View Full Version : Ban on tobacco urged in military
This will prolly go over like a turd in a punch bowl.
Ban on tobacco urged in military
By Gregg Zoroya (http://www.leatherneck.com/community/tags/reporter.aspx?id=233), USA TODAY
WASHINGTON — Pentagon health experts are urging Defense Secretary Robert Gates to ban the use of tobacco by troops and end its sale on military property, a change that could dramatically alter a culture intertwined with smoking.
Jack Smith, head of the Pentagon's office of clinical and program policy, says he will recommend that Gates adopt proposals by a federal study that cites rising tobacco use and higher costs for the Pentagon and Department of Veterans Affairs as reasons for the ban.
The study by the Institute of Medicine (http://content.usatoday.com/topics/topic/Institute+of+Medicine), requested by the VA and Pentagon, calls for a phased-in ban over a period of years, perhaps up to 20. "We'll certainly be taking that recommendation forward," Smith says.
A tobacco ban would confront a military culture, the report says, in which "the image of the battle-weary soldier in fatigues and helmet, fighting for his country, has frequently included his lit cigarette."
Also, the report said, troops worn out by repeated deployments often rely on cigarettes as a "stress reliever." The study found that tobacco use in the military increased after the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan began.............
http://www.usatoday.com/news/military/2009-07-09-smoking_N.htm
killbodies3027
07-10-09, 07:42 AM
I don't particularly like smelling cigarette smoke or watching someone fill a bottle full of spit. It's just disgusting in my opinion. But I'll never look down on anyone who does either, it's a personal choice. I just find it disturbing that all of these ridiculous rules and regulations are being implemented year after year. Before you know it cussing will be banned, farting, coughing, and eventually breathing all together will be banned. While they're at it, they might as well just ban the entire Marine Corps, because, you know, killing is bad and whatnot.
Old Marine
07-10-09, 08:44 AM
This will prolly go over like a turd in a punch bowl.
Ban on tobacco urged in military
By Gregg Zoroya (http://www.leatherneck.com/community/tags/reporter.aspx?id=233), USA TODAY
WASHINGTON — Pentagon health experts are urging Defense Secretary Robert Gates to ban the use of tobacco by troops and end its sale on military property, a change that could dramatically alter a culture intertwined with smoking.
Jack Smith, head of the Pentagon's office of clinical and program policy, says he will recommend that Gates adopt proposals by a federal study that cites rising tobacco use and higher costs for the Pentagon and Department of Veterans Affairs as reasons for the ban.
The study by the Institute of Medicine (http://content.usatoday.com/topics/topic/Institute+of+Medicine), requested by the VA and Pentagon, calls for a phased-in ban over a period of years, perhaps up to 20. "We'll certainly be taking that recommendation forward," Smith says.
A tobacco ban would confront a military culture, the report says, in which "the image of the battle-weary soldier in fatigues and helmet, fighting for his country, has frequently included his lit cigarette."
Also, the report said, troops worn out by repeated deployments often rely on cigarettes as a "stress reliever." The study found that tobacco use in the military increased after the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan began.............
http://www.usatoday.com/news/military/2009-07-09-smoking_N.htm
Outstanding.
Killbodies, now thats funny man. haha
egbutler1
07-10-09, 11:36 AM
This is stupid why are people considering taking away the freedoms of people who provide the freedom that these civilians take for granted. Stupid enough that you can't buy a playboy on base let alone smoke or dip. **** Dippin' got me threw my 4 years and kept me awake in Iraq to conduct my missions. FORGET THIS BS!
Cpl. Butler.............OUT!
not a bash against the stuff, but too many young kids who've never smoked or dipped before start up because of overwhelming peer pressure. If anything should be banned it should be that!
I've seen kids start smoking 'cause they're stressed and someone else said smoking helped!!!
and butler... if you really relied on dipping to keep you awake... well maybe you shouldn't have been playing PSP on your off time and got some sleep. I know optempo can be crazy but I always found time to get a nap in somewhere....
always saw grunts running to the internet cafe to surf the net instead of getting some sleep or chow... who's fault is that?
Supersquishy
07-10-09, 12:47 PM
They might as well take out the Alcohol while there at it:sick:
Kegler300
07-10-09, 12:50 PM
This will go over like a fart in church...almost like not allowing young, combat-hardened Marines under age 21 to drink beer.
marharri
07-10-09, 01:21 PM
I can see it now. Meritorious promotion eh? I see here on your page 11 you were caught off-base smoking... request denied.
Pete0331
07-10-09, 05:31 PM
Ridiculous.
If this somehow sticks it will be a slippery slope to banning all tobacco usage on military installations.
William Hardy
07-10-09, 05:47 PM
Correct me if I am wrong, but they cannot ban anyone from using tobacco products at the moment. They can ban its use in particular places, but no one can force you to not use it at all. The only way to ban it for individual use is to declare it an illegal drug. They can make it hard on military users by banning tobacco products on base, but you could still use it off post. Example - Some teachers I know still smoke. One uses a patch when she goes to school. In the afternoon she removes it and lights up. Another one takes a quick drive off campus, lights up, drives down the road and back, and returns to the building during her lunch and planning time. It would be funny if they outlawed tobacco and we ended up with "smoke-easies" like they had speakeasies during prohibition. Could you see the tobacco companies being allowed to produce tobacco products for sale outside of the United States and then having some of that being smuggled back in and sold on the black market. Sounds like a plot for a futuristic movie. LOL I am an ex-smoker. I feel for those that still do and are hooked. Took me 30 years to quite.
Osotogary
07-10-09, 06:10 PM
...and to think that I quite smoking just so that I would have more money for beer. Frikn vices!
Pete0331
07-10-09, 06:17 PM
...and to think that I quite smoking just so that I would have more money for beer. Frikn vices!
Funny, I quit drinking and smoking so that I would have more money for old cars, guns, and women.
All of which make me want to smoke and drink.
It's a vicious cycle. :marine:
William Hardy
07-10-09, 06:17 PM
Beer a vice? I don't think so. LOL
William Hardy
07-10-09, 06:38 PM
This will go over like a fart in church...almost like not allowing young, combat-hardened Marines under age 21 to drink beer.
Reminds of Nam where we could drink beer, but you had to be 21 to get the hard stuff at package sales. There was a 20 year-old SSGT at 1stMAW who could go to the staff club, but wasn't allow to buy hard drinks. What a rotten deal. A couple of time a few of us went over to the other side of the air strip where one of the Marine units had a 4/5 club that did serve the hard stuff. Couldn't vote but could die fighting.
Times have changed...I was in Iraq 2006-2007. No booze allowed. I had so much whiskey that I was giving it away. I never bought any. Other guys were giving it to me and at times I had over a "gallon" in my room so I gave it away to others. The mess hall had free "near beer" which had less than .5 percent alcohol. I would put a double shot in it and it tasted like a regular boiler maker to me. Our CO turned a blind eye as long as we didn't abuse it. When we were leaving and staying in the transit quarters, the TOP told the CO that I had some booze. The CO asked me if I had any left. I reached over on the table and got my extra large bottle of Listerine. I poured some into a cup and handed it to him. He laughed and said he had seen that bottle in my room every week during inspections and it never occurred to him that I would hide my booze in the open.
Pete0331
07-10-09, 06:57 PM
Reminds of Nam where we could drink beer, but you had to be 21 to get the hard stuff at package sales. There was a 20 year-old SSGT at 1stMAW who could go to the staff club, but wasn't allow to buy hard drinks. What a rotten deal. A couple of time a few of us went over to the other side of the air strip where one of the Marine units had a 4/5 club that did serve the hard stuff. Couldn't vote but could die fighting.
Times have changed...I was in Iraq 2006-2007. No booze allowed. I had so much whiskey that I was giving it away. I never bought any. Other guys were giving it to me and at times I had over a "gallon" in my room so I gave it away to others. The mess hall had free "near beer" which had less than .5 percent alcohol. I would put a double shot in it and it tasted like a regular boiler maker to me. Our CO turned a blind eye as long as we didn't abuse it. When we were leaving and staying in the transit quarters, the TOP told the CO that I had some booze. The CO asked me if I had any left. I reached over on the table and got my extra large bottle of Listerine. I poured some into a cup and handed it to him. He laughed and said he had seen that bottle in my room every week during inspections and it never occurred to him that I would hide my booze in the open.
Good story Gunny!
The booze issue in country is because the command doesn't want to be held liable or don't know how to properly maintain discipline.
It is not because of cultural/religious sensitivity.
The civilian contactors are allowed to have alcohol.
Foreign military are allowed to have alcohol, Polish MRE's even have alcohol in them.
Iraqis themselves would try to sell alcohol to Americans.
If I could have had a cold one after a long day patrol, I would have never wanted to leave Iraq. :marine:
I think Morons must be taking over the military. :sick:
Strict alcohol regulation.
Strict porn regulation.
Now talks of further tobacco regulation.
(Disclaimer: if thats your thing, I don't have a problem with your beliefs.)
these aren't the people in charge of the military... it's M.O.A. who cry... it's politicians who are taking on stuff like this to "make the military a safer place" ... it's people who have never...
William Hardy
07-10-09, 09:12 PM
Pete0331 - your right on. When our guys went to some of the different FOBs in Baghdad, (we were at Taji just north of Baghdad) they saw signs that said you couldn't have alcohol at the pool. They asked around and were told that you could buy booze if you were a civilian. We couldn't buy it at all because of General Order #1 which said no alcohol.
Pete0331
07-10-09, 09:23 PM
I think Morons must be taking over the military. :sick:
Strict alcohol regulation.
Strict porn regulation.
Now talks of further tobacco regulation.
(Disclaimer: if thats your thing, I don't have a problem with your beliefs.)
Edit: meant to say Mormons. :marine:
Covey_Rider
07-10-09, 09:27 PM
They have lost their damn minds!
Integrity57
07-10-09, 10:39 PM
I don't see this happening, especially because our Commander in Chief himself smokes and doesn't try to hide it. But of course it makes plenty of sense to deny the people who lose their limbs, suffer disfigurement, seperation from family and loved ones, and sacrifice their lives for millions of countrymen they've never met, even the most simplistic and basic of rights.
Chamorro
07-11-09, 06:59 PM
Perhaps the health experts should recommend that the military should also recruit only "non-smokers" if their intend is to reduce future health costs. Then continue to ignore the spending that congress and federal government does in owning banks, car manufacturers and insurance companies.
MOUNTAINWILLIAM
07-11-09, 09:00 PM
GREAT TIME A DAY, DON'T YOU PEOPLE KNOW THAT TOBACCO CAN KILL YOU??
Seeker2531
07-11-09, 10:06 PM
Most people will quit smoking when its time and they know it, until then let it go,If we have to band anything why not band bullets insted, that would be better for all our healths.
HurricaneRJ
07-12-09, 03:35 AM
I started smoking my first month in the fleet. Cigarettes helped a lot while. I'm trying to quit now with the programs they have here. But even a dead zone has it's stressful games and I go right back to the Menthols. If they ban it, I wouldn't be hurt by it, but each Marine or Sailor has the right to smoke if they want.
I remember being stuck 15 days in the field with no smokes and no dip. When the rest of the BN came out with us. I was paying $2.50 for one square.
redman1
07-12-09, 03:38 AM
William Hardy I remember that well in Nam the same story. I was a Sgt E-5 and couldn't get booze. We could even get hot beer in the field, I was old enought to die but not drink hard liquor.
I don't smoke anymore but not smoking in the military is insane if you want it. Can you imagine what Cigs would cost off base.
Government is trying to control too much theses days.
Semper Fi Redman1
SgtThrasher
07-12-09, 08:00 AM
I quit smoking @Gitmo 1966 and don't have a problem with smoking as long as I don't have to breathe it.They'll close the base slop shute next ,as most corporations are already alcohol free at company events ,for fear of law suits from an employee leaving tanked, subsequently causing a wreck and the company gets sued for serving the alcohol that theoretically caused the accident.
Phantom Blooper
07-14-09, 06:37 PM
Report: Military installations could be smoke-free in 20 years
July 14, 2009 - 6:14 PM
AMANDA HICKEY
The Department of Defense should eliminate tobacco use on military installations, according to a recent study by the Institute of Medicine.
Combat, however, is a “different situation.”
The report titled “Combating Tobacco Use in Military and Veteran Populations,” states that the DoD, Department of Veterans Affairs and Congress should implement a comprehensive strategy to achieve the DoD goal of a tobacco-free military.
While working on the report, committee members weighed the consequences of tobacco on military preparedness, the exposure of second-hand smoke and cost, said Stuart Bondurant, who served as report’s committee chair.
“Our ultimate judgment as expressed in the report was that all three of those compromise the effectiveness of the military service enough that an orderly, long range plan should be adopted to achieve a tobacco-free military service, active duty service and veteran population,” Bondurant said Tuesday.
According to the report, the DoD and VA have “demonstrated a continuing commitment to the health of military personnel and their families and of veterans,” but “much remains to be done.”
“Given the effects of tobacco use on military readiness and on the health of military personnel, retirees, families and veterans, the time has come for DoD and VA to assign high priority to tobacco control,” the report reads.
Released June 26, the report advises DoD and VA to provide counseling and nicotine-replacement therapy and create toll-free “quit lines” for counseling on quitting.
The report also recommends the military set a date to go tobacco-free with each military branch developing — and enforcing — a timeline to make that happen. A ban on smoking at military academies is also suggested as well as extending the current ban on tobacco use during basic training to include technical training.
All military institutions and active-duty personnel would be required to be tobacco-free in 20 years or sooner if the initial phase for military academies and new recruits is in place within a year, according to the report.
“What we’ve learned through other agencies and organizations that have stopped smoking among their employees is that if you do it in a systematic planned way and take your time, you can do it without disrupting the operations of the organization. You minimize the number of people who are made uncomfortable,” said Bondurant.
The study included the state governments of California, Maryland and Massachusetts and other agencies such as hospitals and airlines, he said.
When it comes to deployments and combat, however, Bondurant said circumstances are extraordinary for the military and need to be handled as such.
“It’s a very different situation, there’s no doubt about that,” Bondurant said. “We feel very strongly that deployment overseas and combat is a different situation and has to be handled differently.”
Messages to the Department of Defense from The Daily News regarding the report were not returned by press time.
The Institute was asked to identify policies and practices that could lower rates of smoking and help active-duty military and veterans quit tobacco by the DoD and VA in 2007.
According to the report, tobacco use reduces troops’ physical fitness and endurance and is linked to higher rates of absenteeism and lost productivity.
In 2005, 32 percent of active-duty personnel and 22 percent of veterans were smokers, according to the report. However, rates among active-duty personnel have increased recently.
Contact Amanda Hickey at 910-219-8461 or ahickey@freedomenc.com. Read the Lejeune Deployed blog at http://lejeunedeployed.freedomblogging.com.
Pete0331
07-14-09, 08:22 PM
Can you imagine what Cigs would cost off base.
Government is trying to control too much theses days.
Semper Fi Redman1
Thanks for bringing that up.
Government can't ban cigarettes to the civilian populace.
Too much money from taxes is made from their sale.
Tobacco sold on military bases do not have any added taxes.
So banning them will have no affect on the governments finances.
Also government has been using the military as an environment for social experimentation for a long time.
Both for issues that are just, desegregation in the 50's, and irresponsible, coed boot camp in our sister services.
This proposed ban is to test the effect it will have on government healthcare.
Kegler300
07-15-09, 04:37 AM
For the civilian and contractor workforce on military installations, smokers, in general, take a 10 minute break every hour to smoke a cigarette where I work. That's about an hour to an hour-and-a-half a day they are not at their desk working, while non-smokers continue to work. Seems fair to me...or else let me leave an hour early each day to make up for the hour in smoke breaks I don't take.
Valley Forge. George Washington was asked for a list of supplies he would need to continue the fight. The very top of the list was tobacco.
I hear ya Masterguns... Worked for a company for a while that had analysts. Every once in a while I would need some input on a project. Go outside and there they all were smoking and joking. I need to talk to you about something... just wait till I finish my smoke and I'll get right with you. Come in panting cigarette breath on you asking what is up. Uhh I forgot could you please just leave.
I worked also for Phillip Morris for about a year in Richmond. You would be amazed at how many 10's of thousands of people rely on the tobacco industry for their lively hood. All the way from the farmers in NC to the folks working 10 hour shifts making cigarrette filters. Maybe the government should take that one over too. One step closer. Next thing you know the military will ban guns and cars for servicemen.
Washington state and a few others have attempted to tax people into quitting. A can of copenhagen there is about 10 bucks ... most of which is taxes. Other states are following suit.
Phantom Blooper
07-15-09, 09:11 PM
Jul 15, 9:28 PM EDT
Pentagon won't ban war-zone smoking, despite study
By PAULINE JELINEK
Associated Press Writer
WASHINGTON (AP) -- Smoke 'em if you got 'em. The Pentagon reassured troops Wednesday that it won't ban tobacco products in war zones. Defense officials hadn't actually planned to eliminate smoking - at least for now. But fear of a ban arose among some troops after the Defense Department received a study recommending the military move toward becoming tobacco-free - perhaps in about 20 years.
Press secretary Geoff Morrell pointedly told a Pentagon news conference that Defense Secretary Robert Gates is not planning to prohibit the use of cigarettes, chewing tobacco or other tobacco products by troops in combat.
"He knows that the situation they are confronting is stressful enough as it is," Morrell said, noting the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. "I don't think he is interested in adding to the stress levels by taking away one of the few outlets they may have to relieve stress."
Gates will review the new study to see if there are some things than can be done to work toward the goal of having a smoke-free force some day, Morrell said.
"Obviously, it's not our preference to have a force that is using tobacco products," he said, noting health concerns and the high cost of caring for health-related problems.
The study, commissioned by the Pentagon and the Veterans Affairs Department, recommended that the military start making incremental moves toward becoming smoke-free. The report by the Institute of Medicine suggested the services could start by banning smoking at military academies, then among recruits. It said the VA and Pentagon should eliminate use of tobacco on its facilities and the military should stop selling tobacco products at its commissaries.
The military and VA have been working for years to reduce smoking among soldiers and vets through a number of programs. The Pentagon laid out a plan in 1999 to reduce smoking rates by 5 percent a year and reduce chewing tobacco use to 15 percent by 2001 - and still wasn't able to achieve the goals.
"Tobacco use declined overall from 1980 to 2005, but there has recently been an increase in consumption, possibly because of increased tobacco use by deployed troops," the study said.
The military hasn't placed a high enough priority on reducing tobacco use, according to the study, and that while smoking has declined in the U.S., it remains higher in the military than in the civilian world.
In 2005, a third of members of the active-duty military smoked compared to a fifth of the adult U.S. population, the study said, adding that it "has been implicated in" higher dropout rates during and after basic training, higher absenteeism in the military and other problems.
Criticism of the proposals spread across the Internet and among troops.
"Our troops make enough sacrifices to serve our nation," said Brian Wise, executive director of the advocacy group Military Families United. "They give up many of the freedoms civilians enjoy already without being told they cannot partake in yet another otherwise legal activity."
Spc. Charles Rodriguez, 23, said he started smoking long before he joined the Army and that his pack-a-day habit doesn't affect his physical fitness. His Army instructors during basic training made him quit, but he quickly started up again, Rodriguez said in an interview outside of Fort Campbell, Ky.
During his last deployment to Iraq, Rodriguez found a lot of time to smoke while troops were patrolling or just hanging around the base. He said one of his friends who doesn't normally smoke would join him for a cigarette during the deployment, just out of boredom
Said Rodriguez, "There's nothing else to do and they're cheap over there."
---
Associated Press writers Kristin M. Hall in Oak Grove, Ky., and Lolita C. Baldor in Washington contributed to this report.
© 2009 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may
Alisium
07-15-09, 09:19 PM
This is almost as bad when they stopped selling porn in the PX.
And worse than when Gen. Krulack stopped allowing 18 yo Marines to drink on base.
Pete0331
07-17-09, 06:51 PM
I didn't like it when my Marines smoked.
But they all had a 1st class PFT, didn't fall out on movements, and if they did at night, or on post, I never caught them.
This smoking ban is overreacting to a minor problem.
There are some very serious medical problems in the military realm that need to be addressed.
If they are worried about long term health care costs for the VA, they need to look at how much back, knee, and joint conditions for former military cost the US.
Looking down the road, about 5 - 10 years, there is going to be a massive problem because of the ridiculous amount of armor servicemen are required to wear now.
William Hardy
07-17-09, 09:41 PM
The issue isn't smoking...it the personal rights of individuals whether it be military or civilian. Everyone knows smoking is bad, even the smokers; however, it is not illegal and it's a personal choice. Now this massive ban is like a SOCIALISTIC BIG BROTHER telling you what you can and cannot do on and off post. I keep hearing about how someone is killed by a drunk driver every few minutes. What's next, BIG BROTHER going to pass a law saying that we cannot drink on base anymore? The ultra liberal and ultra conservative side of government are taking over and telling the rest of us what we can and cannot do. Whatever happened to freedom of choice?
GOD SAVE US FROM THIS FOOLISHNESS...the more they talk about freedom, the more freedoms we lose.
Even GOD gave us free choice !!! To each his own. Live your own life, and not mine! Excuse me while I lite up, open my beer and kiss my lovely wife.