What do you know a call for knowledge

[BGW]

Hey whats going on guys its me again. I am here to tap into the leatherneck resources and see what I can learn. Here we go.

I went to MSG school house couple months ago, however I got dropped. Got sent to Camp Lejeune because the Marine Corps did not see fit to send me back to Okinawa. But this is the problem.

The extention that I obtained in order to do a full three tour on MSG. I spoked to quite a few Marines and I get two responses. One side says yes I can revoke the extention, while others side with the extention can not be revoked. I spoke to my new units career planner, he flat out told me that I cant cancel my extention.

I emailed my old career planner that did my extention, he told me that I can revoke the extention. I just need to put in a package and route it up to have it signed off. He did mention that higher ups may not sign it off. I was told that because I extended my contract for the single purpose of MSG tour, and that it since I no longer doing it I can get my extention revoked.

Anyone have any experiences with extentions and posibilities revoking them? I know one Marine who had an extention and was able to revoke it because his original contract had not passed his original EAS date. But he also claimed to be suicidal so I gues they just decided to be done with him.

Care to share?

[RNC]

I don't know how it is now, but back in 84 the call came down for volunteers for MSG duty. It was available to all MOS's, you just needed to have at least three years left on your contract, or you could extend up to one year to add up to the three. The word then was that once you extended, you were obligated whether or not you made it through the school.
I gave it some thought for a moment and then realized that I had it pretty good right where I was.

[Phantom Blooper]

You may want to PM this Marine.....he was in MSG and was a watch commander....

He may be able to help you.

http://www.leatherneck.com/forums/member.php?u=82284

Tennessee Top is his screen name....good luck!

[BGW]

Thanks for the help I appreciate it.

[Tennessee Top]

Sorry to hear you got dropped from MSG school; that particular school has a high attrition rate because not only do they train future MSG's but students are also screened by both the USMC and Department of State for the program. Getting dropped from this school does not mean you are a bad Marine or poor performer as they look for different qualities than other programs; I saw former DI's not make it through as well as grunts with outstanding records in the FMF.

Yes, I was both a watchstander and Detachment Commander on the MSG program as well as the MSG School Operations Chief. Also spent some time as a Battalion Career Planner in the FMF. During that time, extensions were still valid whether you made it through school or not and you had to sign a page 11 entry stating you understood that (so, everyone understood the gamble they were taking). Just like any contract, unless it is specifically noted on the actual extension document a specific reason for the extension, then you are considered extending your contract for the time and not a specific purpose. You should have asked this question BEFORE signing the document (just like with any contract you enter into).

Obviously, the rules may be different now than they were back in the day. First thing you should do is read the actual extension document. If that does not clear it up then a visit to your legal officer is in order.

Good luck to you.

[BGW]

Sorry to hear you got dropped from MSG school; that particular school has a high attrition rate because not only do they train future MSG's but students are also screened by both the USMC and Department of State for the program. Getting dropped from this school does not mean you are a bad Marine or poor performer as they look for different qualities than other programs; I saw former DI's not make it through as well as grunts with outstanding records in the FMF.

Yes, I was both a watchstander and Detachment Commander on the MSG program as well as the MSG School Operations Chief. Also spent some time as a Battalion Career Planner in the FMF. During that time, extensions were still valid whether you made it through school or not and you had to sign a page 11 entry stating you understood that (so, everyone understood the gamble they were taking). Just like any contract, unless it is specifically noted on the actual extension document a specific reason for the extension, then you are considered extending your contract for the time and not a specific purpose. You should have asked this question BEFORE signing the document (just like with any contract you enter into).

Obviously, the rules may be different now than they were back in the day. First thing you should do is read the actual extension document. If that does not clear it up then a visit to your legal officer is in order.

Good luck to you.

Thanks for the input. I will admit it was quite different then what I was expecting, I never understood why MSG school had such high attrition rate until I went there and saw what they really were looking for in Marines. You have to be a perfect saint and hopfully lucky enough not to be put in a tough situation where you might make a mistake. They are so unforgiving but I gues thats just how they want to roll.

As for contracts, your right. It wasnt until my experience with MSG was when I really started taking a deep look at these things and not just go along with signing paper work. I do not have any of the original paper work on my extention.

Are you saying that if the original extention paperwork says specifically the purpose for the extention I might be able to work with it?

The paper work for extentions, are they all universal? As in will they all be worded exactly the same regardless the reasons? Or would my career planner or who ever per say, might alter the wording of my extention paper work? My knowledge of contracts and such are very limited, especially when it comes to Marine Corps.

Thanks again

[TunTvrnWarrior]

BGW, go to S-1 and grab your SRB and sit down with one of the office pogs. Look through it for any contract info and read it carefully. Pick the admin's brain, preferably a salty LCPL or CPL or SGT. Find out what you have and dont have. If they will give you a copy of your SRB make one.

[Carpshooter]

The only time I talked to a career adviser while in the Corps , was called in by 'em , was asked what was wrong with me as my pro & cons were so low that that career sergeant had ever seen and wanted to know how I ever got out of boot camp with thoses marks ?

I just replied that I was tuffer than my beloved DIs , who just couldn't break me , even with all that extra PT that I got much more being mid-section hit about a few dozen times . I had those low marks all the way until the end of my time in the Corps , when a Lt. Colonel changed 'em at the end of my 24 months , most of noticed me doing my thing while in Nam !

Amazing that I ever made any rank at all , as I have a note on my DD214 stating that my perfect conduct period started when I got drafted !

[Tennessee Top]

Thanks for the input. I will admit it was quite different then what I was expecting, I never understood why MSG school had such high attrition rate until I went there and saw what they really were looking for in Marines. You have to be a perfect saint and hopfully lucky enough not to be put in a tough situation where you might make a mistake. They are so unforgiving but I gues thats just how they want to roll.

As for contracts, your right. It wasnt until my experience with MSG was when I really started taking a deep look at these things and not just go along with signing paper work. I do not have any of the original paper work on my extention.

Are you saying that if the original extention paperwork says specifically the purpose for the extention I might be able to work with it?

The paper work for extentions, are they all universal? As in will they all be worded exactly the same regardless the reasons? Or would my career planner or who ever per say, might alter the wording of my extention paper work? My knowledge of contracts and such are very limited, especially when it comes to Marine Corps.

Thanks again

Yes, you NEED to read the extension document (back in the day, it was placed on top of your current contract in your SRB). Back then, it would say something to the effect of "to qualify for MSG school" or "to attend MSG school". If this is the case, you did that and so you got what you extended for and are obligated to fulfill the extension. The extensions never said "to serve a tour on the MSG program" or something similar to that.

You are allowed to make mistakes at MSG school (how else are you going to learn). But you are correct; it is a highly unforgiving environment. Probably the most important trait they screen for is integrity because you must be counted on to not sleep on post, take girls into your room, etc. You also must be able to think quickly on your feet and make the right decisions (what you do or do not do may decide the fate of all the Americans working at your embassy, the building itself, or the classified material stored there).

[Beltayn]

Sorry to hear you didn't make it through the schoolhouse BGW. We're certainly hurting for Marines right now, but standards are standards.

Tennessee Top's scoop is still relevant. I'm afraid that extensions remain valid, regardless of being dropped from the schoolhouse. This is something you signed for and should have been specifically briefed on by your career planner if they were doing their job correctly.

Good luck.

[BGW]

These things happen for a reason, I figured of course the extension probably will be unable to be revoked. So maybe because I have an extra 16 months on my contract, you think that would give me an edge in lat moving into something else? Maybe I can use this to my advantage....

lol but still Camp Lejeune is quite a difficult place to get use to.

[Beltayn]

No harm in going for a lat move if that's something you want to do.

[BGW]

I wanted to revive this old thread just so who ever comes across this thread might help them out a bit.

Any how as far as the extension on my contract goes, I was able to revoke it. My career planner was useless, but lucky I was able to find a Marine Corps Order on this very subject.

http://www.marines.mil/news/publicat...0P1040.31J.pdf

Page 47

4201. CANCELLATION OF VOLUNTARY EXTENSION AGREEMENT

1. Cancellation of voluntary extensions of enlistment is not authorized on
or after the effective date. Marines currently serving on an extension may
only be separated by a discharge or a transfer to the FMCR. Request for
separation of a Marine due to an erroneous extension of enlistment which is
in effect must be submitted to the CMC (MMSR) per MCO P1900.16, Marine Corps Separations and Retirement Manual (MARCORSEPMAN).

2. Commanders are authorized to cancel an extension of enlistment before its effective date upon approval from the CMC under the following circumstances:


a. When the Marine's performance of duty so warrants. In this instance, assignment of reenlistment eligibility code RE-4 is required.

b. When the Marine's physical condition so warrants. This includes assignment to weight control or limited duty.

c. When a Marine is declared a deserter.

d. When a Marine extends to attend a service school and is dropped from the course because of a failure to maintain satisfactory progress or because
of misconduct.

So there you go, you can in fact revoke your extension as long as you do not go upon the effective date that your extension starts.