100)?
Navyurf
07-01-15, 01:52 AM
No. I retired in 1995. Know a few active duty Marines but none in the intel field.
Do you have the GT score required for intel (I believe it's 100)?
Yessir, got an 84 on my ASVAB my GT was a 119 I believe.
Tennessee Top
07-01-15, 02:32 AM
You should be good-to-go for just about any MOS then. Only need a 110 GT to apply for the Warrant Officer program.
If it means anything. Intel jobs carry over to more civilian jobs (mainly because of the security clearances) than infantry jobs do.
The list of MOS's rating reenlistment bonuses this year just came out. Some jobs in both infantry and intel can get bonuses in the $12-15K range. Some aviation jobs, like tilt-rotor mechanic (Osprey) are in the $50K range. That's to keep them from getting out for six figure civilian salaries. Of course, bonuses change from year-to-year and there is a limited bonus budget - first come, first served till all the money is gone. No way of predicting bonuses for the future except cyberwarfare will be in demand for decades to come.