Officer Pride...

[commdog7]

I didn't even notice you gave me a sex change. When communicating electronically, people have a way of mistakening me for a male (I'm used to it).

[0231Marine]

Officers are just as much a Marine as an Enlisted Marine is. They also cut loose with fellow officers just as much as Enlisted Marines do. You just don't see it because in front of you, they act like your superior.

[SGT7477]

Officers are just as much a Marine as an Enlisted Marine is. They also cut loose with fellow officers just as much as Enlisted Marines do. You just don't see it because in front of you, they act like your superior.

I was a billeting NCO for Officers on Okinawa and they can be tons of fun too, I won't go there.

[NoRemorse]

I think the kid's still pushing... Nothing like the smell of tears, sweat and blood mixing together.

Semper Fi

[0231Marine]

I was a billeting NCO for Officers on Okinawa and they can be tons of fun too, I won't go there.

Ain't that the truth. I've always found that a Marine Corps Ball is a good time to see your officers act like complete idiots. People forget that junior officer are only 22 or 23 years old...they're no different than your boot PFC and LCpl's.

[SGT7477]

Ain't that the truth. I've always found that a Marine Corps Ball is a good time to see your officers act like complete idiots. People forget that junior officer are only 22 or 23 years old...they're no different than your boot PFC and LCpl's.

My time on Okinawa I worked with around 100 officers, the highest ranking was a Full Bird, never seen no problems with him but anyone lower than him, oh well that's another story,lol.

[giveen]

My officer is a Mormon, he wasnt much fun at the Ball.
But a great officer, during my last year in, it was only he and I working the S-6.

I was going to go ROTC before I enlisted, but after talking to him about his experience at TBS and the Academy, I'm glad I choice not to. I dont think I was ready to lead as I was after picking up Cpl.

[Isrowei]

Evening, Marines. I do realize that Marine Officers are still Marines, but it seems the Corps doesn't put as much emphasis on them being Marines, but moreso on them being an Officer. Is this just the way I'm seeing it, or is that how it really is? Also, one of the reasons I want to join the Corps in the first place is the brotherhood. As an Officer, is there that same brotherhood, as far as joking around with your 'peers' and whatnot? Or is that frowned upon as an Officer? I appreciate you answering my many questions Marines. Semper Fi.

I've read, re-read, and triple read your post (and your follow-on in response #4). There are several glaring assumptions that you make.

Before I start, I understand that much is lost in communication via text. Namely tone. Read this straightfoward in a matter-of-fact manner, and I think you will come close to my intended meaning.

First, you ask a question about Marine Officers, but purposely pose it to enlisted Marines, reasoning that they would have better perspective?

Second, you assume that "brotherhood"="hanging out" and telling jokes, etc.

Thirdly, you assume that rank gives privilege, and that privilege is used to avoid work. Either that, or you believe that Officers purposely avoid doing "dirty" work such as FTX's.


I hope you can see the inherent problems composed in these assumptions. If I want to know about a subject, I should go to the source to get my knowledge.

Officers and enlisted Marines have two stark commonalities: They are regular people like you (perhaps a little older) and they are Marines.

One the promotion warrant for each rank you will find the statement "special trust and confidence". Each rank has expected responsibilities and duties. As a Marine progresses in rank, what they are counselled on becomes tied to their status... as NCO, SNCO, or Officer. When I counsel my Corporal on failed leadership, I don't address it as simply a Marine issue, I address it as a Marine NCO issue. When I address a SNCO, again, I am going to tie the counsel to his or her position as a SNCO. When I am counselled by my seniors, they address me in light of being a Marine Officer. So yes, there is much about being a Marine Officer. But you should take some time to focus on the bond and responsibility of the NCOs and SNCOs.

A variety of perspectives is always good when examining a subject. However, focusing on one perspective, especially to the exclusion of the primary source is to take the issue out of context and possibly risk missing the whole picture entirely. Each of these enlisted Marines has valuable insight and experience with dealing with Officers. Just as I have specific and valued experience in dealing with enlisted Marines. I highly doubt though that anyone wanting to know what it was like to be a NCO or SNCO would ask an Officer as their primary source of information. Some might even go a little farther than ridicule of that notion. So too is the idea that the enlisted perspective on Officers is the only view or perhaps even more pointedly, the only correct view.

The personality types of Marines span the spectrum from humorous class clowns to ultra-serious types. Defining "brotherhood" to being "cool" is a disservice to the bond and cheapens the overall concept. The Brotherhood of the Corps is about men and women willing to give their life for each other. Not about whether they josh around the water cooler on Mondays. In that regard, yes. Marine Officers share the similar bond of Marine-hood with their enlisted counterparts.

I enjoy my interaction with my Marines and my peers. I know other officer (and Marines) who have the collective humor of a rock. It is what it is.

Lastly, and I admit this was the most personally frustrating, the idea that an Officer, simply by virtue of rank woud either be excused or simply skip out on training and requirements common to all Marines is ... I don't have the words for it.

Rank does not excuse one from responsibility. If anything it add more. It adds different responsibilities. This is why the duties of a Lance Corporal and a Staff Sergeant are not the same. Similarly, the duties of a Staff Sergeant and a Lieutenant are not the same. We all have our place to support the mission. If any of us do not do our jobs, the mission will fail. I do not work above my Chief (my senior enlisted advisor). I work with him. Together we execute the mission of my office within the overall mission of my unit. This is the brotherhood you were asking about.

There is always a bad example someone can cherry pick to point to and say "See, that guy was a bad officer! They must all be like that." This is logically implausible. It is easier to remember the failures than the daily amount of successes. I can name you all of the SNCOs I have written adverse Fitreps on. That doesn't mean for a moment that all SNCOs are bad Marines. Of course not. I am privileged to have one of the top SNCOs in my field in my office. What it does mean is that you have to be realistic when evaluating what someone is telling you.

[101matt1]

Maybe I'm being completely ignorant to the other side of the argument, but I'll try to clarify my intentions a bit better.

I really actually wanted to know what enlisted Marines thought of the relationship. Sure, I haven't asked an officer this question, but my view before this thread was that enlisted Marines may not have a good relationship (besides that of superior - subordinate) with their officer. I just wanted to see what an enlisted man (or woman) thought of the relationship they have with their officers. I certainly didn't mean that that is the only opinion that matters. But that's what I was after.

Also, maybe I shouldn't have used the word 'brotherhood', but friendship. I was asking if officers still joke around, have some fun with both their subordinates and their peers. I understand that the brotherhood that Marine to Marine has is so so soooo much deeper than that. So maybe that was a mistake by my use of wording. I certainly didn't mean brotherhood in that way. Friendship is more fitting.

What I meant by the training question was that I didn't know if these exercises are done on the Platoon level, company level, or battalion level, or some of all three. My reasoning was, if it's a platoon level exercise, then the company commander may not go, since all the platoons aren't on that exercise. Plus, I was under the assumption that moving up through the ranks gives you much more paperwork, in which case, the field may not be the most productive place for you. Regardless, I see otherwise now.

I understand your last point. Makes sense.

I appreciate the reply sir. Some good insight there.