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Thread: No Covers Indoors!!!
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12-01-09, 05:39 PM #31
Originally Posted by Jeff5886
hey Sgt Horwitz, im stationed on MCAS Yuma as well, i know they have signs posted saying that the Station Order says no Hats or Headgear are Authorized for wear inside Marine Corps Buildings on station. i dont recall the exact order, but i did some research on the subject as well and could not find a Marine Corps order stating that hats are not Authorized indoors.
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12-01-09, 06:11 PM #32
Civilian attire
Sgt. Andrew P. Roufs
Combat Photographer
Walking through the local mall you walk past a lot of people and you notice a Marine who works down the hall from you. He is a sergeant and you are a lance Corporal. You notice that he is wearing a doo rag on his head. You, have read and know your uniform regulations. You know that under no circumstances are doo rags authorized. What do you do?
Many Marines encounter this problem and think if they say something, they will get yelled at by that superior who is wrong.
When asked about this situation Base Sergeant Major, Sgt. Maj. Cherry McPherson, said, "Young Marines should tactfully ask the superior if the uniform regulations have changed, and if that superior is a good Marine they will realize they are wrong and make the correction."
As a Marine you represent the entire Marine Corps in uniform and out of uniform. Most people can look at you and tell you are a Marine simply by your haircut, your posture or your speech.
The Marine Corps order for uniform regulations is P1020.34. Civilian attire, addressed in chapter one, is divided into three different sections: Within the United States, aboard ship and aircraft, and outside the United States. "Marines are advised to read and know the order," McPherson said. "If a Marine is not wearing proper civilian attire, they probably do not know the order, and need to ask a peer or superior who does know the order."
According to the paragraph concerning attire while aboard ship and aircraft, personnel traveling as passengers aboard military flights and ships have to wear civilian clothes in style and quality similar to the service "C" uniform. Some examples of appropriate attire include, shirts with a collar, trousers with a belt and socks with shoes.
In the United States however, the civilian attire regulations are a bit more relaxed, although Marines are still expected to hold themselves to a higher standard.
According to the paragraph on wearing civilian headgear, 'When wearing civilian headgear it will be removed when indoors… the wear of clothing articles not specifically designed to be normally worn as headgear (e.g. bandanas, doo rags…) are prohibited.'
"If you see a Marine wearing a doo rag, you need to tell him that it is not authorized, and to take it off." he order also states to wear a belt with trousers/slacks (if applicable), "if it has belt loops, wear a belt," McPherson said.
Many Marines continually break or disregard regulations concerning the wear of their camouflage utility uniforms off base.
"If it is an emergency and you need gas or are picking up uniform items from the cleaners, that's not a problem, but shopping at the grocery store is not allowed… basically short visits are okay," she said.
To prevent any problem, Marines can be proactive. "If I know I will need to stop on my way home, I will bring civilian attire to work with me. Other than that I will not stop while in the utility uniform," said Halton.
The Marine Corps has civilian attire regulations so Marines will hold themselves to a higher standard while in town, it allows Marines to be proud of what they wear while on liberty and leave.
Marines who don't follow these regulations are subject to disciplinary action that can range from correction on the spot to non-judicial punishment.
"If I caught one of my Marines improperly wearing their utilities in town, I would correct them on the spot, the first time; the second time I would counsel the Marine and bring it to higher authority and suggest if they like wearing their uniform in town so
much, to make them wear their service uniform instead of civilian attire… it is a privilege not a right to wear civilian attire."
http://www.ala.usmc.mil/pao/emblem/2...re%20local.asp
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12-01-09, 06:52 PM #33
Doo-rags aren't designed as headgear ?
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12-01-09, 06:58 PM #34
Not in the sense of Marine Corps cover,civilian baseball type caps and cowboy hats.
Doo rags were originially designed to wear to the rack with the grease that some wear on the hair to keep the pillow case from being slimey.....then it became shiek....sorta like some woman wearing a bandanna to the commissary on a bad hair day with curlers on her gourd.
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12-01-09, 07:46 PM #35
Learn something new everyday.
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12-04-09, 08:26 AM #36
My memory sometimes is pretty bad so bare with me. I can't remember a single time removing headgear in the field to eat chow. I can't think of even one. Whether it was MRE's or hot wets I can't think of a single time removing headgear (cover, helmet, boonie) to eat chow in the field.
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12-04-09, 08:35 AM #37
Me either not with rats or hot.. brought to the field.
Sometimes went from steel pot to soft cover.
The only time in the field I remember on long term ops if a mess tent with tables was set up it was considered a mess hall and one took off the cover.
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11-16-14, 12:22 PM #38
MCO P1020.34G w CH 1-5 states in Chapter 1, Section 1005.2A: 'Onboard military installations...civilian headgear will be removed indoors in accordance with established norms."
Established norms change over time so I did an internet search of the issue. A majority of the unscientific polls done show around 70% of people think it is ok to wear a hat indoors if not in a formal/official situation.
http://www.walternelson.com/dr/hatiquette says that public and retail establishments have historically been places to keep your hat on.
Unscientific polls:
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/foru...g-Indoors-Rude
http://serenesforest.net/forums/inde...howtopic=39463
http://forums.govteen.com/countdown-...s-indoors.html
http://www.talkbass.com/threads/do-y...g-rude.316989/
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/60-minut...oll-etiquette/
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11-16-14, 01:08 PM #39We are talking Marine Corps here and civilian polls mean zilch. Originally Posted by Daristeiad
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11-16-14, 04:17 PM #40
Outdoors my Cover is My Roof indoors I do it as a sign of Respect by removing it but now that Society is a very disrespectful place @ most times I do as I please sooo is you come 2 my House 2 Eat You remove the Cover or You don't Eat ! I come 2 your place I wear my Cover put my boots on your Table act like You don't mean mean chit in the Scheme of things HaHaHa
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11-16-14, 05:30 PM #41holy $hit, something i actually agree with you on Originally Posted by Old Marine
I was taught from a young age that you take your hat off when indoors and/or eating at a table. It's simply just being polite. There shouldn't have to be a MCO on this, it should just be something that everyone does as a social norm.
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11-16-14, 05:46 PM #42
@Old Marine
All non combat uniform regulations are balanced by what image they present to civilians. In this case civilian views need to be even more scrutinized because we are talking about civilian attire. This is the reason Marines do not were utility uniforms off base.
The Marine Corps is nothing more than a conservative (I'm not speaking about politics here) reflection of society. We change slowly over time as our society changes. This happens whether we like it or not (examples include minorities, women, and those with non heterosexual sexual orientation).
I am open to evidence that may prove otherwise but I am fairly confident you won't take the trouble to find it.
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11-16-14, 05:53 PM #43I agree with you and your reasoning/argument, but I still have to say that removing your hat is still basic respect when entering a house or official building(not the mall, grocery store, or the like). Originally Posted by Daristeiad
I choose my battles wisely, I am not going to light some Marine up for wearing a hat in civilian attire and not taking it off when going into the PX to pick up a case of beer, thats just stupid. But the chow hall, sitting down to eat, entering company office, etc...I would get irate over
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11-16-14, 05:57 PM #44
@josephd,
I find no fault in your response. The areas you speak of should absolutely require the removal of headgear. This norm hasn't changed completely but it has shifted a bit around the edges.
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11-17-14, 04:43 AM #45Daristeiad Originally Posted by Daristeiad
Could actually fill out his profile "IF"
he wants to be called Marine in here...
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