View Full Version : MCO on uniform items with civilian attire
Zapablast05
05-22-09, 04:05 PM
I've seen such an order around, but I haven't been able to locate it. Is the order still in effect? I mentioned to one of my Sgt's that I've seen an order around and he wants me to find it and make a copy of it. I've seen many Marine in civilian attire, wearing their boots, wearing chevrons, and having EGA's pinned on their bags. I corrected a Marine on what he was doing was wrong and he said that as long as it's "unserviceable," it can be worn in civilian attire. Is any of this true? I hope someone here can help me find that order.
FattyTheFerret
05-24-09, 04:20 PM
everything you need to know about uniforms is in P1020.34G. I never saw anything specifying use for civilian wear due to being unserviceable but I may have missed it
Supersquishy
05-24-09, 05:44 PM
http://www.unl.edu/nrotc/reference/MCO%20P1020.34G%20W%20CH%201-4.pdf
Scroll down near the end to the Laws and Regulations of the Uniform section. I did see a section of wearing uniform items on Civilian dress attire and wearing of a certain uniform for prior service Marines. I skimmed through it quickly, but I didn't see any regs on uniform items i.e. the EGA.
250+ pages I can't believe I am this friggin bored! I'm going to find something more fun to do....outta here.
PaidinBlood
05-24-09, 05:53 PM
I've seen such an order around, but I haven't been able to locate it. Is the order still in effect? I mentioned to one of my Sgt's that I've seen an order around and he wants me to find it and make a copy of it. I've seen many Marine in civilian attire, wearing their boots, wearing chevrons, and having EGA's pinned on their bags. I corrected a Marine on what he was doing was wrong and he said that as long as it's "unserviceable," it can be worn in civilian attire. Is any of this true? I hope someone here can help me find that order.
If there is a rule, by all means enforce it. Having said that, if you can't find it in writing and it doesn't look bad, who cares? If it is permitted but does look bad, fix it anyway. You (and especially your Sgt) still have every right to lock Marines on for being stupid. Power is what you use it for... :D
For what it's worth, we were taught in boot camp (mid-'05) that boots, MCMAP belt and AWC were permitted for wear with civilian attire. That in NO WAY means I would want to, though. I will admit to wearing my combat boots for camping/hiking, however) As for chevrons, that just sounds weird. EGAs-if they are moto let them be...just my $0.02...
There are only a few items explicitly authorized for wear in civilian attire. Shoes and socks are definitely on that list so use those boots for hiking all you like. You can even rock the patent leather dress shoes aound town if you want. :p
An unserviceable item does not make it authorized fo wear in civilian attire. Obsolete uniform items are, however, authorized.
EGA and rank insignia items that are used on uniforms are not authorized so any EGA or rank insignia should not be any kind of uniform item.
PP1020.34G Section 1005 part 2 will tell you everything you need to know.
commdog7
06-10-09, 04:43 AM
I know you can wear the AWC, wolly pully, and the sweatshirt for civilian attire, but I do not know of any specific uniform 'items' you can wear. If you can't find it in the MCO, I suggest you take a look in the green monster- your training NCO should have some, if you accidentally threw yours out... Marines have a tendency to do that. Hope this helps.
ArtyOps
06-10-09, 05:17 AM
(1) Items authorized for wear with civilian clothing by men are
restricted to the gold cuff links, studs, tie bar, mourning band, footwear, socks, gloves, undergarments, black bow-tie, green wool scarf, general purpose trunks, and crew neck-service sweater, the all-weather coat, tanker jacket, personally owned extreme cold weather jackets (gortex) without grade insignia, watch caps, and cold weather physical training uniforms.
(2) Uniform items authorized for wear with civilian clothing by women
are restricted to the white shirt without insignia of grade, footwear,
gloves, handbag, clutch purse, mourning band, crew-neck service sweaters,
green wool scarf, general purpose trunks, the all-weather coat, extreme cold weather jacket (gortex) tanker jacket or the dress blue sweater without insignia of grade, watch caps, and cold weather physical training uniforms.
(3) Uniform items that have been declared obsolete may be worn with
civilian clothing, when appropriate, provided such items contain no
distinctive insignia or buttons.
From the MCO. Page 25 and 26
Zapablast05
06-14-09, 10:43 PM
Thanks for helping me find this article, everybody. Everyone seems to be more locked on about civilian attire now in my Squadron. The Squadron Gunny and First Sergeant recognized me as a "motivated...
Alisium
06-14-09, 10:48 PM
I went to "The Palace" (well I used to go all the time) up in Hollywood and I schit you not, I saw a boot wearing supre spit-shined jungles with his outfit.
Good onions onthe spit-shine but man what a fag.
this has been addressed before in another thread.
shoes and socks yes, yet the combat boots have the EGA on them witch in another part of the order states that with that, you are not authorized to wear them in civilian attire... that's why they added that to the boots because some moto cowboys wore their black boots in civies and the order didn't specify foot wear...
so the EGA corrects that loop-hole without over complicating the order.
there are other Service Uniform items you can wear in civies, like your web-belt, tie clip, corafams, and shirt stays (not really a uniform item... I know).
anything to do with cammies is off limits.
PFC1023CoB
06-21-09, 10:06 PM
If you see anyone that just graduated boot camp, ask to see his green monster. There is an order, I'm not sure if it's new, but I read it plain as day in my green monster while in boot camp, of which I just graduated. From what I understood from that chapter, you're allowed to wear unservicable marine corp uniform items, but there are some uniform items that can be worn out of uniform such as the boots which they told us in boot camp we could wear out of uniform. I guess that one's under controversy. But the new marine that you corrected was right to a point, but I hope he wasn't disrespectful.
you can not wear the new boots... I'll go hunt for it in the order if you Marines really really want me to.
and unserviceable uniform Items are not authorized to be worn with civilian attire... otherwise you'd be able to wear the whole uniform so long as they have quarter sized holes in all the garments.
really, where do you get this from? I doubt it's in the green monster... I still have mine and if I go look I'll bet you mis-interpreted what it said.
Zapablast05
06-21-09, 10:24 PM
I think the green monster hasn't been revised since 2007. There's a paper copy of the order down on the quarter deck. I can go take a look at it. ArtyOps posted the order already and when I was signing out with the SDO to go out in town, he saw that this Marine had his jungle boots on and told him to read the order on the wall. Amazingly enough, it was the same exact order that ArtyOps posted previously. Verbatum. I don't know what that Marine's problem is with following a simple order. His argument was that it's unserviceable and he can wear it. I told him that unserviceable and obsolete are totally different things. You don't have to hunt it down, SSgt. This Marine is just that 10% from boot camp that's always going to be OFP.
roger, Thanks killer.
now go learn to fix things that fly...
Zapablast05
06-21-09, 10:30 PM
Oorah SSgt.
3 weeks left and I'm out of A school. Been here almost 7 months.
A school is generalized aircraft stuff while b school is....? or is it c school??? I'm Motor T Maint...
Zapablast05
06-21-09, 10:41 PM
Straight to C school after A. I don't know why it's like that. I'm already going to get my orders to my C school next week. NAS Jax, FL or NAS Coronado, CA. Hopefully I go back to CA for my C school. :marine:
PFC1023CoB
06-21-09, 11:46 PM
You're right... The green monster I got has been revised but it does say pretty much the same stuff. They did however tell us in boot camp that we can wear the boots. Idk... breakdown in communication or something, not sure... I've worn them all week since I don't have any other foot wear besides my coraframs.
corafams... and you should go buy yourself some sneakers...
and no they are not authorized... any camouflage uniform items with the eagle globe and anchor on it is not authorized... your boots have them...
only uniform items are from your service uniform.
this has been addressed before in another thread.
shoes and socks yes, yet the combat boots have the EGA on them witch in another part of the order states that with that, you are not authorized to wear them in civilian attire... that's why they added that to the boots because some moto cowboys wore their black boots in civies and the order didn't specify foot wear...
so the EGA corrects that loop-hole without over complicating the order.
there are other Service Uniform items you can wear in civies, like your web-belt, tie clip, corafams, and shirt stays (not really a uniform item... I know).
anything to do with cammies is off limits.
MCO 1020.34G explicitly states all footwear with no limitation or exceptions for MCCBs. The EGA is there to demarcate boots that are authorized for wear in uniform - meaning that they meet the minimum requirements set forth by Marine Corps.
If the EGA restriction makes the MCCBs off limits, then so is the tie bar since there is embossed EGA on it.
By putting the restriction in another section of the order, that far complicates things because it makes the order contradict itself by authorizing MCCBs and tie bar in one section and then prohibiting it in another section by restricting items with EGA. It would have been far less confusing to say something like all footwear except MCCBs or explicitly authorize only the dress shoes.
those are exceptions that are put on the SERVICE uniform items, I can't recall where it is, but there is verbage stating that the cammies are not authorized civilian wear.
but the order only allows what you can wear... anything it doesn't state is not authorized and the EGA on the boots fixes the need to change this order by simply adding somthing to the uniform item.
when possible they try not to change MCOs... it keeps it so you don't have to re-learn the order.
cchanderson
09-13-10, 01:39 PM
you can not wear the new boots... I'll go hunt for it in the order if you Marines really really want me to.
The order specifically states you can wear the tie clasp and boots even though they have an Eagle Globe and Anchor...The specification of exact uniform items supersedes the general specification of displaying "insignias of any nature".
Without a doubt you can because the order specifically states that you can...and the order doesn't change because an Eagle Globe and Anchor was added to the boots because the tie clasp has always had had one and it has been authorized for wear for decades...
FattyTheFerret
09-13-10, 01:48 PM
I've looked through the order in the past and haven't been able to find anything saying that we can wear the boots. It's a big order though, can you point to specific part in case someone I know get lifed for it?
>Ch 5 (1) Items authorized for wear with civilian clothing by men are restricted to...footwear, socks...ALMAR 019/08
http://www.marcorsyscom.usmc.mil/sites/mcub/PAGES/Uniform%20Regs%20Chapters/Chapter%201_files/Chapter%201.asp section 1005 part 2
This would seem to imply that boots are authorized for wear in civilian attire within the US.
I wear my unserviceable green cammies ONLY for paintballing, i don't wear any rank, nor are there name tapes / service tapes on my blouse when I play. Other than that I don't wear any Marine Corps. outside the Marine Corps.
you can not wear the new boots... I'll go hunt for it in the order if you Marines really really want me to.
and unserviceable uniform Items are not authorized to be worn with civilian attire... otherwise you'd be able to wear the whole uniform so long as they have quarter sized holes in all the garments.
really, where do you get this from? I doubt it's in the green monster... I still have mine and if I go look I'll bet you mis-interpreted what it said.
Here's the order Petz....
Since the Boots are in military character because they have the EGA embossed on the heal they are not authorized in civilian attire.
P1020.34G Chapter 5 states...
e. No part of a prescribed uniform, except those items not exclusively
military in character, will be worn with civilian clothing.
>Ch 5 (1) Items authorized for wear with civilian clothing by men are
restricted to the gold cuff links, studs, tie bar, mourning band, footwear,
socks, gloves, undergarments (the green undershirt may only be worn for PT),black bow-tie, green wool scarf, general purpose trunks, and crew neck-1005 MARINE CORPS UNIFORM REGULATIONS 1-17 service sweater, the all-weather coat, tanker jacket, the dress blue sweater without insignia of grade (with or without epaulettes), watch caps, and cold
weather physical training uniforms (only worn as a set for PT situations, for non-PT situations, only the sweatshirt or running suit jacket maybe worn as an outergarment or as a layering garment). ALMAR 019/08
>Ch 5 (2) Uniform items authorized for wear with civilian clothing by women are restricted to the white shirt without insignia of grade, footwear, gloves, green undershirt (for physical training only), handbag, clutch purse, mourning band, crew-neck service sweaters, green wool scarf, general purpose trunks, the all-weather coat, tanker jacket or the dress blue sweater without insignia of grade (with or without epaulettes), watch caps, and cold weather physical training and Marine Corps running suits (only worn as a set for PT situations, for non-PT situations, only the sweatshirt or running suit jacket maybe worn as an outergarment or as a layering garment). ALMAR 019/08
(3) Uniform items that have been declared obsolete may be worn with
civilian clothing, when appropriate, provided such items contain no
distinctive insignia or buttons.
>Ch 5 (1) Items authorized for wear with civilian clothing by men are restricted to...footwear, socks...ALMAR 019/08
http://www.marcorsyscom.usmc.mil/sites/mcub/PAGES/Uniform%20Regs%20Chapters/Chapter%201_files/Chapter%201.asp section 1005 part 2
This would seem to imply that boots are authorized for wear in civilian attire within the US.
Read the sentance before this one where it says only items not in military character are authorized.
Boots have the EGA on them, therefore they are not authorized.
Read the sentance before this one where it says only items not in military character are authorized.
Boots have the EGA on them, therefore they are not authorized.
gunz by your methodology the tie clasp is not authorized for civilian wear even though the order says it is as it has the EGA on it. Boots are not solely military in character and just because the EGA is on it does not make it so. I believe that what they are talking about as items being in military character is cammies and such that is not normal civilian wear. and aside from that the order says footwear is allowed IF it meant only the corframs (sp?) then it would have mentioned as such since it is the only non boot footwear that we have aside from sneakers but those are govt issue.
gunz by your methodology the tie clasp is not authorized for civilian wear even though the order says it is as it has the EGA on it. Boots are not solely military in character and just because the EGA is on it does not make it so. I believe that what they are talking about as items being in military character is cammies and such that is not normal civilian wear. and aside from that the order says footwear is allowed IF it meant only the corframs (sp?) then it would have mentioned as such since it is the only non boot footwear that we have aside from sneakers but those are govt issue.
I have emailed the board and am waiting for a response.
very well gunz im interested in hearing as ive been told both ways and dont know myself however i was just playing devils advocate so to speak with that there are valid arguments for both sides
very well gunz im interested in hearing as ive been told both ways and dont know myself however i was just playing devils advocate so to speak with that there are valid arguments for both sides
I agree, I don't know why someone would want to wear them with civvies anyway.
I agree, I don't know why someone would want to wear them with civvies anyway.
i personally have if i am hiking or such because they are already broken in sometimes but other than that i dont
2nd0321
03-13-11, 05:46 PM
when i go hunting i wear my cammies or the digies. i have been out for awhile and i believe what i can choose to wear what is service related as long as i do it with the same pride as when i was in. just my thoughts
gunz anyword from the board?
gunz anyword from the board?
No nothing, I think I will ping them again.
Alright, check it out. I resent my email to the board and this is what came back. I was supprised at how quickly it came back. The first part is my question and the second part is the boards response.
Mr. Xxxxx,
Are the MCCBs authorized for wear in civilian attire? I realize the order states footwear is authorized. It also states, no part of a prescribed uniform, except those items not exclusively military in character, will be worn with civilian clothing. The MCCBs have the EGA embossed on them, does this make them exclusively military in character?
GySgt Wood,
All footwear, as you indicated, are (by the Order) authorized for wear with civilian attire. The EGA (along with a certification number) happens to be an identifier which assists with the qualification/MC Certification process towards wear with the Uniform. There is a qualification reverse here. It's the civilian item being authorized for wear with the Uniform based on a manufacturing competition for the privilege.
S/F
Mr. X. Xxxxx sends.
Marine Corps Uniform Board
Just found out you answered my question. so we have definitive word that boots are authorized. all those ppl that are opposed to it will hate to hear that lol. thanks gunz for the reply and answer.
3rdUSMCMcCullum
03-30-11, 09:16 PM
I'm glad you cleared this up for us. I wear hiking boots with my jeans all the time (yeah, I'm black). I used to lace up my Timberlands as soon as the school day was over so I could walk through the city without being teased (I went to an all boys preppie school).
I'm just not comfortable in sneakers and now I'm especially comfortable in my bates. Once I can afford the extra $200, I'll buy some no-logo M8's. Last summer I threw on my bates a few times because they don't make my feet sweat and I walk a lot (I never owned a car). The are more comfy and breathable than anything at Foot Locker and I hate sneakers. Still, I didn't make a habit of it, fearing the logo.
I like their answer too. The logo is for us to know which boots are approved or not. This cheers me up. Under Armour still sells a lot of neat Olive Drab garments with no USMC approval number. A tag on the inside would be useful. Kevin A. Plank taught me to hate cotton.