View Full Version : Concerning tattoos and the ECP program....
Devildogg99
03-30-09, 12:00 PM
I recently submitted my ECP package for the upcoming June board. I do have tattoos of which only 2 can be seen in pt gear and service "c". The tattoos in question are 2 nautical stars one on each forearm. They are about 2 inches by 2 inches, very small indeed. I was grandfathered in 2 years ago so it is shown on my pg 11 which is included in my package along with all digital photo closeups to include descriptions per the order. My package is good to go and I just got my CO endorsement.
My question is even though I got my CO endorsement would those bar me from getting my CG endorsement as well as being selected from the board?
I personally don't think the CO would endorse a package if he thought it was against the order or that I would be wasting my time. However, it is the Marine Corps so anything can happen.
The order is vague and generic to the point of being just basic. I did find an order for selection boards which is what they follow as far as tattoos. It says some can have a waiver and if you can cover it up with your hand its good to go. Of which my hand no doubt covers up a 2" x 2" tattoo.
Enough of my novel....your thoughts...
well I want to say, I have no idea what ECP is... sorry, but generally they take the recommendations of your commanding officer into consideration because many things can be waived or are "debatable" to the point that they'd have to know who you are. If you didn't have your CO's approval then I'd say you have no shot... but if and only if your CO is wrong will you get an almost instant denial.
I've dealt with situations like this with terminal leave before... the 1st Sgt thought he had the authority to deny it when he could only recommend against it's approval... he got his butt chewed I think...
Devildogg99
03-30-09, 12:15 PM
Ultimately the board itself has the final say of course, but I was wanting someone who maybe came across this themselves or have known someone with same situation. The ECP program is for enlisted Marines who already have a Bachelors degree to apply for commission. I know its roughly 90% selection because not many enlisted Marines have a degree that would apply. I do know the Corps is hurting for 2nd LT. since they are offering $4,000 bonus for newly commissioned.
I guess if I don't hear anything in the coming weeks by 1 May I would guess it is there. I have the option of emailing MCRC after 20 May to see if my package was accepted for the board.
Like you and I said I don't think the CO would waste his time or put his name on something he didn't feel like had a chance of going.
yeah, basically.... the CO doesn't want to look like an idiot to all those possible "bosses" in his future.
have you thought about having them removed? there are some really easy laser removals that will only take a weekend to get done...
if you get denied for that reason you might want to think about that option for next year... or the next board.
Devildogg99
03-30-09, 12:29 PM
I have thought about it and the Doc was an idiot when I brought it up. I also brought it up to the SgtMaj. since he sat on my command board. He told me that might be my only obstacle so I guess we will see. I don't know if the CG of 2nd MAW holds boards, but I know the CG of MCIWEST does. If I have to go see him I will explain that to him. On my promotion photo as well they are not visible so I think it would be a ****ty deal if that prevented me from getting selected.
SGT7477
03-30-09, 12:36 PM
I have thought about it and the Doc was an idiot when I brought it up. I also brought it up to the SgtMaj. since he sat on my command board. He told me that might be my only obstacle so I guess we will see. I don't know if the CG of 2nd MAW holds boards, but I know the CG of MCIWEST does. If I have to go see him I will explain that to him. On my promotion photo as well they are not visible so I think it would be a ****ty deal if that prevented me from getting selected.
Your profile needs work Marine.:flag:
SSgt Ramsey
03-31-09, 07:09 AM
Tattoo's were getting to be a very hot topic for both retention and special duty assignments before I left as a Career Planner.
Simply, tattoo's can kill your career and chances at SDA's and or officer programs, as each has less/more stringent guidelines to a degree.
I don't know what the policy is now, but when I left, a package had to be created with a statement by the Marine stating what each of the tattoo's was (were) and what their significance was. These had to be submitted to the Recruiting School for adjudication and acceptability.
During one of the HRST visits, I had a new SSgt request to go on Recruiting Duty so we did a package on him. Very qualified, no legal issues, but he had some tat's. One of them was a Marine holding a rifle in mourning a fallen friend with his name etc. and the other was his son's name "Hunter" on his forearm drawn in childs building block letters.
He was disapproved for recruiting duty by them.
I have a buddy who got disenrolled from MECEP for tattoos. He had a bunch when he got accepted and got a couple more after, which I think is what did it for him. If you were grandfathered in though and they are small I doubt that the board would vote no. I wouldn't sweat it too much, just don't get any more.
if you get shot down, just get them removed... you can always get approval to get them again later after you're an officer...
Devildogg99
04-02-09, 10:25 PM
Yea they are small and I was grandfathered in and havent gotten any since due to that fact. I think that is what has saved me. Tomorrow is the board with colonel and they didnt reject my package so I think I am good to go so far.
Yea for the guy whose friend was in MECEP you are right. He got booted because he got more because he was accepted for his current ones and the orders state what you can and can't do. If he got them while in the program and all then its bye bye.
Devildogg99
04-03-09, 08:38 PM
So update if anyone is interested haha...I had my meeting today with the Colonel and it was a one on one meeting and he accepted my package and didn't even say a word about any of my tattoos. I will take that as a great sign. So now I wait for my selection message
Congrdualation SSgt!
I talked with the OSO last Summer about OCS and he simply told me, "no shizt waiver for my tattoo" because I have one on my left forearm. Being active duty would help alot.
Since then, I have this tattoo laser removed and afte 8 treatments, I can still barely see it. I hope it won't hinder me getting back in.
Devildogg99
04-04-09, 06:25 PM
So you got out and now trying to come back in? Ya that might hinder it a bit given the new strict standards. I think they need to relax the tattoo standards a bit and revert back to prior 2007. They should still screen for keeping in good faith and order. Especially with the new recruiting order on tattoos. They just effed it up. If you have tats on your lower arm even a simple EGA you cannot go on recruiting duty period no waiver. If you are already on recruiting duty you can finish your tour but can't come back for a second tour. Not only does it hurt the chance to get poolees who could be great Marines but great Marines already who could recruit. Retention is going to take a dive coming up just watch due to this. I understand some concerns but don't bite the hand that feeds. I know no family who says no because a recruiter has tats, they say no because they don't want their kids joining any branch period. I know every commandant wants to make his "mark" on the corps, but there are so many other ways they could make their mark
I'm working on getting back in myself... just found out today that my paperwork was jacked and the board already convened... the MEPS guy didn't bother mentioning the package got kicked back until the SgtMaj got involved.... something about the guy going TAD around the time the package was sent up and the guy covering for him didn't know what was going on... or something to that nature... I got raped basically.
no issues with my tattoos though, I've got under 4 and that's good enough... it's kinda like enlisting for the first time but you have prior service... and you have to go through a "long board"... something that to this point has taken me 6 months to get to.
Devildogg99
04-04-09, 10:44 PM
Ya go figure on that one somebody went TAD and drops the ball. I hate people always out for themselves. I mean its ok to go on leave or go away some where but make sure people aren't depending on you at the moment. That's why I always do everything myself and check up on everything as often as I can. If it annoys people oh well I want to make sure whatever I am doing is done. Anything worth doing is worth doing right.
yeah, I was doing that.. my recruiter says he was doing that ( I can only believe him ) and then the guys who should know what's going on say they don't know... the thing that ****es me off is that the board has already convened for what I hear already a month... so even if my paperwork gets fixed I don't know if they'll accept the package unless the Sgt Maj is in tight with anyone there or of higher rank to get my stuff pushed in (no homo) as a special exception or something.
I'm really bumed out right now...
Devildogg99
04-04-09, 10:54 PM
the board to come back in as enlisted or an officer?
enlisted...
yeah, sorry, I know this thread is for officer... I went on a tangent... I'm really bumed.
I in the same boat with you SSgt Petzold.
I must have ...zed off my recruiter because I guessed he felt that I bugged him alot. He told me to go enlist with the Army because the M.C. is not taking back SNCO anymore. And I almost got a heart attack! Then I called my brother's recruiter and the Gunnery told me that the M.C. is shutting the door on Sgt and below, and still taking SNCO.
The Gunnery set me up for MEPS last Monday but I was DQ because of my eye lasik surgery. I have to wait until April 24th, six months after the surgery. According to him that he will try to send my package out for May board.
So, is the M.C. is not taking back Sgt and below or SNCO? I am not really sure what to believe, but the Gunnery still give me hope here.
the order states they take SNCOs year round, where as Sgt and below is restricted to troop strength... but so many Marines are getting out in the next year that it'll all open back up.
I've got hope, and I'm not letting it go.
Devildogg99
04-07-09, 12:03 AM
The new word on the street is they are going to be reverting the tattoo policy because it has affected retention and people joining and prior Marines. So keep your fingers crossed on that one if you want to come back but can't. Like I said its the word on the street but who knows when or truly if that will happen.
:flag:
well that's just good news in general.... it's kinda overbearing in it's function.
though I understand their justifications for it... either way, I just do as I'm told.
Devildogg99
07-02-09, 07:47 PM
The MARADMIN came out today and I found out I got selected for the ECP program. Even with tattoos you can get in. However, they can't be excessive or beyond waiverable plus they must follow regulations keeping with standards. Bring on OCS Oct 2nd
congratulations!!!!!
I hope all goes as planned! better bone up on your english comp as you'll write essays for screwing up....