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battlepudge
10-17-09, 12:45 AM
Hey Marines. Names Aaron. Just hoping for a little advice here. I was turned down a few days ago because of 3 possession charges. 2 as a juvenile and 1 as an adult. I am currently 19 years old. The last one was only around 1 year ago (currently serving probation.) I was told that maybe in the future (1-10 years) I might be able to get in...The Recruiter said the way it works is 6 months ago they would have almost guaranteed me, but now the way things are they can't do it. Fluctuates so to speak

the recruiter told me to still come out and work out with him and the (Poolees) on saturday mornings.

He also told me to get involved in more community service...I'm asking for any advice, but mainly I'd like the Marines with my type of background to give me a little more advice on how they or a Marine they know got in with this type of charge. Should I just every so often casually ask him if they could check it out again. The Recruiter seemed to fight for me the best he could but the Higher Power said no. Anyways...How else can I better myself and my community to show that this is what I want to do with my life?

Again any and all advice will be taken to heart but I'd like the Marines with former backgrounds similar to mine to step forward and really...Help a brother out :banana:

Thanks Marines

-Aaron

USCFIGHTONUSC
10-17-09, 12:28 PM
Recruiting is impossible to fully understand these days. Who they let in a few months ago, they may not allow in today. Who they deny today, they may let in a year from now. No one here knows.

The problem is that there is way too many people waiting to enlist, or in the process who do not have your issues. When this happens the USMC can raise their standards, which they have and the USMC is recruiting less people today then it did a year ago.

I don't see you getting in by doing community service or working out with the recruiter or any crap like that. You are either eligible, or you're not, and according to that recruiter, you are not.

One last note..You need to look down the road you are heading. Getting busted as a juvenile and then as a young adult shows a pattern, and very bad decision making skills on your part. Yes we are all entitled to our little ****-ups here and there, but when we keep doing them they lead to much worse things.

I have a little brother who started off his adventures as a juvenile with drug charges, then once he turned 18 he continued and today his ass belongs to the state of CA. I am not saying this is you, but you are heading down a bad path. If you can't get into the military, don't use this as an excuse to get high because eventually all the BS you do will catch up to you.

battlepudge
10-17-09, 09:55 PM
You are either eligible, or you're not, and according to that recruiter, you are not.

So does that mean NO for good...or for now?..

Zulu 36
10-17-09, 10:47 PM
Three possession charges, one as an adult. From my perspective you have a substance abuse problem as well as a rule following problem.

Hope we go to war with Iran, otherwise forget getting into the Corps.

Petz
10-17-09, 10:52 PM
there's a "flavor of the month" going on with recruiting now-a-days. It's all dependent on who's getting out and how badly we need people to join. many RS's are projecting all the way out to next year Sept with only a few slots open. Waivers are not going to be entertained for a while. Maybe next year. The best thing for you to do is hope the economy gets better so people get out looking for work.

battlepudge
10-17-09, 11:24 PM
Well everybody was a teenager once right? Yeah I liked "getting high" and didn't really have many plans for a "future" Now being sober and thinking with a clear head, you really get a taste of the real world and what you want to be apart of in this world. I know where I stand and I'm not going to give up this goal until I reach it or they ban me from the recruiter office for being too annoying...Thanks for all the advice and hopefully one day I'll be able to play my part in ensuring American Freedom. Again thanks for all your responses Marines.

-Aaron

Zulu 36
10-17-09, 11:31 PM
Well everybody was a teenager once right? Yeah I liked "getting high" and didn't really have many plans for a "future" Now being sober and thinking with a clear head, you really get a taste of the real world and what you want to be apart of in this world. I know where I stand and I'm not going to give up this goal until I reach it or they ban me from the recruiter office for being too annoying...Thanks for all the advice and hopefully one day I'll be able to play my part in ensuring American Freedom. Again thanks for all your responses Marines.

-Aaron

Yeah, everyone was a teenager once. But, unlike you, I had a plan for my future early in my life and it didn't include booze, drugs, or law violations.

Being "a teenager once" is no excuse. There was somebody out there telling you "don't do that." But I'll bet you thought you were smarter than they were.

battlepudge
10-17-09, 11:56 PM
Now all we need is more people like you and this country would be a better place :)

Not making any excuse, simply saying that being off the drugs clears up your head and you can take a look back and realize you f***** up and work towards the future. No point in being told "what I did was wrong" I realize that. The only thing I can take from my past is being grateful that I didn't get messed up into some REAL trouble, I've seen classmates (older and younger) being charged with Attempted Murder and Murder and Burglary and all sorts of BS I wont only look back on my past but the past of others and be grateful that I still have a chance to make something of myself, and my life.

USCFIGHTONUSC
10-18-09, 01:12 PM
Now all we need is more people like you and this country would be a better place :)

I wouldn't say that. People who judge others based on how they were raised are wrong. Not everyone grows up under the same roof.

Never let anyone make you feel any less of a person because of what you did. As long as you learned and moved forward then life goes on.

And I know you are not making excuses. My point is simple. People with your history have a tendency to repeat the errors you made when things get rough. Make sure this doesn't happen to you.

TRLewis
10-19-09, 09:41 AM
I'm guessing you're in Mason City, IA. Here is what I dug up, because the first step is going to be an expungement. Yes you will still have to explain what happened, you will probably still have to get a waiver, but it will look more favorable if a judge granted one. Here is what I found on a website:

3. What records may be expunged?

Arrest or disposition data or custody or adjudication data. Custody or adjudication data after the juvenile has reached twenty-one years of age, unless the juvenile was convicted of or pled guilty to a serious or aggravated misdemeanor or felony between age eighteen and age twenty-one. Fingerprint cards received that are used to establish a criminal history data record shall be retained in the automated fingerprint identification system when the criminal history data record is expunged. Iowa Statutes § 692.17.

If judgment has been deferred under section 907.3, the court's criminal record with reference to the deferred judgment shall be expunged. The record maintained by the state court administrator as required by section 907.4 shall not be expunged. Iowa Statutes § 907.9.

Court records of conviction for public intoxication may be expunged if conditions meet (see below). Iowa Statutes § 123.46.

4. Who is eligible for an expungement?

1. A person who was acquitted or whose criminal charges are dismissed. Persons acquitted or dismissed by reason of insanity and records of adjudications of mental incompetence to stand trial in cases in which physical or mental injury or an attempt to commit physical or mental injury occurred are not eligible. Iowa Statutes § 692.17.
2. A juvenile who has reached twenty-one years of age, unless the juvenile was convicted of or pled guilty to a serious or aggravated misdemeanor or felony between age eighteen and age twenty-one. Iowa Statutes § 692.17.
3. Upon discharge from probation, a person whose judgment has been deferred under section 907.3. Iowa Statutes § 907.9.
4. After two years from the of conviction of public intoxication, a person who has had no other criminal convictions, other than simple misdemeanor violations of chapter 321 during the two-year period. Iowa Statutes § 123.46.

So if you fit in there go for it. Also you may not be eligble because you're on probation. All branches frown on that. Get off probation, sometimes its as easy as going before a judge and asking. But I would recommend go thru the probation, get the expungement then try to get back in.

I also say keep working out with the recruiter, keeps your mind off other things.

0161HardCharger
10-19-09, 10:52 AM
Hope we go to war with Iran, otherwise forget getting into the Corps.

:thumbup:

BR34
10-19-09, 04:18 PM
I don't think he's going to be able to get an expungement since he's shown patterns with the behavior. Expungements are typically reserved for 1st time offenders.

marine3043
10-19-09, 04:34 PM
you can always join the army and hang around Marines,, thats the closest you will ever get to the fleet....

amarine0311
10-19-09, 04:59 PM
you can always join the army and hang around Marines,, thats the closest you will ever get to the fleet....

Ha HA HA HA!!! Now that is funny right there!!!

BR34
10-19-09, 05:23 PM
I don't think it'll be incredibly hard for him to get in with 3 misdemeanors.

Petz
10-19-09, 10:46 PM
they aren't giving out waivers for any felonies. Talking about expungement, it still shows up in his records, it just has a stamp that says "expunged" on it. You guys need to stop giving bad info.

The only people who can help him are the local recruiters. If they say they can't help him it's because they can't, not because they don't want to put him in the Corps.

there are lots of other cases as well, they may grant waivers for Alphas or seniors only but he could be a bravo, or a grad. You guys really have no clue as to his or the RS's situation.

battlepudge
10-19-09, 10:59 PM
Ha I like the advice Marines. Even the bad stuff... I mean it gives me a reality check to weather I can get in or not. I'm not asking for "all good advice" I need to know the goods and the bads here. I am happy to say that I will not give up this dream or let anything in my past hold me back. This is what I want to do and like I said before I wont stop till it happens...Weather is be in what ever way, I will get into the USMC 1 way or another. Thanks again Marines

-Aaron

TRLewis
10-20-09, 04:01 AM
they aren't giving out waivers for any felonies. Talking about expungement, it still shows up in his records, it just has a stamp that says "expunged" on it. You guys need to stop giving bad info.

The only people who can help him are the local recruiters. If they say they can't help him it's because they can't, not because they don't want to put him in the Corps.

there are lots of other cases as well, they may grant waivers for Alphas or seniors only but he could be a bravo, or a grad. You guys really have no clue as to his or the RS's situation.

I have to ask for some sort of proof, because once records are expunged they're sealed.

slimmy07
10-20-09, 04:45 AM
I have to ask for some sort of proof, because once records are expunged they're sealed.


SSgt Petz is right. His record will still show up. I know SSgt Petz is not a recruiter, but he is at a RSS working there right now,. correct? I know for a fact that SSgt Petz has seen this come up before. I have plenty of times while on recruiting duty. The military will get a police records check and find out about records that are sealed and or expunged. You can still obtain the police reports. You want proof, I suggest going on recruiting duty then.

TRLewis
10-20-09, 04:46 AM
Lets start with MCO's.

Alisium
10-20-09, 04:52 AM
Well everybody was a teenager once right? Yeah I liked "getting high" and didn't really have many plans for a "future" Now being sober and thinking with a clear head, you really get a taste of the real world and what you want to be apart of in this world. I know where I stand and I'm not going to give up this goal until I reach it or they ban me from the recruiter office for being too annoying...Thanks for all the advice and hopefully one day I'll be able to play my part in ensuring American Freedom. Again thanks for all your responses Marines.

-Aaron

Well, at least now you know you messed up. Knowing is half the battle, hey!

Square yourself away and keep that goal in mind. It might take a year it might take five. Stay on the straight and narrow.

Good on you for realizing you need to change your lifestyle. And ignore people who tell you you'll never amount to anything.

Bottom line:

Your local recruiter told you to hang in there, then do as he says.

BR34
10-20-09, 05:34 AM
I have to ask for some sort of proof, because once records are expunged they're sealed.

Both of you are wrong. Maybe it's a case by case, state law by state law basis but I can tell you with 100% certainty that an expunged record is vanished from a persons' record.

I was convicted of a felony in 2000. Did 2 years probation, paid fines, etc. I finished probation and filed a motion with the DA to have the case dismissed. The DA and judge agreed. I then had my arrest record expunged.

A few years later I went to the RS to sign up and told them my whole history. They did a bunch of different bg checks on me and couldn't find ANYTHING. So I was left in a situation where I needed to get a waiver but there was no paperwork available supporting anything I was telling them. Luckily for me my probation officer still had a copy of the court minutes and I was able to use that for my waiver paperwork.

I've also legally purchased probably 10 firearms since then. No wait time, no holds, just paperwork, money, and walking out the door with a gun.

And to top it off, I've been fingerprinted and had my mug taken for a back ground check I had to have to get my Conceal Carry Weapons permit. 5 weeks later my permit was in hand.

My record is completely clean, not even a speeding ticket. In LA records ARE destroyed once expunged. It's actually written into LA's law that the records (fingerprints, court docs, arrest reports, mug shots) will be destroyed and all that shall remain is a paper saying "Person X has been expunged" with no explanation of what they were charged with or what used to be on their record.

So it may vary from state to state, but I can tell you for a fact Louisiana destroys the record. (except for lazy prob officers who don't get the memo)

TRLewis
10-20-09, 05:35 AM
Both of you are wrong. Maybe it's a case by case, state law by state law basis but I can tell you with 100% certainty that an expunged record is vanished from a persons' record.

I was convicted of a felony in 2000. Did 2 years probation, paid fines, etc. I finished probation and filed a motion with the DA to have the case dismissed. The DA and judge agreed. I then had my arrest record expunged.

A few years later I went to the RS to sign up and told them my whole history. They did a bunch of different bg checks on me and couldn't find ANYTHING. So I was left in a situation where I needed to get a waiver but there was no paperwork available supporting anything I was telling them. Luckily for me my probation officer still had a copy of the court minutes and I was able to use that for my waiver paperwork.

I've also legally purchased probably 10 firearms since then. No wait time, no holds, just paperwork, money, and walking out the door with a gun.

And to top it off, I've been fingerprinted and had my mug taken for a back ground check I had to have to get my Conceal Carry Weapons permit. 5 weeks later my permit was in hand.

My record is completely clean, not even a speeding ticket. And an expungement did it.

Just curious as to how I'm wrong. The records are never destroyed but they can't be opened either. I got an expungement, FBI and SBI couldn't find anything.

I just wanted to see these guys come up with the MCO.

BR34
10-20-09, 05:45 AM
Just curious as to how I'm wrong. The records are never destroyed but they can't be opened either. I got an expungement, FBI and SBI couldn't find anything.

I just wanted to see these guys come up with the MCO.

Because it's state by state. Not all states have the same laws. In Louisiana they're destroyed. At least they're supposed to be according to LA's law.



1. It shall order all agencies and law enforcement offices having record of the arrest, whether on microfilm, computer card or tape, or on any photographic, electronic, or mechanical method of storing data, to destroy any record of arrest, photograph, fingerprint, or any other information of any and all kinds or descriptions.
2. The court shall also order such custodians of records to file a sworn affidavit to the effect that the records have been destroyed and that no notations or references have been retained in the agency’s central repository which will or might lead to the inference that any record ever was on file with any agency or law enforcement office. The original of such affidavit shall be kept by the court and a copy shall be retained by the affiant agency, which copy shall not be a public record and shall not be open for public inspection but rather shall be kept under lock and key and maintained only for internal recordkeeping purposes.


Like I said, the only thing the state retains is basically a receipt of expungement.

TRLewis
10-20-09, 05:49 AM
I even listed the statutes and it says the records will be retained.

BR34
10-20-09, 05:50 AM
...Jesus. Listen, it's a STATE BY STATE thing. There is no absolute. Read my post above.

TRLewis
10-20-09, 05:51 AM
...Jesus. Listen, it's a STATE BY STATE thing. There is no absolute. Read my post above.

Hey, numb nuts. I listed the statutes for HIS state. He's not in LA. So cool it sparky.

BR34
10-20-09, 05:53 AM
I'm not talking about that post. I'm talking about the other few where you kept saying "once records are expunged they're sealed" or "the records will never be expunged". You even brought your own state expunge sealment into the discussion as if it's proof of what all others do. As I said, that ain't always the case. Maybe you should be more specific and say "once records are expunged in state 'X' they're sealed."

BR34
10-20-09, 06:01 AM
I'm not talking about that post. I'm talking about the other few where you kept saying "once records are expunged they're sealed" or "the records will never be destroyed". You even brought your own state expunge sealment into the discussion as if it's proof of what all others do. As I said, that ain't always the case. Maybe you should be more specific and say "once records are expunged in state 'X' they're sealed."

Fixed my booboo.

Zulu 36
10-20-09, 06:09 AM
Having worked in the crim justice biz for many years I learned one thing: A government, ANY government, does not like to destroy files. They may be sealed, they may be locked up in special vaults, they may be really, really hard to get access to, but generally they are not destroyed.

There may be an odd state or two that actually does destroy records of expungements, but don't bet on each and every piece of paper being gone. If any place still has some record of the matter, it will be the arresting police department. Again, they may be specially segregated, but don't bet on them being destroyed.

slimmy07
10-20-09, 06:57 AM
Expungement.Some states have established procedures for the subsequent "expunging of the record," "dismissal of charges," or "pardon" upon evidence of rehabilitation of the offender. Such action has the legal effect of extinguishing the initial "conviction" or "adverse juvenile adjudication" so that, under state law, the applicant has no record of conviction or adverse juvenile adjudication. In spite of this action, the record must be revealed and a waiver of the applicant's disqualification(s) is required at the proper enlistment decision level.

slimmy07
10-20-09, 07:06 AM
Records ARE kept some where some place. An expunged, sealed record NEVER truly goes away. It may not be available to the public or to certain background agenices, but I guarntee that someone in the county or city in which you committed that felony could obtain some type of record on your crime. Its not like its destroyed forever and it never happened. read my post above, regardless if its sealed or expunged it still NEEDS to be revealed or it possible that you could be discharged for fraudulent enlistment and or face criminal charges.

It's important to note here that federal law requires applicants to divulge ALL criminal history on recruiting applications, including expunged, sealed, or juvenile records. Additionally, in most states, such records are accessible to military investigators, regardless of what you have heard to the contrary.

Petz
10-20-09, 07:18 AM
Both of you are wrong. Maybe it's a case by case, state law by state law basis but I can tell you with 100% certainty that an expunged record is vanished from a persons' record.

I was convicted of a felony in 2000. Did 2 years probation, paid fines, etc. I finished probation and filed a motion with the DA to have the case dismissed. The DA and judge agreed. I then had my arrest record expunged.

A few years later I went to the RS to sign up and told them my whole history. They did a bunch of different bg checks on me and couldn't find ANYTHING. So I was left in a situation where I needed to get a waiver but there was no paperwork available supporting anything I was telling them. Luckily for me my probation officer still had a copy of the court minutes and I was able to use that for my waiver paperwork.

I've also legally purchased probably 10 firearms since then. No wait time, no holds, just paperwork, money, and walking out the door with a gun.

And to top it off, I've been fingerprinted and had my mug taken for a back ground check I had to have to get my Conceal Carry Weapons permit. 5 weeks later my permit was in hand.

My record is completely clean, not even a speeding ticket. In LA records ARE destroyed once expunged. It's actually written into LA's law that the records (fingerprints, court docs, arrest reports, mug shots) will be destroyed and all that shall remain is a paper saying "Person X has been expunged" with no explanation of what they were charged with or what used to be on their record.

So it may vary from state to state, but I can tell you for a fact Louisiana destroys the record. (except for lazy prob officers who don't get the memo)

I would say that this is the exception. It was dismissed which means they dropped the charges. Now if in fact that is what happened there wouldn't be any record of conviction.

EDIT: it might also be harder in LA to get an "expungement" if in fact they do destroy all the records. a history of felonies isn't exactly something you want to expunge. then when he commits it again the judge has no idea what was expunged before so he does it again.

BR34
10-20-09, 10:31 AM
I would say that this is the exception. It was dismissed which means they dropped the charges. Now if in fact that is what happened there wouldn't be any record of conviction.

EDIT: it might also be harder in LA to get an "expungement" if in fact they do destroy all the records. a history of felonies isn't exactly something you want to expunge. then when he commits it again the judge has no idea what was expunged before so he does it again.

The dismissal may be the exception, but I also had a couple smaller things, simple batteries from high school fights, noise ordinances and the like that were erased during the expunge process.