Sad story, I need some answers, maybe someone here can help.

[robpritc]

Please bear with me, this may be long. I have been looking for answers all weekend.

Our son left for PI on July 6. We got our phone call Wednesday night--he sounded fine.


FRIDAY-----
Then today I was out and when I came home there was a message on my machine from a counselor at PI--he said this is a non-emergency call for (me) and to please call him. I called him back and immediately asked if our son was okay. He said he's fine, the counselor just wanted to verify some information with me--our son had gone to a therapist once last January (2008) for some things I was concerned about,-- and the PI counselor said he just wanted to verify the story our son had told him. I told him what happened, the PI counselor’s like, that is just what he told me, that's fine.

THEN he hits me with, well since it took you so long to call back (It was now 4:00, he called at 1:16--I was out, how could I call him sooner?) I sent him to the doctor (what doctor, I don't know). Well our son had to wait awhile to see the doctor and the doctor told the counselor that (son) was crying uncontrollably and couldn't get himself together when he saw the doctor. The doctor has suggested that he be sent home because he "cannot handle this right now". The counselor told me he (the counselor) went in and yelled at the doctor when he heard this because he saw no indication in our son that he couldn't "handle being here", just that he was homesick and the counselor recommended giving him 3 weeks and he would be over it. (I agree) The doctor refused to listen (according to the counselor). Now, from what I understand, they have already begun processing him for home (but I am not 100% sure), I know he said something about it, but I was so confused and caught off guard, but we won't know for sure until Monday.

I immediately called his recruiters and they said they will call their contacts and see what they can find out, but they did say it doesn't make sense. The recruiters said they don't usually just send someone home on the advice of one doctor, they usually have a board of doctors that discuss the case, so they thought that was all strange, too. And why did the counselor say "Since it took me a while to call him back..." I called him as soon as I got home, as soon as I got the message.

If I had been home when the counselor called, I would have been able to verify our son’s story right then and there, would that have made a difference? I feel like it is all my fault for two reasons—one for taking him to a therapist in January and two for not being home when the phone call came. I am beating myself up that it is my fault, that I have now screwed up his whole life for one doctor appointment that lasted at most an hour. He has never been diagnosed with anything, mentally or physically, and he has never been on medications for anything.

It just feels like a bad dream right now because it sounds so mixed up.

The recruiters said our son was the one they knew was ready out of the group that went from our area. My son had worked with the recruiters all this past year, so they knew him and knew his personality, etc. He has been in the DEP program for a year.

Before the counselor mentioned him being homesick, I asked the counselor if he thought he was just homesick when he was crying with the doctor and he said "yes, definitely, but they all are now. It sounds like the counselor had our son pegged to a t,but then when he went into the doctor, it sounds to me like our son had too much time to wait (the counselor said he had to wait awhile before the doctor was available) and he just started thinking and getting scared (probably thinking maybe he said the wrong thing by being honest? I don't know.

I am probably not making much sense now as I am such a mess and there are so many unknowns. I know he is in a totally different situation than he has ever been in and I can't say how he would react, but our son never cries (though I know stress can do a lot to a person), so I really can't picture him being that upset.

He was very prepared and knew what would be expected (within reason--without actually being there). This has been his dream FOREVER!!! If it is gone, I don't know what he will do.

I feel so helpless right now.

I am totally shocked. The closer and closer it got to boot camp, the happier he became actually because he was looking forward to it.

SUNDAY----
Our son called yesterday. He said--Mom, they are sending me home. I asked why, he said because of the doctor's appointment he had in January...(the one I mentioned above, that I took him to because of concerns I had). Nothing ever came of it, he was fine--just mom getting overly worked up about things. He never had to go back, never in his whole life has he been diagnosed with anything such as depression, anxiety, etc. etc.

He only had 5 minutes to talk he said, so it was hard for me to think of what to ask or say. I hadn't been expecting his phone call. I asked him why would that ONE appointment make a difference and I said it doesn't make sense. The recruiters knew about this. He never lied about it if someone asked because there was nothing to lie about....

He said he will be home in 14 to 21 days...if they want him out, why should it take so long to get him home. I asked him if he was okay, he said no, which I can understand. He probably doesn't understand all this either.

I asked if he could re-enlist after this, he didn't know....

From all I have read through the years on the military and even these past few days in my looking for an answer--this is no reason he should be sent home. One website said you CANNOT register for the military IF you have had 6 months or more of psychiatric care UNLESS you have a waiver--so even in that case, if you have a waiver, you still may be able to join.

In Making the Marines by Thomas Ricks. he mentions how a lot of recruits get homesick but they keep them in and they get over it. Also on this website (leatherneck) I found more info. to that same effect.

Tomorrow at least is Monday so hopefully phone calls will be answered and I will learn more.

My son even said, mom don't send any letters now---well, I still want to send letters--course not the ones I was originally sending, but he needs to know I still love him and support him and am proud of him. I think he is mad at me for that doctor appointment—I would be too—and I am mad at myself, probably more made than he will ever be, but they were concerns at the time and I never thought this would happen.

I'm sorry, I don't swear, but I really want to say WHAT THE F......is going on?

Can anyone give me any ideas. Since he told us it will be 14 to 21 days before he comes home, I feel even more helpless.

Once the recruiters get on the phone tomorrow, could there be a chance he (son) will be able to stay?

I apologize for the long post, I just felt you needed to know the whole story to help give me an answer.

Thank you.

[darkgreen0311]

Mamm, i'm going to be blunt it just seems he can't take boot camp and he's not the first. It doesn't matter how long he was dep or worked with the recruiters some are not ready for the challenge and boot camp is not for everyone.

Recruits don't go see counselors or doctors unless they're telling D.I's they can't take it or is threatening to do harm to himself. I don't mean to be cold but these are the facts.






:marine: Semper Fi 4 Life
Yours is not to question why but to do or die!!!

[CH53MetalMan]

I certainly feel your pain, but I have no info nor advice to pass along.

I wish you and your family well. In time all this will be water under the bridge, and life will go on, as it always does.

[robpritc]

No, I know he wouldn't be the first, this is just a shock to my system, I never would have expected it.

So, you think there is possibly something that the counselor didn't tell me? He wouldn't let me talk to the doctor. But wouldn't the counselor have given me the whole story?

I appreciate your help, no matter whether it is good news or bad news. I am probably not doing by body any good by being so upset about this for so long.

As I pray it is nothing you suggested, IF it is just homesickness, don't they usually try to keep them there? After all, I keep reading that the Marines will try hard to keep you, they won't let you go easy.

Sorry for all the questions.

[darkgreen0311]

Mamm there may be something the counselor could be holding back but......i don't know. Recruits don't go home unless refusing to train or threatening to harm himself. I doubt it has to do with anything regarding a missed Doctors appointment from January. I think most Marines here will tell you pretty much the same. There has to be more to it.







:marine: Semper Fi 4 Life
Yours is not to question why but to do or die!!!

[GySgtRet]

Robin,

Stop beating yourself up. I have never heard of such a thing on one doctor's opinion, hopefully he was a phychiatrist? These doesn't seem to be enough information provided by the couselor to you or to the couselore to even help in this situation. Since it may be 14 21 days maybe the recruiting station can write or call the Easteren Recfruting region through the chain of command? Everything must go through the chain of command but ultimatel the decsion rests at the Depot Level. Just some adive for you, take it if you think it will help. If you have the Recruting Commanding Officer's information I would be on the phone now with him/her. I am sure there has been a briefing or will be soon. The CO needs this information to make the decision to help your son. I know that you do not want to interfere in this subject but I would contact that doctor from the January appointment just incase his professional opinion is needed.

It is a damn shame that your sone has to go through this. The way you put it this has been your sdon'e dream for sometime and he should be allowed for this dream to come true. I would alos suggest contacting your congressman/woman if you trust them to dispatch and get the ball rolling rapidly, sometimes things get bogged down in the government and they really won't know the levity and imporatance to your son. Granted you son is probably angry with you but I think he is more angry at the rediculous nature of this entire matter.

Just my 2 cents for what its worth.

Gunny out
:usmc:

[robpritc]

Mr. Reagle, thank you very much. My day tomorrow is pretty much planned out now--I will go to the recruiter's office and start there. I had been in contact with the recruiters Friday, but by the time I got in contact with them, it was 4:30 or so and they couldn't get hold of anyone. We talked to them yesterday and they had not spoken with anyone either. Thank you for the psy. information. I thought that may be a good idea myself. I will call him tomorrow and have him write something up, maybe just his notes from that day, even. He even told me at the time that there was no reason this should stop him from joining the Marines. I have no problem getting in touch with a congressmen either.

Thank you so much for your help. I will try to keep you guys updated. I appreciate everyone's help.

[GySgtRet]

Just out of curiosity how old is your son? New surroundings treat everybody differently, your son may just be in cultur shock eventhough you state he was ready. Yes, please keep us informed. I am hoping that the other Marines that posted are incorrect but I wouldn't rule out what they have advised either.

Gunny out
:usmc:

[robpritc]

He's 18, he just turned 18 on May 27. Yes, I am sure it is a culture shock to him, but like I said it has been his dream forever (the military). He talked to Army and Navy recruiters a couple times each and then when he talked to the Marine recruiter, he said he just knew that was where he should be. (I think it was the challenge of the Marines--the hardest, toughest branch of the miltary with the longest, toughest training that he liked.)

[Phantom Blooper]

Ma'am,with the rather long post...I may have missed something. My question is again sorry if answered...Did you son receive a waiver or report the doctors visit in January to his recruiter and was he given any type of medication? Again sorry if you answered.:evilgrin:

[robpritc]

No problem, I don't mind you asking...there was no medication involved, not a diagnosis even. It was basically mom overreacting. This was the first and only time he had ever been to a therapist. I can say 100% he was always honest with his recruiters. Also, I know he would have told them at MEPS, etc. too. I am sure you are wondering if he had denied something to begin with, and then in some final questioning this topic came up and that is why they are sending him home for lying or denying information, but no, I honestly don't think that could be the case, plus then I think the counselor from PI would have told me that when I talked to him on Friday.

When he first started talking to recruiters a few years ago, I told him to make sure he mentions his headaches (about once a year or so he gets a doozy, never been diagnosed as migraines or anything though) and he has always mentioned them, so that is why I know he would mention the therapist appointment. I really think he would be too scared NOT to mention anything.

In my opinion, I also think he would be too intimidated to say he wanted to go home, but then again, I have never been in the situation he is in now.

[Phantom Blooper]

Not a question of lying...a question of documentation. If he is having problems that was given to a counselor....and I am in agreement with GySgt Reagle...never heard of it before.

And during the course of conversation he mentioned that he spoke to a doctor in January and it was not documented Black & White on paper. That is my concern.....nothing about lying. :evilgrin:

[robpritc]

So maybe we should have had that documented? It never even crossed my mind to ask if they needed to have documentation on that.

[Phantom Blooper]

Yes Ma,am.....every medical doctor appoint or Psychiatric appointment if any treatment or counseling/family therapy was given should be in Black & White... paper documented.Recruiting offices is one place that you want to make a paper trail.

In my opinion and only mine...your son told the recruiter...it is his(recruiters) responsibility to insure that it was written in record and reported to MEPS.Sometimes they do and sometimes they don't because of one time.But now with the boot camp history...In my opine the past came to surface. Hopefully and I honestly do hope that I am wrong. But from what I am understanding this is the case. Again I hope that I am wrong and a solution can be had.:evilgrin:

[Big Jim]

So maybe we should have had that documented? It never even crossed my mind to ask if they needed to have documentation on that.


Its a definite possibility ma'am and you can ask that of his recruiters...but as my brother darkgreen stated...it does sound like there's more to this and the sad true fact of it is that you won't know until you get the stories from the Marine Corps and your son. Like my brothers have said...the Marine Corps isn't for everybody...some people just aren't made up for what the Marine Corps needs...which is good for all involved...my sympathies and apologies for your son's deep hearted disappointment, ma'am. Its better to find this out now than later...which is all the need for boot camp and its strict regimen.

[robpritc]

I just had another thought. If it turns out the problem was because there was no documentation for this appointment, then I am assuming the recruiters and I can still try to keep him in--by going through the chain of command, getting proof, etc. Also, if they don't keep him now (IF it is because of no documentation), will he be able to re-enlist? Thank you.

[darkgreen0311]

I actually hope everything works out for your son.I believe you stated that he's been crying to the counselor that he's home sick. That's a red flag and if he's saying he's home sick there is no telling what he's telling this counselor or doctor. Hopefully you'll find out in the coming days.








:marine: Semper Fi 4 Life
Yours is not to question why but to do or die!!!

[Big Jim]

I just had another thought. If it turns out the problem was because there was no documentation for this appointment, then I am assuming the recruiters and I can still try to keep him in--by going through the chain of command, getting proof, etc. Also, if they don't keep him now (IF it is because of no documentation), will he be able to re-enlist? Thank you.

IF INDEED IT WAS DUE TO THE RECRUITERS FAULT OF NOT TRYING TO OBTAIN A WAIVER FOR THE YOUNG MAN'S DOCTOR VISIT...YES HE WOULD GET TO STAY IN I WOULD THINK...BUT YOU REALLY HAVE TO WAIT AND SEE EXACTLY WHAT CAUSED ALL OF THIS MESS. YOU NEVER KNOW UNTIL YOU KNOW FOR SURE...UNDERSTAND? JUST WAIT AND SEE...OK?

[robpritc]

Yes Big Jim, thank you, I know I need to wait and see but this whole weekend of waiting has felt like an eternity.

Darkgreen, I understand what you are saying. It's just that all I have read over the past year (since he signed the papers) is that the marines don't send them home this easy if they are just homesick. I also would want him to stay if that is all it is, knowing he would get over it. I hope that is all it is, but whether it is or not, I know that mom can't fix it all, as much as we want too.

Sgt Reagle, just wanted to say thanks again, my mind is at least a little more at ease now.

All of you have been very helpful and supportive to this very distressed mom.

[Isrowei]

This has nothing to do with whether he is "cut out" for the Corps or not. He hadn't even met his Drill Instructors yet so that argument is moot. Sounds like a moment of truth confession and lack of documention. Which.. would kinda feel like getting punished for doing the right thing and that is a lot of stress for a young man to handle. I don't blame him for crying one bit.

Best advice is to wait it out. Talk to the recruiters and keep up with them for info. They don't want him to come back any more than you do.

Good luck.

[UsmcMotorT]

Well maybe he broke down or whatever during receiving. You are sleep and food deprived for two days. And maybe he bugged out and someone noticed it.

Hopefully everything works out.

[robpritc]

Hi, Me again. I have spent the day trying to work this all out. I still have no answers. I went to the recruiters as soon as they opened this morning. They had not heard anything. I just talked to them 1/2 an hour ago, still nothing. This is just nuts. The recruiters did suggest I get a statement from the therapist our son saw, which someone above suggested. They said they would send that statement with a waiver "in case" that was the problem and maybe it would help. I went to the therapist's office, the doctor said he would fax it to them this afternoon. When I called the recruiters a short while ago, they still had not received the fax. I made sure the therapist knew how important it was. So, I just got off the phone with therapist's office, of course he is gone already, but they left messages on both his home phone and cell phone. I hope I hear from them or him soon. This just keeps getting crazier. I called our congressman's office--got a machine, left a message, no call back yet. I will call again tomorrow am and I have a letter almost done that I am planning on dropping of there tomorrow.

I have not yet received an address for my son, so I can't even let him know we are here fighting for him.

Maybe no news is good news. Maybe they just stuck him back in the platoon--yeh, I know, that's asking too much.

Thanks, I will be back when I know more.

Robin

[DGardner]

I have not yet received an address for my son, so I can't even let him know we are here fighting for him.

Unless it's changed since I was there (I doubt it)

Rct. (Last name, First name) Last 4 SSN
Recruit Separations Company
P.O Box 15420
Parris Island SC 29905-5420

and by the way.. while I was there It was normal for us to be in and out in 8 days (for the most part). but we were told to tell 14-21 just incase there were delays.

Hope this helps.:)

-Gardner

[DGardner]

Oh and by the way you should get a phone call the day before he leaves the island and the day of to give you the arrival of his bus to his final stop. Other than that you probably won't get a call unless there is a special occasion or something.

:)


-Gardner

[robpritc]

Hi, Thanks for the address. Also were you in and out of PI for some reason? Just wondering, I am learning so much.

Well, the recruiters faxed the info. from the doctor down to PI last night. They have heard nothing today. They told us they don't know if it will help or not, but it is the only thing we can try. I did also contact our congressman. He said that in order to protest it, we would need our son to write up a statement. I don't want to make a big stink of it though. I will mention it to our son if he calls again, but I won't push it. He's not the type of person to make many waves either. Plus, if this is all going to work out in the end, I figure, why make too much of it now, right?

Oh, and our son got to call last night. He sounded good, didn't sound as defeated as he did the other night. I can tell his gumption is back!!! He also said Mom, I can re-enlist!!!!! Yeah!!!! That helped me feel better right there. Knowing his dream is not gone. I told him we had the doctor write up a statement and it got faxed down there, but he did not know if it would help. (I didn't expect him to know, but wanted to keep him up on all that was being done.)

Thank you all again, you have all been so helpful!!!!!

Robin

[Big Jim]

Hi, Thanks for the address. Also were you in and out of PI for some reason? Just wondering, I am learning so much.

Well, the recruiters faxed the info. from the doctor down to PI last night. They have heard nothing today. They told us they don't know if it will help or not, but it is the only thing we can try. I did also contact our congressman. He said that in order to protest it, we would need our son to write up a statement. I don't want to make a big stink of it though. I will mention it to our son if he calls again, but I won't push it. He's not the type of person to make many waves either. Plus, if this is all going to work out in the end, I figure, why make too much of it now, right?

Oh, and our son got to call last night. He sounded good, didn't sound as defeated as he did the other night. I can tell his gumption is back!!! He also said Mom, I can re-enlist!!!!! Yeah!!!! That helped me feel better right there. Knowing his dream is not gone. I told him we had the doctor write up a statement and it got faxed down there, but he did not know if it would help. (I didn't expect him to know, but wanted to keep him up on all that was being done.)

Thank you all again, you have all been so helpful!!!!!

Robin

THATS REALLY GOOD NEWS, MA'AM...REALLY GOOD NEWS. ONE OF THE THINGS ABOUT THE MARINE CORPS IS THEIR "HURRY UP AND WAIT" FACTOR AND THE "NOT SO BAD AS IT SEEMS" FACTOR. YOU CAN ALMOST COUNT ON THOSE TWO THINGS TO HAPPEN...FREQUENTLY TOO...!! ITS JUST THE WAY THE MARINE CORPS OPERATES...IT MAY BE SLOW BUT THE INFORMATION WILL GET THERE...THE TRICK IS TRY AND NOT YOUR WORRYING RUN AWAY FROM YOU...AND NEVER, EVER JUMP TO CONCLUSIONS, OK? I'M HAPPY THAT EVERYTHING WORKED OUT OK...

[DGardner]

Oh, and our son got to call last night.

Shows how much I know lol.

RSP isn't that bad. Cleaning and working parties and cleaning and TV watching and cleaning... that's it in a nutshell. When he comes home he'll know how to clean just about anything! haha

-Gardner

[Bdchi1]

Robin,

I remember quite vividly the fact that while the DIs and PI overall were rough and tough, the goal was to make MARINES. That requires sacrifices beyond imaginiation, and thats something that cannot be remedied by DEP or talking to recruiters. The MCRDs must take the best interest of the Corps and balance that with the best interest of the individual recruit.

These are extremely trying times on Country, Corps and Marines. In such times, things go bad because bad things are seen, heard and done. The actions affect a Marine, his family and future for all. In the balance, the Corps found something worthy enough in your son to send him to PI. That is a proud accomplishment within itself. Furthermore, no matter the reason for sending your son home, the Corps would rather hurt your son's ego than hurt his future (mental, physical, family, etc...). So keep in mind that neither you nor your son have anything to hang your head over. When the dust settles, I'm sure your son can find and develop that one piece that the Corps is looking for, and if he so desire, he will earn that title: MARINE.

Regardless, your son has my respect for standing up in a time when the Country and Corps needed him to stand. So continue standing and make best of his and your futures.

http://showcase.netins.net/web/creative/lincoln/education/failures.htm

The above link is a very enlightening insight to what overcoming adversity and failure means to one's self and country. It is a proclaimed list of Abe Lincoln's failures. To say the least, he was well experienced in both failure and overcoming the same. Just look what he accomplished nonetheless.


Semper Fi.

To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man.
William Shakespeare

[robpritc]

Thank you Gardner and Bdch1, I respect the both of you, too, very much. I thank all our military whenever I can, Marines, army, navy, air force, c. guard, etc. Not enough recognition goes out to any of you, I don't think.

Gardner, you did make me laugh. Now I will have a good excuse to have him help me out if he comes home!

No new news today so far.

[robpritc]

I haven't posted any news in a week as I really don't have any. Here's an update though. <br />
<br />
The recruiters do not seem to be helping us at all. Every time they say the will call someone, we never...

[kschmidt]

Robin,
Can you update us? I've been following your thread and hope all is going well for you all.....

[egbutler1]

I don't want to sound harsh or anything, but rarely will anyone get sent home from boot camp unless, they threaten to hurt themselves someone else refuse to train or pop on the drug test. The counselor you spoke of well he has no obligation to tell you much of anything since your son is an adult and there is the whole privacy deal. Sounds like he just notified your sons next of kin (you) about the situation that was going on. To bring into light a few things when i went threw boot camp we had a guy who threatened to kill himself and all this stuff he still served all 4 years along side me, i guess his counselor found him to be lying which was true he didn't want to be a Marine (back then) so he tried to copout. Any-who I doubt that your son will fully ever disclose to you the truth but if this was just some horrible mistake he should be able to re-enter the Marines no problem with some type of probation period and a few doctors recommendations. Don't beat yourself up please, this is not your fault ma'am. There is probably more to it than we know. Semper Fidelis!

Cpl. Butler, Emerson 0311 OIF Combat Veteran

[mrmorency]

Still no update?

[Mikewebe]

Ma'am if he is sent home he will need his family. Good luck to you all and hope he gets to try again