View Full Version : New PFT standards...
Devildogg99
08-10-09, 04:38 PM
Today it was signed that starting 1 Jan 2010 a PFT will be conducted for the first half and a CFT for the second half. No more semi-annual PFT's. I think this is bad in nature; it not only breeds laziness that already exists but it lowers physical fitness in my opinion. A PFT is not that hard. I never complain about running a PFT. You mention the word PFT and people act like hell just killed the family pet. If you say hey lets run 3 miles then do some pull ups and crunches no one would bat an eye. I think we should keep to the semi annual PFT and keep on with an annual or semi-annual CFT.
Not only will these ensure Marines stay fit or get in to shape within standards, but it will also I believe force those who have been in forever and a day who won't see E-9 to retire. Thankfully they did away with and modified the BCP program. Tired of seeing overweight Marines get a pass because they pulled a 225 at best out of their ass!
Semper Fi
Sergeant M
08-10-09, 06:11 PM
I Think BCP is pretty stupid. My roommate can run 280s-290s and they have him on BCP. He's not fat, he's just big. I agree that doing the PFT once a year is going to breed some laziness, but for the most part you're going to PT on your own, or PT with your unit... or you aren't.
Devildogg99
08-10-09, 06:19 PM
I Think BCP is pretty stupid. My roommate can run 280s-290s and they have him on BCP. He's not fat, he's just big. I agree that doing the PFT once a year is going to breed some laziness, but for the most part you're going to PT on your own, or PT with your unit... or you aren't.
That may be true for ones who are muscle and not fat but you can't differentiate so make it simple; no 1st class can save your ass.
Its another check by having it twice a year. Once a year somebdoy lazy will train a bit then not have to do anything for a solid year. At least with twice a year there is a checks and balances in place. A solid year is a long time for someone to get out of regs and stay there. Its the military not UFC where they fight once every year almost.
Sergeant M
08-10-09, 06:21 PM
If they're doing the CFT for the second half, it'll maintain the same checks and balances that we have now. I think the way they determine BF% is innacurate. There are other methods that are more accurate.
Today it was signed that starting 1 Jan 2010 a PFT will be conducted for the first half and a CFT for the second half. No more semi-annual PFT's. I think this is bad in nature; it not only breeds laziness that already exists but it lowers physical fitness in my opinion. A PFT is not that hard. I never complain about running a PFT. You mention the word PFT and people act like hell just killed the family pet. If you say hey lets run 3 miles then do some pull ups and crunches no one would bat an eye. I think we should keep to the semi annual PFT and keep on with an annual or semi-annual CFT.
Not only will these ensure Marines stay fit or get in to shape within standards, but it will also I believe force those who have been in forever and a day who won't see E-9 to retire. Thankfully they did away with and modified the BCP program. Tired of seeing overweight Marines get a pass because they pulled a 225 at best out of their ass!
Semper Fi
it allows Marines to focus on not just PFT & CFT standards but also their MOS... I can see units spending an extra 3 hours a week "wasted" on training for both tests... this is not efficient, or condusive to MOSs outside of combat arms units.
I think there is no restriction to hold a MOCK PFT to gauge where you Marines are in PFT standards while you are training for the CFT, nor is it tabboo to have a MOCK CFT to do the same while training for the CFT.
Those who fail can be "remediated"
this will allow commanders better flexibility in a trainin schedule... which is probably why this came up in the first place.
we as SNCO can't begin to know what commanders talk about with the senior brass... though you will in 8 - 10 months! (you should be done with all your training by then right? or will you still have MOS school?)
I know there is a larger scope to this, that's the only reason it's being done from the top down....
Devildogg99
08-10-09, 06:29 PM
it allows Marines to focus on not just PFT & CFT standards but also their MOS... I can see units spending an extra 3 hours a week "wasted" on training for both tests... this is not efficient, or condusive to MOSs outside of combat arms units.
I think there is no restriction to hold a MOCK PFT to gauge where you Marines are in PFT standards while you are training for the CFT, nor is it tabboo to have a MOCK CFT to do the same while training for the CFT.
Those who fail can be "remediated"
this will allow commanders better flexibility in a trainin schedule... which is probably why this came up in the first place.
we as SNCO can't begin to know what commanders talk about with the senior brass... though you will in 8 - 10 months! (you should be done with all your training by then right? or will you still have MOS school?)
I know there is a larger scope to this, that's the only reason it's being done from the top down....
Still MOS school lol!
I agree on the mock PFT which is beneficial to all to see where they stand as a test. However, just because we can have mock ones shouldn't be a reason to not have two a year. I mean if you have time to run a mock one then you have time to make it count for score.
you can have it run for score if you want! just have it monitored by the Bn training bubba.
I think having both your CFT and PFT ran in tandem will only hurt Marines Scores and their ability to get max points for those who ACTUALLY train for it. it'll be just like the cammies... right after the PFT you'll change up your PT to start getting ready for the CFT... and I can assure you there will be units that will run a PFT with the CFT the next week into the next quarter. hell there are units that do that with the PFT now!!!
irizavrima
08-10-09, 07:14 PM
I have a lot of built up anger in regards to this issue. It is my opinion that the PFT is an absolute joke. In no way, shape, or form does the PFT reflect anything in combat. It does engage enough muscles to project a level of physical fitness; it is a thing of the past. The CFT is a much needed improvement, however it lacks one thing. We need to be out there in a full combat load. There is no valid argument against this, think about it. Are you going to wear boots and utilities when you are in a combat situation? Maybe the Marine Corps needs to rethink the MTV...
Sergeant M
08-10-09, 07:17 PM
Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
The recently unveiled Combat Fitness Test marks the dawn of a new era, but
it's only the most recent step in the age-old journey to make the "Ultimate
Marine."
For more than two centuries, the Corps has sought the ever elusive
"Superman" - a Marine capable of withstanding any hardship, in any clime, in
any place - and have created a series of physical challenges that have
increased with time. In 1909, by executive order of President Theodore
Roosevelt, himself a "Roughrider," Marines first had to overcome a 50 mile
walk or 90 mile horseback ride in the course of three days. Soon, Marines
were asked to duck waddle for 50 yards, climb ropes and squat thrust.
Then came a single three-event test that has lasted for 35 years - until
now.
No longer are pull-ups, crunches and a 3-mile run enough to test a Marines
combat readiness. Now there will be combat ammo can races, weaving through
combat cones, throwing a combat medicine ball, combat crawling and combat
carrying of supine combat casualties. But these new tests, much like new
computers and cell phone technology, will soon be outdated with the changing
nature of global conflict.
To keep pace with emerging threats, the Marine Corps has developed a plan to
increase the challenges the individual Marine may face in the coming years.
For instance, by Fiscal Year 2010, Marines will have to perform a maximum
set of pull-ups, timed crunches, a three mile run, the entire CFT followed
by a timed bear crawl over broken glass. The glass itself will be soaked in
the urine of local homeless drifters with hepatitis, further providing the
Corps a chance to weed out the weak from the Ultimate Marine. The combined
test will effect promotion and duty station.
In FY12, Marines will have to complete all previous tests and then climb a
sheer cliff face somewhere in rural Utah while wearing their dress blue
Alphas. Once at the top, the Marine will perform sword manual movements
while undergoing a combat uniform inspection that includes less than gentle
kicks to the scrotum for each infraction. In addition, Marines will be asked
to sing all three verses of the Marine Corps Hymn in a pleasing falsetto
voice.
In FY14, in addition to all previous tests, Marines will be forced to fight
a lava monster in single combat on a life-sized chess board. After defeating
the lava beast, Marines will be asked to solve a Rubik's Cube while being
water boarded by Endo, known best for torturing Mel Gibson in the first
"Lethal Weapon." After successful completion of this test, Marines will
engage in a staring contest at the top of Mount Everest with Chuck Norris.
In FY16, Fear Factor's Joe Rogan will administer all previous tests that
will culminate in Marines being asked to eat a donkey dick, six spiders, a
snake, an orangutan and Mike Tyson's illegitimate children. After achieving
the final level of consciousness, evidence of which will be a "soul glow,"
Marines will be allowed to complete the final portion of the test -
defeating the "Shogun of Harlem" on turf of his choosing.
Because of the dedication of a few, proud Marines, the future of our Corps
and the quality of the Marines who serve within its ranks will be preserved
for generations to come.
MSgt Martin J. Pack, USMC
MALS-36 Quality Assurance Chief
I have a lot of built up anger in regards to this issue. It is my opinion that the PFT is an absolute joke. In no way, shape, or form does the PFT reflect anything in combat. It does engage enough muscles to project a level of physical fitness; it is a thing of the past. The CFT is a much needed improvement, however it lacks one thing. We need to be out there in a full combat load. There is no valid argument against this, think about it. Are you going to wear boots and utilities when you are in a combat situation? Maybe the Marine Corps needs to rethink the MTV...
back when the PFT was created we didn't have an average combat load of 120lbs... so yeah, it did test combat effectiveness.. good job doing your history lesson.
as for the CFT... I don't know if you realize this, but grunts train for this **** with their gear on... as they should.
non combat arms (NCAs) don't... so when we do our test we end up breaking knees like match sticks... even during training. the grunts have waves of boots they have to build up... if we did this we'd fail at OUR mission... so they have these lax standards to give commanders the flexibility to maintain their mission and train their Marines to be more combat effective.
stop complaining about it... you are not john wayne, you won't be gunny highway... and you will not be rico from star ship troopers...
you are a Marine, you have a set of standards you are to uphold... if you feel that aren't good enough then get promoted to Sgt Maj and ***** about it at your first symposium.
Ski 0121
08-10-09, 07:30 PM
Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
The recently unveiled Combat Fitness Test marks the dawn of a new era, but
it's only the most recent step in the age-old journey to make the "Ultimate
Marine."
For more than two centuries, the Corps has sought the ever elusive
"Superman" - a Marine capable of withstanding any hardship, in any clime, in
any place - and have created a series of physical challenges that have
increased with time. In 1909, by executive order of President Theodore
Roosevelt, himself a "Roughrider," Marines first had to overcome a 50 mile
walk or 90 mile horseback ride in the course of three days. Soon, Marines
were asked to duck waddle for 50 yards, climb ropes and squat thrust.
Then came a single three-event test that has lasted for 35 years - until
now.
No longer are pull-ups, crunches and a 3-mile run enough to test a Marines
combat readiness. Now there will be combat ammo can races, weaving through
combat cones, throwing a combat medicine ball, combat crawling and combat
carrying of supine combat casualties. But these new tests, much like new
computers and cell phone technology, will soon be outdated with the changing
nature of global conflict.
To keep pace with emerging threats, the Marine Corps has developed a plan to
increase the challenges the individual Marine may face in the coming years.
For instance, by Fiscal Year 2010, Marines will have to perform a maximum
set of pull-ups, timed crunches, a three mile run, the entire CFT followed
by a timed bear crawl over broken glass. The glass itself will be soaked in
the urine of local homeless drifters with hepatitis, further providing the
Corps a chance to weed out the weak from the Ultimate Marine. The combined
test will effect promotion and duty station.
In FY12, Marines will have to complete all previous tests and then climb a
sheer cliff face somewhere in rural Utah while wearing their dress blue
Alphas. Once at the top, the Marine will perform sword manual movements
while undergoing a combat uniform inspection that includes less than gentle
kicks to the scrotum for each infraction. In addition, Marines will be asked
to sing all three verses of the Marine Corps Hymn in a pleasing falsetto
voice.
In FY14, in addition to all previous tests, Marines will be forced to fight
a lava monster in single combat on a life-sized chess board. After defeating
the lava beast, Marines will be asked to solve a Rubik's Cube while being
water boarded by Endo, known best for torturing Mel Gibson in the first
"Lethal Weapon." After successful completion of this test, Marines will
engage in a staring contest at the top of Mount Everest with Chuck Norris.
In FY16, Fear Factor's Joe Rogan will administer all previous tests that
will culminate in Marines being asked to eat a donkey dick, six spiders, a
snake, an orangutan and Mike Tyson's illegitimate children. After achieving
the final level of consciousness, evidence of which will be a "soul glow,"
Marines will be allowed to complete the final portion of the test -
defeating the "Shogun of Harlem" on turf of his choosing.
Because of the dedication of a few, proud Marines, the future of our Corps
and the quality of the Marines who serve within its ranks will be preserved
for generations to come.
MSgt Martin J. Pack, USMC
MALS-36 Quality Assurance Chief
That it is by far the funniest thing I've heard in response to the new PFT/CFT standards! :thumbup:
irizavrima
08-10-09, 07:30 PM
If all Marine's are rifleman, we should train as such. If we don't, then it's just a motto.
Ski 0121
08-10-09, 07:41 PM
I wish my unit would do stuff like the CFT 3 times a week. I like being pushed to the limit, that's why I joined the Marine Corps. It's going to suck having it for score because a 300 in the CFT is too motarded for me. I got like a 272-274 (Can't remember which) on the first one we did at my unit, and I thought I was going to die from throwing up. And I PT everyday, sometimes twice a day! It's a good challenge, I don't care what anybody says about it, I love and hate it.
irizavrima
08-10-09, 07:44 PM
I think its a great change of pace from the pft. Who is really going to run or chase somebody for 3 miles at a steady pace anyways? If your being shot at or need to get somewhere in a hurry you use fast twitch muscles to accomplish this.
Sergeant M
08-10-09, 07:54 PM
That it is by far the funniest thing I've heard in response to the new PFT/CFT standards! :thumbup:
Got that in an e-mail a little while back. Written by a MSgt, QA guy from the wing.
If all Marine's are rifleman, we should train as such. If we don't, then it's just a motto.
um, that means we can all shoot... we all can compete in the division shooting competitions and we aren't the navy, air force, or the fvcking Army where there are people who are not qualified with the rifle. if you read your MC history you'll understand that our high standards were driven by extra pay for beer dependent on which qualification you were... one dollar for marksman, two for sharp shooter and three for expert... that in it's self was the reason why were were so good in belleau wood.
EDIT: that's where "every Marine a rifleman" came from in case a reader didn't know that.
Sergeant M
08-11-09, 01:29 AM
Kill people for beer money... Sounds like the Marine Corps to me!
Devildogg99
08-11-09, 05:55 PM
I love the CFT! Its new and fresh and in fact fun like the O Course. Its not hard at all. The run is fun as hell so is the beginning part of the 3rd part after ammo can lift. Only thing I didn't like was I got a partner who wasnt in my weight range one bit. I still lifted her no problem being a dude, it was a good challenge. Just didn't like her dropping her weight on purpose. Also didn't like it in black flag weather. Ya black flag weather. It might be black flag in Iraq or elsewhere and you gotta do it when its for real but here in the rear um NO!!
training is just that training... I do agree with training like we fight but I don't want to succumb to heat stroke easier because my command wants to "train like we fight"...
ORM SIR!!!!