Group sues to stop Ground Zero Mosque

[USNAviator]

NEW YORK – The debate over a planned Islamic community center and mosque near ground zero became a court fight Wednesday, as a conservative advocacy group sued to try to stop a project that has become a fulcrum for balancing religious freedom and the legacy of the Sept. 11 attacks.

The American Center for Law and Justice, founded by the Rev. Pat Robertson, filed suit Wednesday to challenge a city panel's decision to let developers tear down a building to make way for the mosque two blocks from ground zero.

The city Landmarks Preservation Commission moved too fast in making a decision, underappreciated the building's historic value and "allowed the intended use of the building and political considerations to taint the deliberative process," lawyer Brett Joshpe wrote in papers filed in a Manhattan state court. The Washington, D.C.-based group represents a firefighter who responded to and survived the terrorist attack at the World Trade Center.

City attorneys are confident the landmarks group adhered to legal standards and procedures, Law Department spokeswoman Kate O'Brien Ahlers said. A spokesman for the planned Islamic center, Oz Sultan, declined to comment on the lawsuit but said organizers were continuing to work toward choosing an architect.

The mosque has become a national political flashpoint, pitting several influential Republicans and the nation's most prominent Jewish civil rights group against New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg and others.

[hbharrison]

I have said nothing until now but I do believe this is nothing more than Muslems telling us to stick it they are the ones. So to that I say I hope and pray to GOD that this legal battle ends with no mosque.

[Danny C Smith]

I just really think this is a bad idea.
Something, way down in my gut tells me that nothing "good"
can come of this.
Nothing good.

[hbharrison]

Smitty, I believe that is what they want and that no matter what happens this is not going to turn out good that is why I said I will pray to GOD on this one.

[Marine84]

You know................I been thinking. Wonder what would happen if we decided we wanted to live in A$$crackistan, build a church, and we women won't wear burkas AND we show LOTS of cleavage, while we stand over our BBQ pits where you can walk right up and fix your own damned sandwich picking pork right off the carca$$. Chances are we wouldn't last 30 minutes.

Yet I (me and myself) am supposed to be concerned about offending Muslims by hoping they won't be granted permission to build a Mosque near Ground Zero? I don't even live in NY and I feel like I've been slapped in the face. It's like we're cowering down and saying "sure, we can live with you amongst us even though you did so much damage to us all in one morning - we can forget about it".

Just don't seem right, does it?

[Phantom Blooper]

we women won't wear burkas AND we show LOTS of cleavage,

I SAY GO FOR IT....DON'T LET YOU OR VICTORIA HAVE ANY SECRETS!:evilgrin:

[Marine84]

LOL @ PB!

It would probably offend even some of you horn dogs! LOL!

[Wyoming]

Pictures Kim, pictures.

[Phantom Blooper]

LOL @ PB!

It would probably offend even some of you horn dogs! LOL!


To see if my eyes would be offended I would have to see pictures.....being that I am a hands on type of man.:beer:

:evilgrin:

[hbharrison]

Kim not much good offend these old eyes anymore:beer:

[Danny C Smith]

You know................I been thinking. Wonder what would happen if we decided we wanted to live in A$$crackistan, build a church, and we women won't wear burkas AND we show LOTS of cleavage, while we stand over our BBQ pits where you can walk right up and fix your own damned sandwich picking pork right off the carca$$. Chances are we wouldn't last 30 minutes.

Yet I (me and myself) am supposed to be concerned about offending Muslims by hoping they won't be granted permission to build a Mosque near Ground Zero? I don't even live in NY and I feel like I've been slapped in the face. It's like we're cowering down and saying "sure, we can live with you amongst us even though you did so much damage to us all in one morning - we can forget about it".

Just don't seem right, does it?

No it don't seem right and it isn't.
What you wrote here 84 was what I was thinking.
I just don't have the ability to communicate well.
Thanks :usmc:

[AdirondackDog]

They can put it up next to the Pine Tree Rifle Club in my home town.

[Big Jim]

You know................I been thinking. Wonder what would happen if we decided we wanted to live in A$$crackistan, build a church, and we women won't wear burkas AND we show LOTS of cleavage, while we stand over our BBQ pits where you can walk right up and fix your own damned sandwich picking pork right off the carca$$. Chances are we wouldn't last 30 minutes.

Yet I (me and myself) am supposed to be concerned about offending Muslims by hoping they won't be granted permission to build a Mosque near Ground Zero? I don't even live in NY and I feel like I've been slapped in the face. It's like we're cowering down and saying "sure, we can live with you amongst us even though you did so much damage to us all in one morning - we can forget about it".

Just don't seem right, does it?

Watch out Kim....you might "offend" some of these pro-Muslim advocates 'round here.....like KFH, Barr, Fatty.....just to name a few. THEY believe this mosque has EVERY right to be built right where so many American citizens lost their lives. Its so stupid to even believe that to begin with not to mention to even build that frikkin thing I know....but they're entitled to their opinions...I guess.....

[brian0351]

Watch out Kim....you might "offend" some of these pro-Muslim advocates 'round here.....like KFH, Barr, Fatty.....just to name a few. THEY believe this mosque has EVERY right to be built right where so many American citizens lost their lives. Its so stupid to even believe that to begin with not to mention to even build that frikkin thing I know....but they're entitled to their opinions...I guess.....


"Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

The fact is they have the right to build it anywhere. I may not be a big fan of this either but it is a constitutionally protected right. So I support their effort. After all we allow Japanese people to live in Hawaii.

[Marine84]

After all we allow Japanese people to live in Hawaii.

We aren't talking about the Japanese in Hawaii.

It just seems unfair and disrespectful as hell! Some of these radical Muslims are probably some of these "illegal aliens" that we keep b!tchin' about - they're not all Mexicans you know.

If I could get the same privledges in their country, I would say "Sure, put one of them gold domes up and have at it." I would even make sure the front door faced towards Mecca for them if that's what they wanted.

I'm with HB and a lot of other folks - nothing good is going to come of it. It bothered me to death when I saw a clip of a Reverand telling a reporter that he thought it was a good idea and that it was "for the people".

If they want to build a Mosque, why not pick another part of town? Does it HAVE to be built at THIS particular location? Seems like just out of respect they wouldn't build it here but, ................................

[Big Jim]

"Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

The fact is they have the right to build it anywhere. I may not be a big fan of this either but it is a constitutionally protected right. So I support their effort. After all we allow Japanese people to live in Hawaii.

But we aren't at war with the Japanese.....and we do have active agreements and treaties with the Japanese. What do you have with the Afghanis or Iraqi people......besides war.....?

[FattyTheFerret]

[B][SIZE="4"][COLOR="Red"]

But we aren't at war with the Japanese.....and we do have active agreements and treaties with the Japanese. What do you have with the Afghanis or Iraqi people......besides war.....?

In case you didn't notice we currently do have a relationship with the Iraqi and Afghan governments. We aren't at war with either of those countries. Now care to tell the class which of the 9/11 hijackers were Iraqi? Which ones were Afghani?

[Marine84]

I think it's a sad day when somebody that's not even from here (and doesn't have/want/need citizenship) can have more say so over what goes on in this country than ones that have fought for it and/or lived in it their entire lives.

[hbharrison]

I think it's a sad day when somebody that's not even from here (and doesn't have/want/need citizenship) can have more say so over what goes on in this country than ones that have fought for it and/or lived in it their entire lives.

I'll second that:thumbup:

[Mistybluelady]

Every Friday Mosques in the Middle East ring with the shrill prayers and monotonous chants that call down death, destruction and damnation on American and its people.American citizens have been murdered in this terror war for 30 yrs. Even after 9/11 there are some that say we must "address their grievances". Yes the have a right to their religion, but a mosque at ground zero? After 9/11 Saudi Prince Al-Walleed bin Talal tried to donate $ 10 million dollars to New York city, it was rejected. No Mosque should every grace ground zero. Just my opinion

[USNAviator]

Every Friday Mosques in the Middle East ring with the shrill prayers and monotonous chants that call down death, destruction and damnation on American and its people.American citizens have been murdered in this terror war for 30 yrs. Even after 9/11 there are some that say we must "address their grievances". Yes the have a right to their religion, but a mosque at ground zero? After 9/11 Saudi Prince Al-Walleed bin Talal tried to donate $ 10 million dollars to New York city, it was rejected. No Mosque should every grace ground zero. Just my opinion

That's an outstanding bit of insight I did not know. Thank you for your thoughtful contribution :thumbup:

[AAV Crewchief]

Watch out Kim....you might "offend" some of these pro-Muslim advocates 'round here.....like KFH, Barr, Fatty.....just to name a few. THEY believe this mosque has EVERY right to be built right where so many American citizens lost their lives. Its so stupid to even believe that to begin with not to mention to even build that frikkin thing I know....but they're entitled to their opinions...I guess.....

No, they are right and we are just racists for believing what we believe about Muslims despite the body count that they keep piling up of fellow American servicemembers.:sick:

[TJR1070]

First they name the organization the Cordoba iniative which is a site of muslim conquest (which they justed changed this week to Park51), then when asked for sensitivity to the New Yorkers that lost friends and family they called us bigots and racists, now in yesterday's NY Newsday they are threatening us. As quoted in above mentioned paper on page A20; Dr. Saud Anwar of the American muslim peace initiative said "The continuing debate is reverberating poorly in the muslim world outside the U.S. It's giving more power to extremists in all parts of the world and it is growing more anti-American sentiment."

Who the fvck do these people think they are? There are upset over an internal political division in OUR country? What are they going to do fly more planes into another set of buildings and try for a mosque site there? Any American that supports a symbol of islamic domination at this site is naive at best!

[kenrobg30]

Kim not much good offend these old eyes anymore:beer:
It might soothe your head-ache Butch. Go fit it! :evilgrin: S/F!! Ken

[kenrobg30]

Did not build a Shinto Shrine, on the Arizona Memorial, and they paid in blood for the war they started. The muzlim s, as a whole, did not even apologize for what their people did in New York. Notice, I did not mention any one muzlim nation, since the attack was a multi-national effort, by muzlims. S/F!! KEN

[FattyTheFerret]

I think it's a sad day when somebody that's not even from here (and doesn't have/want/need citizenship) can have more say so over what goes on in this country than ones that have fought for it and/or lived in it their entire lives.

What are you talking about? The muslims that want to build this are American citizens. Natural born. Some of them may have even fought for this country. Why are you making the assumption that they're foreigners?

Who exactly do you think is getting this authority over what goes on here?

[FattyTheFerret]

Did not build a Shinto Shrine, on the Arizona Memorial, and they paid in blood for the war they started. The muzlim s, as a whole, did not even apologize for what their people did in New York. Notice, I did not mention any one muzlim nation, since the attack was a multi-national effort, by muzlims. S/F!! KEN

The muslim people do not need to apologize because it wasn't an act carried out by the entire religion. The attacks were condemned by every major muslim organization in the country and many of them around the world.

Did the american citizens of japanese origin have to apologize for pearl harbor? Besides being forced into internment camps, of course. :sick:

[AAV Crewchief]

"Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

The fact is they have the right to build it anywhere. I may not be a big fan of this either but it is a constitutionally protected right. So I support their effort. After all we allow Japanese people to live in Hawaii.


I never saw the Japanese wanting to put up a Buddhist (forgive my spelling) temple on top of where the USS Arizona is or even near Pearl Harbor. That is the difference.

[AAV Crewchief]

The muslim people do not need to apologize because it wasn't an act carried out by the entire religion. The attacks were condemned by every major muslim organization in the country and many of them around the world.
HORSE****!!!!!! CAIR did not condemn the 9-11 attack. It is the leading Islamic organization in the United States being that it derives its initials from "Council For Islamic American Relations". Obama's pastor even said "America had it coming".


NUf said FATAH.

[AAV Crewchief]

.

Did the american citizens of japanese origin have to apologize for pearl harbor? Besides being forced into internment camps, of course. :sick:

It was the right thing to do at the time and it was more or less aimed at Japanese who immigrated and become citizens. Considering we have seen a lot of American Taliban and such, Roosevelt got it spot on.

[AAV Crewchief]

First they name the organization the Cordoba iniative which is a site of muslim conquest (which they justed changed this week to Park51), then when asked for sensitivity to the New Yorkers that lost friends and family they called us bigots and racists, now in yesterday's NY Newsday they are threatening us. As quoted in above mentioned paper on page A20; Dr. Saud Anwar of the American muslim peace initiative said "The continuing debate is reverberating poorly in the muslim world outside the U.S. It's giving more power to extremists in all parts of the world and it is growing more anti-American sentiment."

Who the fvck do these people think they are? There are upset over an internal political division in OUR country? What are they going to do fly more planes into another set of buildings and try for a mosque site there? Any American that supports a symbol of islamic domination at this site is naive at best!
:thumbup:

[Marine84]

What are you talking about? The muslims that want to build this are American citizens. Natural born. Some of them may have even fought for this country. Why are you making the assumption that they're foreigners?

Who exactly do you think is getting this authority over what goes on here?

Just making sure you're paying attention there muskrat ;)

Really hadn't looked that far into it to be quite honest but, now that I've been informed, it makes it worse in my book. They, of all people, should understand, show some respect and just build the damned thing SOMEPLACE ELSE.

[FattyTheFerret]

NUf said FATAH.
CAIR did condemn 9/11.

http://www.cair.com/AmericanMuslims/AntiTerrorism/CAIRstatementsontheeventsofSeptember11.aspx


Stop being dishonest. I've shown you this multiple times.

http://www.muhajabah.com/otherscondemn.php


Obama's pastor is not a muslim nor are you putting what he said into context.

[FattyTheFerret]

It was the right thing to do at the time No, it wasn't. That is absolutely disgusting that you would support the internment of American citizens. You swore an oath to defend against that very thing; act like it.

[FattyTheFerret]

Just making sure you're paying attention there muskrat ;)

Really hadn't looked that far into it to be quite honest but, now that I've been informed, it makes it worse in my book. They, of all people, should understand, show some respect and just build the damned thing SOMEPLACE ELSE.

Why should they? They've been in that area, holding services on that same exact block, for decades. You should have some respect for your fellow americans and support their first amendment rights.

[Mistybluelady]

A survey was published in USA Today, the survey queried Arab Americans. 82% of Muslims, benefiting from America, protected by America, enjoying freedom in America, were not willing to fight for America. I believe that says the majority do not believe in the fight against any arab nation for any reason period. As for CAIR, the Council on American-Islamic Relations, Kamal Nawash, founder and president of the Free Muslim Coalition tried to organize a rally in Washington DC for moderate Muslim to condem terrorism and radical Islam. CAIR declined to stand with him against extremests, they not only refused to participate but became defensive and began attacking Nawash. Moderate Muslims need to take a closer look at who and what groups they are supporting. I lived in Saudi, I was not given any rights, any choice to worship in a Christian church. You could also look at the case of the Islamic Thinkers Society in Jackson Heights New York. Demonstrating on a street corner in exercise of the " protected rights" they stomped and tore up the American Flag.

Although I am not American.... I say..... build your Mosque elsewhere.

[USNAviator]

A survey was published in USA Today, the survey queried Arab Americans. 82% of Muslims, benefiting from America, protected by America, enjoying freedom in America, were not willing to fight for America. I believe that says the majority do not believe in the fight against any arab nation for any reason period. As for CAIR, the Council on American-Islamic Relations, Kamal Nawash, founder and president of the Free Muslim Coalition tried to organize a rally in Washington DC for moderate Muslim to condem terrorism and radical Islam. CAIR declined to stand with him against extremests, they not only refused to participate but became defensive and began attacking Nawash. Moderate Muslims need to take a closer look at who and what groups they are supporting. I lived in Saudi, I was not given any rights, any choice to worship in a Christian church. You could also look at the case of the Islamic Thinkers Society in Jackson Heights New York. Demonstrating on a street corner in exercise of the " protected rights" they stomped and tore up the American Flag.

Although I am not American.... I say..... build your Mosque elsewhere.


Thank you once again for a very insightful and personal update. You're experiences in Saudi must have been an eye opener to say the least

[brian0351]

A survey was published in USA Today, the survey queried Arab Americans. 82% of Muslims, benefiting from America, protected by America, enjoying freedom in America, were not willing to fight for America. I believe that says the majority do not believe in the fight against any arab nation for any reason period. As for CAIR, the Council on American-Islamic Relations, Kamal Nawash, founder and president of the Free Muslim Coalition tried to organize a rally in Washington DC for moderate Muslim to condem terrorism and radical Islam. CAIR declined to stand with him against extremests, they not only refused to participate but became defensive and began attacking Nawash. Moderate Muslims need to take a closer look at who and what groups they are supporting. I lived in Saudi, I was not given any rights, any choice to worship in a Christian church. You could also look at the case of the Islamic Thinkers Society in Jackson Heights New York. Demonstrating on a street corner in exercise of the " protected rights" they stomped and tore up the American Flag.

Although I am not American.... I say..... build your Mosque elsewhere.

...because no-one else in America has desecrated a flag as a form of protest? That action isn't an act committed solely by that group of people. I can't find anything in the news about that either. A link would be appreciated.

So you didn't have any rights in Saudi...those are the rules of that sovereign nation. (not saying it's right) So your saying because you didn't have any rights over there, that we should not extend rights to Muslims in our country? Doesn't that go against everything America stands for?

[Marine84]

You should have some respect for your fellow americans and support their first amendment rights.

I think I have been. I haven't tried to shove pork down anybody's throats, spit on anybody, cut a head off and tape it, beat one to death, blown anybody up or said anything against/to them to provoke violence. I'm OK with anybody doing anything they want as long as they don't try to shove it down my throat.

[Mistybluelady]

I at no point said they shouldn't be able to exercise their rights. Absolutely they have the right to worship, as does any denomination. Over 300 firefighters died that day, and countless Americans... as the wife of a firefighter, i still think a mosque built on that sight, is in poor taste.

As for a link... well i can not provide one... but the article was called "Arab Americans speak out" in USA Today.
another www.frontpagemagazine.com Joel Mowbray May 30th , 2005
another one " jihad America" produced by PBS

[FattyTheFerret]

I'm OK with anybody doing anything they want as long as they don't try to shove it down my throat.

:p then you should be ok with the mosque being built. unless you live on that block and the mosque's presence somehow directly affects you in some way, it's not being shoved down your throat.
I at no point said they shouldn't be able to exercise their rights. Absolutely they have the right to worship, as does any denomination. Over 300 firefighters died that day, and countless Americans... as the wife of a firefighter, i still think a mosque built on that sight, is in poor taste.

As for a link... well i can not provide one... but the article was called "Arab Americans speak out" in USA Today.
another www.frontpagemagazine.com Joel Mowbray May 30th , 2005
another one " jihad America" produced by PBS

But it's not on the site. It's a few blocks away. And in NYC that's damn near an entirely different neighborhood.

[Marine84]

Fatty, go chase your tail somewhere.

If I did live in NY, I would probably be more pi$$ed off about it, you're right. As I've said before, I don't have a problem with the building of a Mosque, just not there.

[Big Jim]

:p then you should be ok with the mosque being built. unless you live on that block and the mosque's presence somehow directly affects you in some way, it's not being shoved down your throat.

But it's not on the site. It's a few blocks away. And in NYC that's damn near an entirely different neighborhood.

Fatty.....your argumentativeness is truly out there, boy...I mean OUT THERE...!! ANYTHING for an argument to get your worthless point across, that seems to be what you are all about, right? You don't even see the stupidity of what you're arguing for or care who you're arguing as long as you get your worthless point across.

To me and to a lot of Marines here....that is just a waste of time and effort in trying to talk with you on a sensible level. I don't think you realize how you even look to other people. Not that you would care but its how you come off as an argumentative and severely judgmental know-it-all, yet you don't do anything about it except argue more people than I care to count over what people truly feel strongly and passionately about....such as this mosque being built NEAR the 9/11 site...!!! Peoples families and friends died there, boy....you NEED to understand that point.

In order to build your credibility and have your opinions really heard.....you're going to have to at least understand other peoples' points of view and maybe even see how they feel and learn why and what makes them feel that way. Honest concern is what makes you a good listener....not some idiotic argument that puts people down or making them feel stupid for what they feel. After you have that down....THEN and only then will people listen to you in return.....and maybe....just maybe...they will start to believe you.

Hope you learned something here, my boy.....

[FattyTheFerret]

Fatty, go chase your tail somewhere.

If I did live in NY, I would probably be more pi$$ed off about it, you're right. As I've said before, I don't have a problem with the building of a Mosque, just not there.

If your two statements didn't contradict each other I wouldn't be pointing it out. You said you're ok with people doing anything they want, that has to include building a mosque "there" because it's not being shoved down your throat.

That being said, it's still not being built on the site. It's blocks away. People didn't die at that site. And even if they did, continuing to connect the people building the mosque to the 9/11 hijackers solely because of their religion needs to be called out.


Fatty.....your argumentativeness is truly out there, boy...I mean OUT THERE...!! ANYTHING for an argument to get your worthless point across, that seems to be what you are all about, right? You don't even see the stupidity of what you're arguing for or care who you're arguing as long as you get your worthless point across.

To me and to a lot of Marines here....that is just a waste of time and effort in trying to talk with you on a sensible level. I don't think you realize how you even look to other people. Not that you would care yea, really don't :banana:
but its how you come off as an argumentative and severely judgmental know-it-all, yet you don't do anything about it except argue more people than I care to count over what people truly feel strongly and passionately about....such as this mosque being built NEAR the 9/11 site...!!! Peoples families and friends died there, boy....you NEED to understand that point. It's being built near it, not on it. What you NEED to understand is that the mosque does not represent the people who carried out that attack. It represents the other one and a half billion people on the planet that had nothing to do with it and were just as disgusted with it as any red blooded christian american.


In order to build your credibility and have your opinions really heard.....you're going to have to at least understand other peoples' points of view and maybe even see how they feel and learn why and what makes them feel that way. Honest concern is what makes you a good listener....not some idiotic argument that puts people down or making them feel stupid for what they feel. After you have that down....THEN and only then will people listen to you in return.....and maybe....just maybe...they will start to believe you.

Hope you learned something here, my boy.....

I have no need to build my credibility. If you don't like what I have to say, put me on your ignore list. I'm going to keep speaking my mind for the same reason that you and everyone else do.

[Marine84]

blah, blah, blah

[Big Jim]

If your two statements didn't contradict each other I wouldn't be pointing it out. You said you're ok with people doing anything they want, that has to include building a mosque "there" because it's not being shoved down your throat.

That being said, it's still not being built on the site. It's blocks away. People didn't die at that site. And even if they did, continuing to connect the people building the mosque to the 9/11 hijackers solely because of their religion needs to be called out.

yea, really don't :banana: It's being built near it, not on it. What you NEED to understand is that the mosque does not represent the people who carried out that attack. It represents the other one and a half billion people on the planet that had nothing to do with it and were just as disgusted with it as any red blooded christian american.

I have no need to build my credibility. If you don't like what I have to say, put me on your ignore list. I'm going to keep speaking my mind for the same reason that you and everyone else do.

WOW...what an incredibly thick-skulled idiot.....go back to your village Fatty....they miss you there...!!

[Phantom Blooper]

Kim....

Do you have any old trees in your yard?

Go out to that old tree and say the same argument that you are making here....

Take a brew or two with you in case if anyone asks you what you are doing you have an excuse.....talking to trees...a lock up offense in some domiciles.

Point being you can type and put out your viewpoint....but you will always get the Charlie Brown teacher routine from some that are ALWAYS going to reply to posts like this...

So you should should get a better response from that tree.....at least it has been around awhile and has a little G-2.

Wa WA WA WA WA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:evilgrin:

[brian0351]

Fatty.....your argumentativeness is truly out there, boy...I mean OUT THERE...!! ANYTHING for an argument to get your worthless point across, that seems to be what you are all about, right? You don't even see the stupidity of what you're arguing for or care who you're arguing as long as you get your worthless point across.

To me and to a lot of Marines here....that is just a waste of time and effort in trying to talk with you on a sensible level. I don't think you realize how you even look to other people. Not that you would care but its how you come off as an argumentative and severely judgmental know-it-all, yet you don't do anything about it except argue more people than I care to count over what people truly feel strongly and passionately about....such as this mosque being built NEAR the 9/11 site...!!! Peoples families and friends died there, boy....you NEED to understand that point.

In order to build your credibility and have your opinions really heard.....you're going to have to at least understand other peoples' points of view and maybe even see how they feel and learn why and what makes them feel that way. Honest concern is what makes you a good listener....not some idiotic argument that puts people down or making them feel stupid for what they feel. After you have that down....THEN and only then will people listen to you in return.....and maybe....just maybe...they will start to believe you.

Hope you learned something here, my boy.....


And Big Jim you're doing the EXACT same thing! Fatty is offering a counter point to people's arguments. I am sure he understands peoples emotions behind the issue. However like he has pointed out, they are not building the Mosque on the 9/11 site. Hell there is already a smaller mosque in the same neighborhood.

This forum is condemning the entire religion for the actions of a few radicals. Why doesn't anyone condemn all of Christianity for priest child molesters? Or Abortion doctor murders? Or that crazy sect of people that protest soldier's funerals?

Has anyone thought of the contrast of a Mosque in that area? The twin towers brought down by Islamic radicals and then a mosque built in order to teach people that Islam (like Christianity) is about peace and the worshiping of God. And before anyone jumps on any Quran passages that mention the killing of infidels, the bible has the same thing with the conversion of unbelievers.

Frankly I am tired of religion and I believe the world would be better off without it. However, our nation was built on the values that you have the freedom to worship whenever and where ever you chose in this country!

[FattyTheFerret]

WOW...what an incredibly thick-skulled idiot.....go back to your village Fatty....they miss you there...!!

it takes a village, people :banana:



Wa WA WA WA WA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:evilgrin:

trees are old corps :marine:

[Ed Palmer]

http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/7749/harboringnoresentment.jpg
http://www.nypost.com/opinion/cartoons/delonas/2010/08/08052010.jpg

[USNAviator]

From the Washington Post:

"On the morning of Tuesday, Sept. 11, 2001, I watched as terrorists slammed United Flight 175 into the South Tower of the World Trade Center, 18 minutes after their accomplices on another hijacked plane hit the North Tower. My mother was on the flight. I witnessed her murder on live television. I still cannot fully comprehend those images. In that moment, I died as well. I carry a hole in my heart that will never be filled. From the first memorial ceremonies I attended at Ground Zero, I have always been moved by the site; it means something to be close to where my mother may be buried, it brings some peace. That is why the prospect of a mosque near Ground Zero -- or a church or a synagogue or any religious or nationalistic monument or symbol -- troubles me.


I was born in pre-revolutionary Iran. My family led a largely secular existence -- I did not attend a religious school, I never wore a headscarf -- but for us, as for anyone there, Islam was part of our heritage, our culture, our entire lives. Though I have nothing but contempt for the fanaticism that propelled the terrorists to carry out their murderous attacks on Sept. 11, I still have great respect for the faith. Yet, I worry that the construction of the Cordoba House Islamic cultural center near the World Trade Center site would not promote tolerance or understanding; I fear it would become a symbol of victory for militant Muslims around the world."

[brian0351]

From the Washington Post:

"On the morning of Tuesday, Sept. 11, 2001, I watched as terrorists slammed United Flight 175 into the South Tower of the World Trade Center, 18 minutes after their accomplices on another hijacked plane hit the North Tower. My mother was on the flight. I witnessed her murder on live television. I still cannot fully comprehend those images. In that moment, I died as well. I carry a hole in my heart that will never be filled. From the first memorial ceremonies I attended at Ground Zero, I have always been moved by the site; it means something to be close to where my mother may be buried, it brings some peace. That is why the prospect of a mosque near Ground Zero -- or a church or a synagogue or any religious or nationalistic monument or symbol -- troubles me.


I was born in pre-revolutionary Iran. My family led a largely secular existence -- I did not attend a religious school, I never wore a headscarf -- but for us, as for anyone there, Islam was part of our heritage, our culture, our entire lives. Though I have nothing but contempt for the fanaticism that propelled the terrorists to carry out their murderous attacks on Sept. 11, I still have great respect for the faith. Yet, I worry that the construction of the Cordoba House Islamic cultural center near the World Trade Center site would not promote tolerance or understanding; I fear it would become a symbol of victory for militant Muslims around the world."


Thank you for posting that! I was waiting for someone to post a non-racist view as to why the mosque shouldn't be built.

[kenrobg30]

Irespect the message this person wants to get across to the rest of us, and I agree that not all people in the Far-East, are fanatical Religionists. That does not make me feel any less concerned, for the safety of my family, or any other family in this country, when they go to a shopping mall, or to work in a High-Rise office building. As in all parties, gangs, nations, and groups, there are twisted people, who maim, and kill just because they can. They can because they have religious or political Symbols to hide behind. The people of NYC will decide, either before, or after whether or not this Mosque will stand. I just hope it doesn't fall on the heads of innocent people. S/F!! Ken

[TJR1070]

It shouldn't be built because the families of the victims are asking for a little respect, sensibility to their feelings and understanding of their loss in the place where it occurred. That should be the only reason that the peaceful people of islam should need. No they want it there anyway and we are the insensitive, racists ones.

By the way Fatty and Brian when were you at ground zero in the days, weeks and months following the attacks? Because the families of the victims were there in the blocks surrounding the site, putting up fliers to try and locate their relatives, giving comfort and aid to those working the site. But yea, only the actual property of the World Trade Center holds any meaning to any of us, naive kids. Keep defending the very people that want you dead, you two are so very intelligent and the rest of us dummies need your worldly advice to survive. As Lep would say "Pffffttt!"

[FattyTheFerret]

Except it didn't occur in that place. It's a few blocks away from where it occurred so the families have no claim to respect in a building that wasn't attacked.

[Big Jim]

Except it didn't occur in that place. It's a few blocks away from where it occurred so the families have no claim to respect in a building that wasn't attacked.

Yes, yes...we KNOW its not at the actual place......!! Geezus.....its STILL disrespectful to have it built so close...!! What don't you get about this here....do you really believe this is the answer and the right thing to do here to commemorate the sanctity of that sacred place?!?! That panel in New York that ok'd the building of this thing was paid off and is just plain wrong...!!

Fatty...you and Brian need to just stop advocating for this Mosque.....what's your deal anyway....? YOU'RE NOT EVER GOING TO CHANGE MINDS AND OPINIONS OPPOSING YOURSELVES THIS WAY.......you really don't get that...??

See, by you guys doing that it shows your inexperience and lack of wisdom. I said it before and I'll say it again.....if either one of you idiots had family or friends who died in those attacks you would BOTH be feeling very different right now and saying very different things concerning this mosque.

[FattyTheFerret]

Yes, yes...we KNOW its not at the actual place......!! Geezus.....its STILL disrespectful to have it built so close...!! Well what's the minimum distance in your mind? Three blocks? Four? Seven? Thirty four? Either it's on the site or it isn't.

And it isn't.


What don't you get about this here....do you really believe this is the answer and the right thing to do here to commemorate the sanctity of that sacred place?!?!We're not talking about a sacred place. We're talking about a site a few blocks away from that sacred place. Nothing is being commemorated and there is no connection between the muslims building this mosque and the muslims that hijacked the planes.
That panel in New York that ok'd the building of this thing was paid off and is just plain wrong...!!Proof that it was paid off?


Fatty...you and Brian need to just stop advocating for this Mosque.....what's your deal anyway....? YOU'RE NOT EVER GOING TO CHANGE MINDS AND OPINIONS OPPOSING YOURSELVES THIS WAY.......you really don't get that...?? You need to just stop complaining about it. You're not ever going to change minds and opinion opposing yourself this way. You really don't get that?


See, by you guys doing that it shows your inexperience and lack of wisdom. I said it before and I'll say it again.....if either one of you idiots had family or friends who died in those attacks you would BOTH be feeling very different right now and saying very different things concerning this mosque.

You make the assumption that I don't. That shows your inexperience and lack of wisdom.

[brian0351]

I am not trying to change minds here. I an advocating the freedom that our country allows. Where does it stop? A Black or an Asian guy breaks in kills someone in your home, so should we forever bar...

[Warbyrd13]

After reading through after my long vaction from the forums I am reading the arguments about a Mosque near the 9/11 tragedy.

Ok people lets be honest about Islam. If you are not a Muslim then you are an infadel. And there job is either to convert or kill you. Very simple. And most muslims believe this. How many Imman (sp?) are out there demanding the blood of US service members? How many cheered when 9/11?

Until the muslim community denounces these idiots and clean up thier own problems I do not trust them.

A better point was brought up in this thread. Let us build a church and start preaching christanity or any other relgion over there in the middle east. Allow the woman to walk around uncovered and not escorted. Until that is allowed and "honor killings" are seen as murder then thos who support this Mosque are a bunch of idiots.

Do some research on how when Muslims are the majority and how the monority reglions are treated. I am honestly suprised that all the women power groups havent gone over there to free thier sisters from the evil men over there yet.

[Danny C Smith]

After reading through after my long vaction from the forums I am reading the arguments about a Mosque near the 9/11 tragedy.

Ok people lets be honest about Islam. If you are not a Muslim then you are an infadel. And there job is either to convert or kill you. Very simple. And most muslims believe this. How many Imman (sp?) are out there demanding the blood of US service members? How many cheered when 9/11?

Until the muslim community denounces these idiots and clean up thier own problems I do not trust them.

A better point was brought up in this thread. Let us build a church and start preaching christanity or any other relgion over there in the middle east. Allow the woman to walk around uncovered and not escorted. Until that is allowed and "honor killings" are seen as murder then thos who support this Mosque are a bunch of idiots.

Do some research on how when Muslims are the majority and how the monority reglions are treated. I am honestly suprised that all the women power groups havent gone over there to free thier sisters from the evil men over there yet.

Thank you.:thumbup:
Semper Fi.

[Danny C Smith]

I wonder what would happen if a mosque was crazy bommed
in America? HUH? What would happen then?
Yeah, that would be the end of the world.
I'm so sick and tired of the whining azz crap I could scream.

[FattyTheFerret]

Until the muslim community denounces these idiots and clean up thier own problems I do not trust them.It did, it's been posted multiple times all over this forum, it's an easy search on google and given that your argument is centered on that it very quickly falls apart. Nice try but you're wrong.

[Warbyrd13]

It did, it's been posted multiple times all over this forum, it's an easy search on google and given that your argument is centered on that it very quickly falls apart. Nice try but you're wrong.


I really hate to point this out to you.

But the Muslim community has not cleaned house yet. Honor killings are still happening in the Muslim controled world.

The Iman who is trying to get the Mosque built near the 9/11 site has been qouted in saying Hamas is not a terrorist organization.

Again until all these people/groups who support whis idiocy called jihaid are put on a shoot to kill list then there will be no peace. That is the only solution with dealing with fanatics. They are willing to die and to kill for thier cause pure and simple. They bomb children, attack, beat rape women. But do not take my word for it here is a favorite article of mine.

Saudi judge sentences pregnant gang-rape victim to 100 lashes for committing adultery

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1141267/Saudi-judge-sentences-pregnant-gang-rape-victim-100-lashes-committing-adultery.html#ixzz0wFzLi0br


I will never allow Shara law to be practiced in the US out of protecting my female family from savages. I have a daughter and she will never be forced to wear some sort of head covering to please a group of idiots who can not control themselves or beleive they can force themselves on a woman or small girls as a punishment for walk around by themselves and not escorted by a male family memeber.

So when you read that article please tell me on how the Muslim community has cleaned house? We won't talk about how little girls are attacked becuase they want to learn how to read. Or how "real men" ensure thier daughter are not corrupted by the vile evil western ways.

Until these tragedies of a crazy relgious law are no longer allowed, supported by the Muslim community you can not ever argue that the Muslim community has taken care of jihiadist or stopped the killing and oppression.

Come back when you have educated yourself and understand the problem better.

[hbharrison]

Muslims are not our friends and never will be until they get rid of those in the ranks that want us dead.

[FattyTheFerret]

I really hate to point this out to you.

But the Muslim community has not cleaned house yet. Honor killings are still happening in the Muslim controled world.I really hate to point this out to you but that has jack ****ing squat to do with what I was talking about or even this topic. The muslim community - including CAIR - did condemn the 9/11 attacks.


The Iman who is trying to get the Mosque built near the 9/11 site has been qouted in saying Hamas is not a terrorist organization.Say what?


Again until all these people/groups who support whis idiocy called jihaid are put on a shoot to kill list then there will be no peace. That is the only solution with dealing with fanatics. They are willing to die and to kill for thier cause pure and simple. They bomb children, attack, beat rape women. But do not take my word for it here is a favorite article of mine.

Saudi judge sentences pregnant gang-rape victim to 100 lashes for committing adultery

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1141267/Saudi-judge-sentences-pregnant-gang-rape-victim-100-lashes-committing-adultery.html#ixzz0wFzLi0br
Blah blah blah ****ing blah. That still has nothing to do with the mosque in question or building it blocked from ground zero. 1.6 billion people do not share the same exact interpretation of their religion.


I will never allow Shara law to be practiced in the US out of protecting my female family from savages. Sure you won't. Because that's totally a threat and you are the only thing standing in the way. Oh jesus, save us. I beg of you.


I have a daughter and she will never be forced to wear some sort of head covering to please a group of idiots who can not control themselves or beleive they can force themselves on a woman or small girls as a punishment for walk around by themselves and not escorted by a male family memeber.No **** she won't, because this country has a little thing called religious freedom. No one has any right to tell your daughter she has to wear a head covering and you have no right to tell someone else they can't wear a head covering. See how that works?


So when you read that article please tell me on how the Muslim community has cleaned house? You brought up cleaning house, not me. This was about condemning 9/11. Hope you kept the receipt on that straw man.
We won't talk about how little girls are attacked becuase they want to learn how to read. Or how "real men" ensure thier daughter are not corrupted by the vile evil western ways.

Until these tragedies of a crazy relgious law are no longer allowed, supported by the Muslim community you can not ever argue that the Muslim community has taken care of jihiadist or stopped the killing and oppression.

Come back when you have educated yourself and understand the problem better.
Come back when you have educated yourself and understand the topic of this thread better.

[Warbyrd13]

I see alot of double talk from this group. Again the Iman of this group has stated that Hamas is not a terrorist group. A good way to make you understand why most people see this as an insult and do not buy " this will heal the people who have suffered crap" is this.

Let us build a catholic and protstant churchs at the sites of Nagaski and Hiroshima to help heal the surrivors of the atomic bombs. Let us build shinto shrines at pearl habor to help us heal from the sneak attack from the Empire of japan. Let us build some German hearitage celberating the Nazi party at the concertration camps in Eroupe where several million Jews were killed.

Now the other things i have pointed out is the problem in the Muslim community. I hear yes we are peaceful, blah blah but however thier actions and the support for those actions and lack of ensuring those actions stop tell me other wise.

So until I see women being able to walk safely in the Muslim world, there are no morality police to enforce Shara Law, when the Muslim groups activaly turn over the extremist and stop bombing Iserial I will start to believe that they as a whole have turned into something better than what the world has seen and will continue seeing.

[FattyTheFerret]

Where has he stated that? I would like to see this claim.

http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e4407.html

A catholic church in Nagasaki.

http://www.cbcj.catholic.jp/eng/ediocese/hiroshim.htm

And one in Hiroshima.

http://jcch.com/hawaii-internees-story.asp

Japanese Culture Center near Pearl Harbor.

What's telling you otherwise is lying to you because you're taking the attitudes of a few extremists to represent 1.6 BILLION people. Good job not understand sample sizes.

I don't care what you believe about the muslim world. It has no effect on whether or not a mosque for American muslims should be built because some people are too nearsighted to see that it has zero connection with 9/11.

[hbharrison]

Muslims are not our friends and never will be until they get rid of those in the ranks that want us dead.:iwo:

[HM3 Doc Wilder]

Building this Mosque-is just like Someone " ****ing"-on your Grave; Isn't It?-People didn't look good -HITTING THE CONCRETE-LIKE EXPLODING WATER MELONS OR GET BURNED TO A CRISP-3000 PEOPLE-AND MORE-FIRE-FIGHTERS-POLICE OFFICERS-You have to be completely-"INHUMAN"-"TO INSIST IN THE BUILDING-OF THIS MOSQUE" "People Never Learn Anything In This Life from the-Past"-"Murder Is Part Of Life. THAT'S THE WAY IT IS-" SINCE THE WORLD BEGAN" ."IT SEEMS"They Loved-adolf- to-Even the USA-in the Beginning-Every Thing Is Just a Repeat of the Past-THAT "THEY"-SUCKER YOU INTO BELIEVING" ----"THIS IS THREE CARD MONTY-MAN"-"THIS IS A NICE MAN"-BUT HIS ONLY AIM IS TO RAPE YOUR CHILD.THIS IS A MAN OR WOMAN THAT MARRIES YOU" FOR THE ONLY PURPOSE"-OF KILLING YOU AND STEALING YOUR WEALTH.I THINK "PEOPLE REALLY ARE STUPID" -THEY DON'T SEE EVILS AS IT IS. EVIL IS OUT THERE-THIS IS NO TIP-TOE -THROUGH THE TULIPS-WAKE UP-THEY ARE MOVING IN TO TAKE TERRITORY-THIS IS A BULLY STANDING ON YOUR FOOT-TO SEE WHAT YOUR GOING TO DO......THINK BEFORE YOU BECOME A LAMB ON A SLAUGHTER -BLOCK-I Will never turn my -Other-Cheek-read "The Hideous-Strength"-by C.S LEWIS-SEE how Pure Love IS STOMPED AND MURDERED-BEING NICE NEVER WORKS.....Bye from the Bronx.......Semper Fi-My Brothers....and Good Night.....................................




BUT BEHIND YOU BACK"--RAPES YOUR CHI"LD

[Mistybluelady]

Warbyrd... you are bang on in what you say. and re: CAIR....a Saudi foundation run by the crown prince of Dubai owns the deed to CAIR's headquarters, located practically in the White House backyard....

[USNAviator]

MBL <br />
<br />
Yet another well thought out response. I've done a bit of research and found that the proposed Mosque and community center is 2 blocks from ground zero and yes I know how long a NYC block is....

[AAV Crewchief]

In case you didn't notice we currently do have a relationship with the Iraqi and Afghan governments. We aren't at war with either of those countries. Now care to tell the class which of the 9/11 hijackers were Iraqi? Which ones were Afghani?


We're at war with Islamic extremism and even your POTUS and Attorney General Holder will not admit it.

[AAV Crewchief]

Where has he stated that? I would like to see this claim.



What's telling you otherwise is lying to you because you're taking the attitudes of a few extremists to represent 1.6 BILLION people. Good job not understand sample sizes.

I don't care what you believe about the muslim world. It has no effect on whether or not a mosque for American muslims should be built because some people are too nearsighted to see that it has zero connection with 9/11.


Again you fail to understand that the moderates do not condemn their violent 5-10 percent who commit these acts like 9-11 and just the other day killing Christian workers in Afghanistan. No codemnation means they are complicit...sort of like being an accesory before of after the fact when a crime is committed. Oh, they KNEW of what was going to happen and did nothing to prevent it and sure as hell didn't cooperate with LEOs when investigating it.

[FattyTheFerret]

We're at war with Islamic extremism and even your POTUS and Attorney General Holder will not admit it.

Pay closer attention to what you're replying to. Jim asked "What do you have with the Afghanis or Iraqi people......besides war.....?"

And we have ties with the Afghan and Iraqi governments. We're working with them, not trying to conquer them. The vast majority of the Afghan and Iraqi people are not extremists nor the ones we're at war with.
Again you fail to understand that the moderates do not condemn their violent 5-10 percent who commit these acts like 9-11Yes they do. I've shown you time and time and time again evidence that they do. I've posted it over and over again to prove you flat out ****ing wrong and yet you still shove your fingers and in your ears so you can feign ignorance. You're being openly and blatantly dishonest.


and just the other day killing Christian workers in Afghanistan. No codemnation means they are complicit...sort of like being an accesory before of after the fact when a crime is committed. Oh, they KNEW of what was going to happen and did nothing to prevent it and sure as hell didn't cooperate with LEOs when investigating it.

Who exactly knew?

[brian0351]

Sura 8:59 in the Koran says.... ' the infidels should not think they can get away from us, Prepare against them whatever arms and weaponry you can muster so that you may terrorize them" Does that sound peaceful to the polittically correct types? You can go to www.memritv.org (http://www.memritv.org) ....and download a cross section of sermons preaching hate and violence.


It's not the book...or the religion. It's the extremists who preach hate. It's no different than any other extremist organization. Oh, and here are a couple of passages from our Good Christian peaceful bible but we here don't go out and do as it says because we were educated.

Some hate...most don't. So why do you condemn the entire population?

Deuteronomy 13
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-5282">9</sup>But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. <sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-5283">10</sup>And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die; because he hath sought to thrust thee away from the LORD thy God, which brought thee out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage.

Luke 19
<sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV-25749">26</sup>"He replied, 'I tell you that to everyone who has, more will be given, but as for the one who has nothing, even what he has will be taken away. <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV-25750">27</sup>But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them—bring them here and kill them in front of me."

[vipere6]

I agree with all of you. They already have filtered there way into Europe and other area's of the world. Not to mention are already hear in this country dictating wanting a mosque. Pretty soon there going to want us to pray to there GOD. I think it's a slap in the face to those that died during 911 to include the clean up efforts. I just think it's wrong. There putting there noses up at all uf us.

[USNAviator]

Another American citizen heard from;


WASHINGTON – President Barack Obama on Friday forcefully endorsed allowing a mosque near ground zero, saying the country's founding principles demanded no less.

"As a citizen, and as president, I believe that Muslims have the same right to practice their religion as anyone else in this country," Obama said, weighing in for the first time on a controversy that has riven New York City and the nation.

"That includes the right to build a place of worship and a community center on private property in lower Manhattan, in accordance with local laws and ordinances," he said. "This is America, and our commitment to religious freedom must be unshakable."

Obama made the comments at an annual dinner in the White House State Dining Room celebrating the Islamic holy month of Ramadan.

The White House had not previously taken a stand on the mosque, which would be part of a $100 million Islamic center two blocks from where nearly 3,000 people perished when hijacked jetliners slammed into the World Trade Center towers on Sept. 11, 2001. Press secretary Robert Gibbs had insisted it was a local matter.

[Warbyrd13]

Where has he stated that? I would like to see this claim.

http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e4407.html

A catholic church in Nagasaki.

http://www.cbcj.catholic.jp/eng/ediocese/hiroshim.htm

And one in Hiroshima.

http://jcch.com/hawaii-internees-story.asp

Japanese Culture Center near Pearl Harbor.

What's telling you otherwise is lying to you because you're taking the attitudes of a few extremists to represent 1.6 BILLION people. Good job not understand sample sizes.

I don't care what you believe about the muslim world. It has no effect on whether or not a mosque for American muslims should be built because some people are too nearsighted to see that it has zero connection with 9/11.

fatty,

that was a good twist on the point I was trying to make. those churches were not built back in WW2 to heal the surrivors from the atomic bombs, they were built over there for the US troops stationed in japan so they could have a place to worship and to be honest i bet those churches were built long after the we had bases there.

The Japanese cutlure center is for Japanese-Amercian citzens not for the Japanese who served in the empire of Japans military.

Now I am awaiting the German culture center that promotes the Nazi regime that would be built next to all the concertration camps where all the Jews where tortured and murded and the when our troops rescued them they where haunted by what they saw.

[FattyTheFerret]

This culture center is for muslim american citizens, not for durka durkas that served in the republican guard.

This isn't promoting any damn thing so comparing it to the nazis is just another example of that lovely logical fallacy known as godwin's law. Good job playing into it and failing to support your argument.

[hillbillyjar]

With the asshats in charge, there's nothing that will be done to stop it. <br />
<br />
I say let them build it. There is plenty of fertilizer and diesel fuel in the world. <br />
<br />
Turn about is fair play.

[Terminal Lance]

http://indyposted.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/Mosque-Near-Ground-Zero1.jpg

Actually seeing where it is kind of makes this argument feel stupid.

[AAV Crewchief]

This culture center is for muslim american citizens, not for durka durkas that served in the republican guard.

This isn't promoting any damn thing so comparing it to the nazis is just another example of that lovely logical fallacy known as godwin's law. Good job playing into it and failing to support your argument.


So, not one dirka dirka dirka terrorist will ever enter and worship at that mosque and you can 100% guarantee that as fact?

BUUUUUUULLLLLLLLLLLSHIIIIIIIIIIIIT!

How many sleeper cells of asshats like Mohammed Atta and Crew do you think exist in this country right now? I'll bet it's more than you and I can count on our fingers and toes together and will everyone's help who is a member of this message board.

[AAV Crewchief]

I doubt that the unions will allow it to be built. There is where it will begin and end all in one place.

[FattyTheFerret]

http://indyposted.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/Mosque-Near-Ground-Zero1.jpg

Actually seeing where it is kind of makes this argument feel stupid.

par for the course around here


watch:



So, not one dirka dirka dirka terrorist will ever enter and worship at that mosque and you can 100% guarantee that as fact?

BUUUUUUULLLLLLLLLLLSHIIIIIIIIIIIIT!and when the hell did I suggest any damn thing? what's bull**** is your inability to comprehend a sentence and draw a rational conclusion


How many sleeper cells of asshats like Mohammed Atta and Crew do you think exist in this country right now? I'll bet it's more than you and I can count on our fingers and toes together and will everyone's help who is a member of this message board.

and you're just the type of wackjob that thinks every single mosque is connected to one

[FattyTheFerret]

I doubt that the unions will allow it to be built. There is where it will begin and end all in one place.

who cares about what the unions want? is it necessary to use union labor in new york or can they just use equally skilled but far more honest and hardworking non-union construction workers with the bonus of not having to deal with the mob

[TJR1070]

Fatty you are so silly. Not everything works like in your little commune hippie.

[FattyTheFerret]

Fatty you are so silly. Not everything works like in your little commune hippie.

no YOURE thilly! :banana: :evilgrin: :usmc:

[SgtThrasher]

Barry gives green light to build a Mosque (safe house) at ground zero,but tells Israel they can't build on their own land.

[FattyTheFerret]

It's not at ground zero.

Stop.
Spreading.
The.
Lie.

[NoRemorse]

It's not at ground zero.

Stop.
Spreading.
The.
Lie.

Somebody has to look out for the Amish Market.

[TJR1070]

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/0209/st_pauls/online_extra.html

St. Paul's Church "The Ground Zero Church" is located approximately two blocks from the site of the World Trade Center. But according to the all knowing moral police on this forum this is not "Ground Zero".

I'll say this one more time, if you weren't there digging in the debris for days and weeks following the attacks, if you didn't lose family members or friends there, then stop telling those of us that did where "Ground Zero" is located. Ground Zero is all of lower Manhattan, ask anyone that was in lower Manhattan that day!!!

[Gunner 0313]

:flag:They will never get labor or supplies to make it happen.

[FattyTheFerret]

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/0209/st_pauls/online_extra.html

St. Paul's Church "The Ground Zero Church" is located approximately two blocks from the site of the World Trade Center. But according to the all knowing moral police on this forum this is not "Ground Zero".

I'll say this one more time, if you weren't there digging in the debris for days and weeks following the attacks, if you didn't lose family members or friends there, then stop telling those of us that did where "Ground Zero" is located. Ground Zero is all of lower Manhattan, ask anyone that was in lower Manhattan that day!!!

That's not even remotely true and ill continue saying it. Ground zero does not extend to wherever you want it to.

[Big Jim]

That's not even remotely true and ill continue saying it. Ground zero does not extend to wherever you want it to.

Like you have any personal stake in this....all you do is cause and create chaos. Thats your M.O. The people who have personal ties to 9/11 are the ones whose wishes need respected here....not some idiot 20 year old wet-behind-the-ears and mouthy, inexperienced Marine who has NO clue how to have tact or consideration to anyone's opinions but his own. Yes that's YOU fatty...!!

[FattyTheFerret]

You have no ****ing idea what my stake is in this. And the wishes of those with ties do not outweigh the constitution.

And I'm not 20. Nor do you have any idea what my experiences are. If you're really one of those people who think experience can only come from the corps, you have my deepest pity.

Going purely by the way you post here I have ten times more tact in my left nut than you have in your whole body. ;)

[USNAviator]

This photo was taken 9/23/01. It show the debris field with north to the upper edge of the photo. The building in question, 51 Park, is circled in red. If you look closely you'll notice a blue tarp on the roof. The building was heavily damaged by the forward thrust of the two two aircraft. At 45 Park they found parts of the landing gear.

To me "Ground Zero" extends anywhere they found body parts, equipment from the two aircraft or anything else being positively linked to either or both of the Twin Trade Towers


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7e/World_Trade_Center_Site_9-23-01_with_Cordoba_House_location.jpg/600px-World_Trade_Center_Site_9-23-01_with_Cordoba_House_location.jpg (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7e/World_Trade_Center_Site_9-23-01_with_Cordoba_House_location.jpg)

[Gunner 0313]

:flag:It's amazing looking at that photo that anyone could possibly say that it's ok for this "center" to be built. The constitution has absolutely nothing to do with it and those that try to sell it that way are IMO in total denial of what's really going on.

[Big Jim]

You have no ****ing idea what my stake is in this. And the wishes of those with ties do not outweigh the constitution.

And I'm not 20. Nor do you have any idea what my experiences are. If you're really one of those people who think experience can only come from the corps, you have my deepest pity.

Going purely by the way you post here I have ten times more tact in my left nut than you have in your whole body. ;)

Yeah sh!tbird....I'm almost positive everyone is going to believe that...!! Go rant and rave on another website where you think they believe your crap......frikkin idiot.....you need to GROW some nuts before you have anything in the damn things.....!! But by the way you post here.....I am willing to bet a frikkin Ken doll has more balls than you do....!!!

[FattyTheFerret]

:flag:It's amazing looking at that photo that anyone could possibly say that it's ok for this "center" to be built. The constitution has absolutely nothing to do with it and those that try to sell it that way are IMO in total denial of what's really going on.

That photo has absolutely zero to do with this "center" unless you're one of those that connect 19 *******s with one and a half billion other people.

This has nothing to do with the constitution? Have you read the first amendment?

So hey, who's with me on banning catholic churches near playgrounds? Everyone knows those damn christians love molesting little kids.

[FattyTheFerret]

Yeah sh!tbird....I'm almost positive everyone is going to believe that...!! Go rant and rave on another website where you think they believe your crap......frikkin idiot.....you need to GROW some nuts before you have anything in the damn things.....!! But by the way you post here.....I am willing to bet a frikkin Ken doll has more balls than you do....!!!

Before I have anything in the damn things?


Do I need to press 1 for english or do you want to give that another shot?

[Gunner 0313]

That photo has absolutely zero to do with this "center" unless you're one of those that connect 19 *******s with one and a half billion other people.

This has nothing to do with the constitution? Have you read the first amendment?

So hey, who's with me on banning catholic churches near playgrounds? Everyone knows those damn christians love molesting little kids.

:flag:I really don't get it how you're a Marine.

[FattyTheFerret]

Well, that's your problem. :banana: Seems one of us actually understands the document marines swear and oath to protect.

One of us understands that protecting the freedom of americans, including americans that pray to allah, is the whole reason for the corps to exist.

So the fact that you can't fathom me as a marine is, at worst, a compliment and an indication that I'm doing exactly what a marine should be doing.

[USNAviator]

Well, that's your problem. :banana:

Since I'm the creator of this thread I also have the right to request it be shut down

Fatty, I have no idea who you are, your profile is lacking in facts. I'm going to ask you state your position on whether or not a Mosque should be built on said site

Just tell it your way. Why do you feel so strongly it should be built? You've commented about the First Amendment (I'm enclosing said document) Do you have training in the law? Just asking

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievance"

I'm giving you a chance to state your case, preferably with facts. Get it done Marine because if you crap out I'll shut this down

Dan

[Marine84]

Go CMDR!!!!!

At least don't shut it down until my popcorn gets done - please!? Be right back................

[FattyTheFerret]

Since I'm the creator of this thread I also have the right to request it be shut downok?


Fatty, I have no idea who you are, your profile is lacking in facts. I'm going to ask you state your position on whether or not a Mosque should be built on said siteI thought I had? I don't care whether or not one should be built but there's nothing wrong with doing so.

More importantly, it's not a mosque.



Just tell it your way. Why do you feel so strongly it should be built? You've commented about the First Amendment (I'm enclosing said document) Do you have training in the law? Just asking

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievance"

I'm giving you a chance to state your case, preferably with facts. Get it done Marine because if you crap out I'll shut this down

Dan

Don't keep it open on my account. I won't shed a tear.

There's no valid reason to complain about this place. It's a basketball court.

[USNAviator]

Go CMDR!!!!!

At least don't shut it down until my popcorn gets done - please!? Be right back................

Sorry Ma'am ( I'm from Virginia)!!!! I'm more than willing to give Fatty the chance to expound on his opinion on why the Mosque should be built so close to the stated "Ground Zero"

[FattyTheFerret]

1. It's not a mosque.

2. It's not a mosque.

3. It's not a mosque.

4. If it was a mosque, it wouldn't matter. The people that caused 9/11 were not representative of one and a half billion ****ing muslims anymore than catholic priests who fondle altar boys are representative of all christians. Unless all the bible thumpers out there want to be called pedophiles and child molesters, this bull**** connection between the terrorists and the rest of the religion needs to stop.

5. It's not a mosque.

[USNAviator]

ok? I thought I had? I don't care whether or not one should be built but there's nothing wrong with doing so.

More importantly, it's not a mosque.


Don't keep it open on my account. I won't shed a tear.

There's no valid reason to complain about this place. It's a basketball court.


Yes it is a Mosque in addition to being a recreation facility. Son, do your homework, do your research. I have no problem with your opinion. I gladly accept your opinion. no matter how opposing. If you are truly a Marine ( you might want to work on your profile) it's more than welcomed by me.

Dan

[FattyTheFerret]

No, it's a recreation facility with a prayer area. That is not a mosque. The religion itself identifies a mosque as a place that can only be used for worship.

Do your homework, dad.

I like my profile the way it is.

[USNAviator]

No, it's a recreation facility with a prayer area. That is not a mosque. The religion itself identifies a mosque as a place that can only be used for worship.

Do your homework, dad.

I like my profile the way it is.

Yes I am a Dad. Are you?

[FattyTheFerret]

You called me son, I figured that meant you were my old man!

[USNAviator]

You called me son, I figured that meant you were my old man!


LOL got your point!!

[hillbillyjar]

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievance"

Dan
Thank you.

I find it amusing how many loud mouth liberals were forced to read the Constitution in ninth grade social studies, and never read it again, but love to wave it in the faces of people who disagree with them.

What I find most odd though is they tend to get very offended when asked if the opposing viewpoint has the same rights.

Opposing the building is nothing more than that. But the liberals will continue to throw temper tantrums till those of us that think it is disrespectful give in and let the toddlers do what they want.

A large part of the country needs a trip to the woodshed for a talkin' to.

And no, I don't declare my right to express that opinion under the sanctity of the First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America; I just do it since Congress has been forbidden to pass any law telling me I couldn't.

[TJR1070]

Getting upset with Fatty is like getting upset with your retarted three year old cousin, he's only doing what his little retarted mind thinks is right and since the connections don't all work you have to give him the benefit of the doubt. Of course if I make a connection like that, that would mean all retards are islamafacist loving, Marine impersonating, homosexual athiests.

By the way FATAH, the connection between the 19 muslim terrorists and 1.6 billion other muslims is a little book called the quran. You should get the cliff notes for it.

[FattyTheFerret]

Getting upset with Fatty is like getting upset with your retarted three year old cousin, he's only doing what his little retarted mind thinks is right and since the connections don't all work you have to give him the benefit of the doubt. Of course if I make a connection like that, that would mean all retards are islamafacist loving, Marine impersonating, homosexual athiests.marine impersonating? Go **** yourself, *******. :)


By the way FATAH, the connection between the 19 muslim terrorists and 1.6 billion other muslims is a little book called the quran. You should get the cliff notes for it.
Sorta like the connection between you and pedophiles is a bible, right?

[TJR1070]

Sorta like the connection between you and pedophiles is a bible, right?

Nice try Fatty, but you know this doesn't hold water.

Fill out your profile. Post the dates you went to boot camp, your MOS and your current unit and I will believe you are a Marine, until then nice try wannabe.

[Big Jim]

Nice try Fatty, but you know this doesn't hold water.

Fill out your profile. Post the dates you went to boot camp, your MOS and your current unit and I will believe you are a Marine, until then nice try wannabe.

Thank you....!! I been thinking this from when this idiot showed up and started his crap...!!

[NoRemorse]

Sorta like the connection between you and pedophiles is a bible, right?

The only problem is that the bible doesn't condone pedophilia or call for it; so you'd have to find a better example of the bible condoning a specific action and that action then being carried out.

Not that that's going to be hard or anything.

[FattyTheFerret]

Nice try Fatty, but you know this doesn't hold water.Holds about as much water as you connecting one and a half billion muslims to the small percentage of terrorists by a shared holy book.


Fill out your profile. Post the dates you went to boot camp, your MOS and your current unit and I will believe you are a Marine, until then nice try wannabe.

I posted the date I graduated. If you want more than that then...oh well.

[hillbillyjar]

I've never actually met a Marine, even the ones I know who were discharged other than Honorably, that was ashamed of having been in, and wanted to hide details about their tour. The total opposite,...

[FattyTheFerret]

Because I totally give a **** what some random person who claims to be a marine on the internet thinks about me. :thumbup: Got more balls than you, Petunia.

A mosque doesn't have a basketball court and a culinary school.