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marleynrs8
01-19-10, 08:43 PM
Hello Marines. I just have one quick question about eyesight requirements to be eligible to become a Recon Marine. I have searched extensively both on this site and google and have come up short with conflicting answers. One place is telling me 20/20 correctable is ok but other places say you must have very good uncorrected vision.

The reason for my concern is that my vision is pretty bad. I'm not sure exactly what it is in terms of 20/40, 20/200, etc., but my prescription is -5.25 and -4.75(not sure if this help, basically this means my eyesight is pretty bad). However, I'm pretty sure my vision is 20/20 correctable.

So basically I was wondering if I can go to BRC in glasses or have to get laser eye surgery through the Navy first. And if I had to get laser eye surgery, would I have to wait a long time to get it? And subsequently be put somewhere else?

I'm sure you Marine are tired of hearing wannabe's come in and talk about Recon but it is a legitimate goal of mine and I have the motivation and drive to achieve it, but first I need to make sure my eyesight's okay. And this last question might seem far-fetched, but is it true that if you perform outstanding at BRC the Force Recon guys will have a look at you? I have several years to get in serious shape, so I'm curious.

Lisa 23
01-19-10, 09:27 PM
I hope this info helps you out. I'm sure other Marines with experience in this field will be along to answer your questions better.


Marine Corps Enlisted Job Descriptions
MOS 0321 - - Reconnaissance Man

Type of MOS (http://usmilitary.about.com/od/enlistedjo2/a/mosdef.htm) : PMOS
Rank (http://usmilitary.about.com/od/theorderlyroom/l/blenlrank.htm) Range: MGySgt to Pvt
Job Description: The reconnaissance man is responsible for providing the amphibious, long range, small unit, ground reconnaissance and raid skills to support the MAGTF. He is the nucleus of a reconnaissance team in the reconnaissance battalion or the reconnaissance or assault team in the Marine Special Operations Company (MSOC's) In addition to basic infantry skills, he is responsible for highly refined scouting and patrolling skills. He must possess advanced proficiency in scout swimming, small boat operations, close combat skills, airborne, surface and sub-surface insertion and extraction techniques, assault climbing, demolitions, forward observer procedures for supporting arms, initial terminal guidance operations for heliborne assaults, airborne insertion operations, and various waterborne operations. He specializes in communications, photography, threat weapons and equipment recognition, and various types of point, area, and related necessary overlap of ground amphibious reconnaissance operations. Marines assigned to assault teams possess advanced skills in assault weaponry, breaching demolitions, close quarter battle skills and raid techniques. Selected reconnaissance men are further trained as static line and free-fall parachutists and combatant divers. - Noncommissioned officers are assigned as reconnaissance and assault team leaders or their assistants and may be qualified as static line and free-fall jumpmasters, dive supervisors, helicopter insertion/extraction masters (HRST), and tandem offset resupply delivery system (TORDS) operators.
Job Requirements:
(1) Must possess a GT score (http://usmilitary.about.com/od/enlistedjo2/a/asvab.htm) of 105 or higher.
(2) Must possess a first class swimmer qualification.
(3) Must obtain a first class score on the PFT.
(4) All Marines, to include non-infantry desiring lateral move, must successfully complete the Marine Rifleman Course of instruction prior to attending the Basic Reconnaissance Course.
(5) Assigned as a primary MOS to MGySgt and below 03XX Marines by CMC (MM) and Reconnaissance OccFld Manager (PP and O Code POG), and approved lateral-move Marines from any other MOS, who graduate from the Basic Reconnaissance Course (BRC).
(6) Must be a U.S. citizen.
(7) Must be eligible for a secret security clearance (http://usmilitary.about.com/cs/generalinfo/a/security.htm).
(8) Must be medically qualified to perform jump and combatant dive qualifications IAW inter-service requirements established in the P117 Navy Manual of Medicine and Army AR 40-501. Marines assigned 0321 PMOS who become medically unqualified may be directed to Lateral move or be reassigned based on the Commanding Officer, MMEA and HQM recommendations IAW MCO P1000.6. Duties: For a complete listing of duties and tasks, refer to NAVMC Directive 3500.87 (http://www.usmc.mil/news/publications/Pages/NAVMC%20DIR%203500.87.aspx), Training and Readiness Manual.

http://usmilitary.about.com/od/enlistedjo2/a/0321new.htm



Basic Force Recon and MARSOC Qualifications
(The link to this site isn't allowed to be posted here on Leatherneck.)


Be a U.S. citizen.
Score 105 or higher on the GT portion of the ASVAB (http://www.*************/ASVAB).
Tip: Scoring high on the ASVAB is key to being able to join an elite team like the Marine Corps' Force Recon. It also makes a difference when it comes to enlistment bonuses and choosing your MOS. Visit our Ace the ASVAB (http://www.*************/ASVAB) section to learn how to make sure you qualify for the bonuses and career options you deserve.



Possess a 1st class swimmer qualification.
Obtain a first class score on the PFT.
Have 20/200 near visual acuity or visual acuity not to exceed 20/400 with a completed PRK eye surgery. Normal color vision is recommended, but not required provided the Marine can complete a vivid red and vivid green recognition test.
Complete Marine Rifleman Course.
Assigned as a primary Military Occupational Specialty to entry-level Marines and obtain a manager-approved lateral-move.
Marines who graduate from the Basic Reconnaissance Course (BRC).
Volunteers from any MOS may be certified for AMOS only by Recon unit commanders after attending the SRC or through MOJT at a BRC endorsed unit-training program to include 6 months in an MOS 0321 billet.
Be eligible for a secret security clearance.
Be selected for and graduate from the Marine Special Operaations School (MSOS).
RECON Marines
The last three weeks have focused on the United States military special operations entities. This week, we focus on the United States Marine Corps version of Special Operations Capable (SOC) forces – The RECON Marine.

There are two types of RECON Marines: "Battalion" & "Force" RECON

The training paths for Marines in both RECON units are similar. The RECON Marine’s advanced training focuses on a platoon's likely missions while deployed, so Battalion and Force RECON Marines basically differ only in who their boss is - either the Battalion Commander or the Task Force Commander.

Initial training consists of Marine Recruit Training, and the School of Infantry which is the standard training where EVERY Marine learns to be a rifleman. Recently, changes in recruiting have enabled young recruits with little experience to attend the RECON Indoctrination Program (RIP). Students with the MOS 0321 RECON Marine are then assigned to the Basic Recon Course (BRC). The new Marine will be placed in BRC with Marines with several years experience as well. But upon successful completion of the BRC, all Marines report to their assigned recon unit & receive various professional, technical and tactical training. Ask your recruiter about the RECON MOS Option if interested in becoming a RECON Marine.

Marine Recon INDOC
1st Force Recon's current "indoc" or RIP is a 48 hr. evolution. Previously, in order to even get invited to attend the indoctrination course, you must have between 3-4 years of experience in the field and should be scoring at least 285 on the Marine Corp PFT: As with any Special Operation units, you must be a stellar Marine with a near flawless record. Recently, the new program mentioned above will allow highly motivated new recruits a chance to attend RIP. As long as they are physically above average and are able to reach the scores above (275 enlisted – 285 officer) they can attend after bootcamp. Below scores represent a perfect 300 on the USMC PFT:

3 mile run (18:00min 100pts)
20 pullups (dead hang) 100pts
80 situps/2min. 100pts.

You will be required to perform two obstacle courses in under 2:00 each time, swim 500 meters in full cammies in 17:00, and other fun water activities. 10 mile ruck with 50lbs pack in under 2 hours is also graded.

It helps to prepare months in advance with swimming at least 4-5 times a week. Wear cammies and fins at least once a week too. Minimum swim practice time should be an hour daily.

You will also be required to perform what is called a Level Test which is:

Max Push ups 2min.
Max Sit ups 2min.
Max Pull ups 2min.
Max Flutter Kicks 2min.
Max 8 Count pushups in 2:00
Max scissors in 2:00

Your calisthenics workouts should consist of the above exercises performed every other day for a total of 3-4 times per week. The day of PT rest will help your muscles recover and be able to gain more reps in two minutes. Also practice perfect form but do each of the exercises as fast as you can. Speed and endurance is your goal.

Running is also a major part of INDOC. You should run at least 4-5 times per week and perform a rucksack run once a week in order to prepare for the following:

Forced March (or "Hump") for 20 miles @ 4-5mph
Rucksack Run 3-4 miles timed (with 50 lb)

After repeating the Marine PFT again you get to interview with the Team Leader and Company CO/XO. You may physically make it but still not get selected. Usually, it is attitude and teamwork difficulties that get you rejected at this phase of INDOC.

Once selected, the Marines are assigned Recon Indoctrination Platoon. This is similar to going back to bootcamp. The Marines have only supervised liberty, physical training and classes at all time of the day and night at the Amphibious Reconnaissance School (ARS) in Little Creek, VA or Coronado, CA. Once the Marine finishes ARS, he is a Reconnaissance Marine.

(The link to the site isn't allowed to be posted on Leatherneck.)

Lisa 23
01-19-10, 09:38 PM
I also wanted to add but forgot......while it's nice that you have goals on what you want to do in the Marine Corps, focus and concentrate on finishing high school and getting your diploma. Right now, you're only 15, and a recruiter really can't talk to you much about joining the Marine Corps. It won't hurt to ask a recruiter for some info, but that's about all a recruiter can do until you're 17, I could be wrong on that age. You can enlist in the military at 17 with your parents signature, and 18 on your own.
And keep up the good grades in school. :thumbup: And you can start getting yourself into shape.

marleynrs8
01-19-10, 10:13 PM
Thank you for the responses. I guess this means I need PRK surgery. My grades are very good and I'm focused enough on high school, but the Marines and then Recon are my ultimate goals. Every day I think about it, and work on my PFT.

Lisa 23
01-19-10, 10:24 PM
Military Laser Eye Surgery Policy

With only a few exceptions, active duty soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines are allowed to have their vision corrected with laser eye surgery and not worry about it affecting their careers.

Service officials have been studying photorefractive keratectomy, or PRK, and laser in-situ keratomileusis, commonly called LASIK, the two most common procedures, almost since their outset and are convinced they're safe for military members in most career fields.

PRK involves correcting vision by using a laser to remove surface corneal tissue. In LASIK, the surgeon cuts a flap in the cornea, flips it aside, removes corneal tissue with a laser, and flips the corneal flap back into place.

Members do need to be evaluated by a medical board after receiving the now-rare radial keratotomy, RK, the first common vision-correction surgical procedure. RK involved shaping the cornea with spoke-like scalpel cuts that, service medical officials insisted, weakened the eye structure and put members at risk in military operating environments.

Service officials outlined the restrictions on their active duty members.

Laser eye surgery accomplished before a member enters active duty continues to be a medical disqualifier. However, medical waivers are possible. See the Laser Eye Surgery Medical Waiver Policy page (http://usmilitary.about.com/library/milinfo/milarticles/bllasersurgeryjoin.htm) for more information.
Currently, the Air Force allows free laser eye surgery (PRK) only to those in a limited number of jobs (AFSC). Other Air Force personnel are allowed to have the surgery space-available, or civilian surgery at their own expense, if they get permission from their Air Force Medical Facility and Commander, first. See the Air Force Laser Eye Surgery Page (http://usmilitary.about.com/library/milinfo/milarticles/blaflasereyesurgery.htm).

Navy policy disqualifies its aviators from flying duty if they have either procedure, Capt. Charles Barker said. Barker is the director of aerospace medicine for the Navy's Bureau of Medicine and Surgery here. "If they go out and get this on their own, don't tell anybody and get caught, they're not physically qualified and they would have to be reassigned to some other general duty to finish their obligation," he said.

Barker said Navy policy may be affected, however, by two ongoing studies into the effects of laser eye surgery on aviators. Navy pilots enrolled in these studies can receive a waiver to remain on flying status.

Navy SEALs and divers are allowed to receive PRK, but not LASIK. "LASIK continues to be disqualifying with no waiver recommended for SEALs and divers," he said.

Sailors and Marines are required to have their commander's approval before having either procedure done and they must be cleared by service medical personnel before they can return to duty, Barker said.

For more details, see the Navy and Marine Corps Laser Eye Surgery Policy Page (http://usmilitary.about.com/library/milinfo/blnavylasereyesurgery.htm).

Army aviators will flunk their flight physicals if they have PRK and LASIK, but the Army is different from the other services in that it's providing PRK free to certain soldiers, said Army Dr. (Lt. Col.) Vernon Parmley, director of the Cornea Service at Madigan Army Medical Center, Fort Lewis, Wash. Womack Army Medical Center at Fort Bragg, N.C., has been performing free PRK laser eye surgery on active duty soldiers since June 1 (2000). The highest priority there goes to Special Forces soldiers, Rangers and soldiers in some frequently deployed units (See Army Policy (http://usmilitary.about.com/library/milinfo/milarticles/blareyesurgery.htm))
Army medical officials say the service plans to offer the procedure at four more centers by mid-2001. See the Army (http://usmilitary.about.com/library/milinfo/milarticles/blareyesurgery.htm)

Laser Eye Surgery Page for more information.
Officials from all the services stressed the importance of research before having any elective procedure. "This is surgery on your eyes," said the Air Force's Saenger. All surgery carries inherent risks, she said, and that fact is unfortunately downplayed or ignored in PRK and LASIK ads.
"Don't rely on any one person, any one Web site, any one source to give you the entire story about the risks and the benefits," Saenger said. "People really, really need to make an informed decision. It's not like glasses or contacts that you can change if they're not quite right."

http://usmilitary.about.com/od/theorderlyroom/l/bllasersurgery.htm

Sgt Leprechaun
01-20-10, 01:55 AM
Do NOT get surgery yet. Your eyes are likely still getting 'worse' (I've been there). Wait until you are older. Better yet, wait, enlist as an 0311, then try out for 'Recon', after being an '03 for awhile. Get the surgery on your own dime while an '03.

marleynrs8
01-20-10, 01:02 PM
Yeah, my eyesight gets worse every year, and my eye doctor says its normal for my age. It seems that you're eyes have to be stable before surgery.

Sgt Leprechaun
01-22-10, 06:12 PM
Correct. So don't even bother yet.

jjames001
12-14-10, 05:58 AM
Been a reconnaissance operator for 2 years now, my vision is as bad if not worse than yours but it's correctable to 20/20 and that's all that matters. I've had the privilege to complete the Basic Airborne Course (jump school), Scout Sniper School, the Urban Sniper Course, Freefall and soon the Mountain Sniper Course.

I've been waiting to get laser eye surgery for awhile now, unfortunately getting it done in Okinawa is nearly impossible.

What Softballcatch23 listed as a job description for 0321 Reconnaissance Man is almost word for word what was on my contract when I signed up 3 years ago. Didn't know it at the time either but there was a $10k bonus upon completion of BRC Basic Reconnaissance Course.

Run, swim, run some more and get shredded before you go. Last thing, don't go into the grunts unless you don't mind being a robot. You'll mature quicker there, deploy sooner and possibly more often, but you're gonna hate life for awhile.

To get into Force you need to go into Battalion Recon first. Force is regarded as a higher asset because of the quality of their training. They typically have a larger budget but the biggest difference between battalion and force is who each works for.

marleynrs8
12-16-10, 12:06 AM
Wow, thanks for the reply. I'm really glad you dug this thread up, because that's great info. It gives me the option to follow my goal directly, just like I wanted.

Now, physically, I'm going to need some serious work. I feel confident I could get 100 on the crunches and run in the PFT(or get to 100 within a month), but for swimming and pull-ups, it will take time.

I have one of those doorway pull ups bars, and have tried dozens of different pull ups programs that have worked for other people, but I'm still at 7 max. I figure a Recon Marine like yourself would have solid advice to help. Same with swimming, should I just get membership at the local pool and go at it? I'm a decent swimmer, but not up to BRC standards by any means.

jjames001
12-16-10, 01:47 AM
Not trying to have a big head but the PFT to us is a joke. 100 crunches/2 mins is cake, should be able to run 3 miles right around 18 mins and get close to 20 pull ups. The more you run and cut weight, the easier your pull ups and crunches will be.

I went to BRC running 3 miles in 18:30, 18 pull ups, and 100 crunches. I was barely above average for the group of guys I was with for overall fitness.

Before I joined I had a doorway pull up bar too. As much as I hated it, I'd still bust out a max set every time I walked under it. There's no special tricks or workouts that will get you stronger faster. It's just a matter of you spending 2 minutes of your day cranking out as many good pull ups as you can.

My regrets - not weight lifting hardcore at a younger age (it'll pay off big time no matter what you end up doing), not getting a membership at the local pool/gym, and not getting swimming lessons.

If you don't get a few swimming lessons then spend 20 minutes on google researching the 'breast stroke' and 'side stroke.' I knew how to swim, but had no idea what the proper strokes were and such...definitely hated life for a week playing catch up in the water.

Learn those two strokes, go to the pool - preferably an olympic pool - and swim 500m at least once a week. Swimming that slick (just shorts) won't take more than 15 minutes if you got the hang of it. 12 minutes is what you should shoot for. In BRC you'll swim that and then some every day. Some days in cammies, other's just slick.

Hit me up on facebook if you want - jordan_james_001@hotmail.com

Muhreen4Lyfe
12-16-10, 10:06 AM
lulz, I remember this kid from TL. I won't rag on you here again but make sure you've got perfect color perception. That's an instant DQ for most jobs in the Marine Corps. Especially a job like Recon, where you observe things....

If you can't pass a PIP or FALANT you might want to reconsider your options.

marleynrs8
12-16-10, 12:31 PM
Thanks again for the replies. I've got good color perception, fortunately. I've just got issues with visual clarity, being near-sighted and all.

Mr Prophet
11-27-16, 04:35 PM
In short you will be allowed to serve in battalion recon but if you want to join Force Recon or become a Raider you'll need to have PRK surgery upon completion of your training. so even before you start they will check to make sure you are a viable candidate to even have the surgery.

Tennessee Top
11-27-16, 05:56 PM
This question is 6 years old. The OP is either in Recon by now or doing something else.