40 Vets die on Phoenix VA 'secret' wait list scheme (w/video)
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    40 Vets die on Phoenix VA 'secret' wait list scheme (w/video)

    A fatal wait: Veterans languish and die on a VA hospital's secret list

    By Scott Bronstein and Drew Griffin, CNN Investigations
    updated 9:15 AM EDT, Thu April 24, 2014

    (CNN) -- At least 40 U.S. veterans died waiting for appointments at the Phoenix Veterans Affairs Health Care system, many of whom were placed on a secret waiting list.

    The secret list was part of an elaborate scheme designed by Veterans Affairs managers in Phoenix who were trying to hide that 1,400 to 1,600 sick veterans were forced to wait months to see a doctor, according to a recently retired top VA doctor and several high-level sources.

    For six months, CNN has been reporting on extended delays in health care appointments suffered by veterans across the country and who died while waiting for appointments and care.

    But the new revelations about the Phoenix VA are perhaps the most disturbing and striking to come to light thus far.

    Internal e-mails obtained by CNN show that top management at the VA hospital in Arizona knew about the practice and even defended it.

    Dr. Sam Foote just retired after spending 24 years with the VA system in Phoenix. The veteran doctor told CNN in an exclusive interview that the Phoenix VA works off two lists for patient appointments:

    There's an "official" list that's shared with officials in Washington and shows the VA has been providing timely appointments, which Foote calls a sham list. And then there's the real list that's hidden from outsiders, where wait times can last more than a year.

    Deliberate scheme, shredded evidence

    The scheme was deliberately put in place to avoid the VA's own internal rules," said Foote in Phoenix. "They developed the secret waiting list," said Foote, a respected local physician.

    The VA requires its hospitals to provide care to patients in a timely manner, typically within 14 to 30 days, Foote said.

    According to Foote, the elaborate scheme in Phoenix involved shredding evidence to hide the long list of veterans waiting for appointments and care. Officials at the VA, Foote says, instructed their staff to not actually make doctor's appointments for veterans within the computer system.

    Instead, Foote says, when a veteran comes in seeking an appointment, "they enter information into the computer and do a screen capture hard copy printout. They then do not save what was put into the computer so there's no record that you were ever here," he said.

    According to Foote, the information was gathered on the secret electronic list and then the information that would show when veterans first began waiting for an appointment was actually destroyed.

    "That hard copy, if you will, that has the patient demographic information is then taken and placed onto a secret electronic waiting list, and then the data that is on that paper is shredded," Foote said.

    "So the only record that you have ever been there requesting care was on that secret list," he said. "And they wouldn't take you off that secret list until you had an appointment time that was less than 14 days so it would give the appearance that they were improving greatly the waiting times, when in fact they were not."

    Foote estimates right now the number of veterans waiting on the "secret list" to see a primary care physician is somewhere between 1,400 and 1,600.

    Doctor: It's a 'frustrated' staff

    "I feel very sorry for the people who work at the Phoenix VA," said Foote. "They're all frustrated. They're all upset. They all wish they could leave 'cause they know what they're doing is wrong.

    "But they have families, they have mortgages and if they speak out or say anything to anybody about it, they will be fired and they know that."

    Several other high-level VA staff confirmed Foote's description to CNN and confirmed this is exactly how the secret list works in Phoenix.

    Foote says the Phoenix wait times reported back to Washington were entirely fictitious. "So then when they did that, they would report to Washington, 'Oh yeah. We're makin' our appointments within -- within 10 days, within the 14-day frame,' when in reality it had been six, nine, in some cases 21 months," he said.

    In the case of 71-year-old Navy veteran Thomas Breen, the wait on the secret list ended much sooner.

    "We had noticed that he started to have bleeding in his urine," said Teddy Barnes-Breen, his son. "So I was like, 'Listen, we gotta get you to the doctor.' "


    The rest of the story w/video:

    http://www.cnn.com/2014/04/23/health...html?hpt=hp_t1








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  2. #2
    I know when I was in the Phoenix VA system, the staff is way overloaded, not enough Docs., and it is the same here in Michigan, not enough doctors, I here that complaint here in the Grand Rapids clinic all the time,,
    and this is what O-care will do for everyone as well...


  3. #3
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    WOW !!! How shocking and sad. I have never heard of anything like this before.
    I must be one of the fortunate ones that I am in a VA Healthcare System that is top notch in New England.

    I am upset to say the least by this news..



  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by irpat54 View Post
    I know when I was in the Phoenix VA system, the staff is way overloaded, not enough Docs., and it is the same here in Michigan, not enough doctors, I here that complaint here in the Grand Rapids clinic all the time,,
    and this is what O-care will do for everyone as well...
    VA Director at Phoenix Hospital Got $9K Bonus
    40 vets died from delays at facility



    The director of the Phoenix VA hospital where at least 40 military veterans died from delays received more than $9,000 in bonus pay in 2013, public records show.

    Last year, Sharon Helman, the director of the Phoenix Veterans Affairs Health Care System, got a $9,345 bonus, in addition to her annual base salary of $169,900. Overall, leadership at the hospital was paid more than $700,000 in taxpayer money, according to publicly available salary data.

    CNN reported Wednesday that at least 40 patients have died at the Phoenix Veterans Affairs Health Care System because of delays in treatment, and many of them were placed on a secret list to hide the wait times from officials in Washington.

    According to internal emails obtained by CNN, top management at the Phoenix hospital, including Helman, was aware of the practice and defended it.

    Chief of staff Darren Deering made a handsome $233,000.

    Associate director Lance Robinson was paid $131,000

    Associate director of patient care services Nancy Claflin was paid $141,000 in 2013.

    Salary data was not available for assistant director John Scherpf.

    “I am not aware of any secret list, nor did I direct staff to have a secret list,” Helman told a local news channel on Friday.

    Arizona Republican Sens. John McCain and Jeff Flake have called for a Senate investigation of the Phoenix VA scandal.

    The VA Office of Inspector General is scheduled to begin its own investigation next week.


  5. #5
    their all paid with tax payers money,, unless they are volunteers....
    but
    I think some things need to change,, first there needs to be more doctors brought on board,, and second congress needs to do it's job of oversight,, because now they will be all outraged and put it all on the VA but in fact some of the blame for the dead Vets falls on them as well for their failure to provide proper oversight..


  6. #6
    Marine Free Member HST's Avatar
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    Hey! Its all Obama's fault, Right ? Gimme a break, its the VA mentality, they killed my brother and covered it up, they've been doing the same sh*t to vets for years the guys who were exposed to radiation in the tests after WWII were denied until most of them were dead, after that came the psych drug tests and then the big one agent orange then it was the gulf war stuff. The VA has killed more good American fighting men and women than all of the evil empires combined.


  7. #7
    well maybe not quit that much,, but no,,, it's not Obama's fault, it is, IMO the VA's and the lack of oversight by the congress, that is their job,, oversight,, cheese and crackers, you way to Obama sensitive...


  8. #8
    Marine Free Member FistFu68's Avatar
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    F**K Obama that SOB could care less about Vets struggling 2 Stay Alive


  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by FistFu68 View Post
    F**K Obama that SOB could care less about Vets struggling 2 Stay Alive
    on that I agree 100%,, he has no concern what so ever for the veterans,, period!!!!


  10. #10
    A secret waiting list? This is despicable at best and further proves our VA system wanes with regards to treating and taking care of our veterans.


  11. #11
    FoxtrotOscar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky C View Post
    WOW !!! How shocking and sad. I have never heard of anything like this before.
    I must be one of the fortunate ones that I am in a VA Healthcare System that is top notch in New England.

    I am upset to say the least by this news..
    Yep, until "Your Name" is placed on a list, but remember.. it's for a good cause...

    Their Bonus's...!!!



  12. #12
    some VA hospitals are TOP NOCH medical facilities, with proper staff levels and good doctors and facilities... then, there are the VA Hospitals that are run by non medically trained "administrators" ie: bean counters or accountants who only see the "bottom line", and their only agenda is to reduce costs and services to veterans, while "padding" their "bonus" money.... I have seen our local VA Hospital go from being one of the former and becoming one of the latter over a period of about the last 6 years.....


  13. #13
    This just adds another layer to a story earlier this year about some Vets dying while waiting months to get a colonoscopy.




  14. #14
    Marine Free Member Riven37's Avatar
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    "Never trust your Government they do not trust you therefore trust not the VA system for they are your Government."


  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by FoxtrotOscar View Post
    Yep, until "Your Name" is placed on a list, but remember.. it's for a good cause...

    Their Bonus's...!!!
    you know how true it that,, everything is money.. the days of Doctors being in it just for helping are over, now, most are in it for the money, and with O-care coming more and more on line the Docs and Hospitals will be dwindling and the VA will more then likely be made to handle the public at large. then the big O has his single payer plan..


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