I'm need to get this sorted out. re: peace activists

[wrbones]

Their latest line od rationale goes something like this:

"If we go to war they're just going to do more terrorist acts."

I need more input on what is wrong with that logic train.


My thinking, so far, says that that's one of the primary reasons we're doing all of this. If we don't, then there will just be more and more terrorist attacks until we're all muslims and islamic extremists....and even then it won't stop.

It's like saying: "Don't tell the gangstas they can't do that in this neighborhood, they'll just pop a cap on ya." While meanwhile innocent people are caught in the crossfire of their internal disputes.

We learn that **** in school sooner or later. The school yard bully ain't gonna quit until ya whip him or get together and whip him.


I'm still not seeing this at all clearly, but maybe that's the idea of the left wing liberal reasoning.

[firstsgtmike]

If you're looking for more incongruity, a recent survey determined the following:

A great majority of those who are pro-war are also pro-life,

while a great majority who are anti-war are pro-abortion.

Now, dance with THAT one for a while.

[wrbones]

LMAO!!!

Hell, that's easy compared to some of the things that the anti-war bunch are sayin'! LOL.


That ain't what I asked ya, btw! :D :D

[ladileathrnek]

This letter was from Charlie Daniels, nicely done
> >
> > An Open Letter To The Hollywood Bunch
> >
Ok let's just say for a moment you bunch of pampered, overpaid, unrealistic children had your way and the U.S.A. didn't go into Iraq.

Let's say that you really get your way and we destroy all our
nuclear weapons and stick daisies in our gun barrels and sit around with some white wine and cheese and pat ourselves on the back, so proud of what we've done for world peace.

Let's say that we cut the military budget to just enough to keep the National Guard on hand to help out with floods and fires.

Let's say that we close down our military bases all over the world
and bring the troops home, increase our foreign aid and drop all the trade sanctions against everybody.

I suppose that in your fantasy world this would create a utopian
world where everybody would live in peace. After all, the great
monster, the United States of America, the cause of all the world's trouble would have disbanded it's horrible military and certainly all the other countries of the world would follow suit.

After all, they only arm themselves to defend their countries from
the mean old U.S.A.

Why you bunch of pitiful, hypocritical, idiotic, spoiled mugwumps.
get your head out of the sand and smell the Trade Towers burning. Do you think that a trip to Iraq by Sean Penn did anything but encourage a wanton murderer to think that the people of the U.S.A. didn't have the nerve or the guts to fight him?

Barbra Streisand's fanatical and hateful rankings about George Bush makes about as much sense as Michael Jackson hanging a baby over a railing.

You people need to get out of Hollywood once in a while and get out into the real world. You'd be surprised at the hostility you would find out here. Stop in at a truck stop and tell an overworked, long distance truck driver that you don't think Saddam Hussein is doing anything wrong.

Tell a farmer with a couple of sons in the military that you think
the United States has no right to defend itself.

Go down to Baxley, Georgia and hold an anti-war rally and see what the folks down there think about you.

You people are some of the most disgusting examples of a waste of protoplasm I've ever had the displeasure to hear about.

Sean Penn, you're a traitor to the United States of America. You
gave aid and comfort to the enemy. How many American lives will your little, "fact finding trip" to Iraq cost? You encouraged Saddam to think that we didn't have the stomach for war.

You people protect one of the most evil men on the face of this
earth and won't lift a finger to save the life of an unborn baby.

Freedom of choice you say?

Well I'm going to exercise some freedom of choice of my own. If I
see any of your names on a marquee, I'm going to boycott the movie. I will completely stop going to movies if I have to. In most cases it certainly wouldn't be much of a loss.

You scoff at our military who's boots you're not even worthy to
shine. They go to battle and risk their lives so ingrates like you
can live in luxury. The day of reckoning is coming when you will be
faced with the undeniable truth that the war against Saddam Hussein is the war on terrorism.

America is in imminent danger. You're either for her or against her. There is no middle ground.

I think we all know where you stand. What do you think?

God Bless America

Charlie Daniels

[wrbones]

You folks want an eye full. Take a look under the site search engine under Iraq!

[ktriplett]

"I'm still not seeing this at all clearly, but maybe that's the idea of the left wing liberal reasoning."

I'd say you hit the nail right on the head with that one. The libs don't seem to do anything that makes much sense. The 9th circuit didn't have much sense when they passed their little ruling in the "under God" case, or in a number of cases where this ultra liberal court has made foolish decisions. It's a trend with the left-wingers. But you know, they're right when they say that going to war will cause pain, suffering, anger, hatred...but the liberals don't live on a little place I like to call earth. In their reality, none of that stuff is happening now. And if it is, of course, the war mongering United States is the cause of it all. Their main shortcoming is that they are reactive rather than proactive. They would rather sit back in their comfortable little lives driving around in their BMW's and Benz's rather than take a supporting stance in their country. Before taking action, there must be proof of danger. They keep calling for this "smoking gun", but they don't seem to realize that the gun has to go off before it starts smoking. The fact that danger is imminent is not enough for them. There must be another 9/11 for them to act. And even then, they'd probably say something stupid like, "It was an isolated incident" to keep from going to war.

[lurch]

not much help on your topic, but the last time a peace rally was thrown on university grounds myself and motivated NCOs tore down their banners and ****ed on them.

Semper Fidelis

lurch

[JChristin]

Believe it or not, I'm a church going woman. Have been active in my church for many years. Even sit on a board and help make decisions on how to run the place. Right now, if I had my way, I'd run our Priest right out of town.

Just two days before last Sunday mass he asked me what our Marines may be experiecing over there in the desert. I said I really didn't know, as I'm not there with them. However, I did refer him to another Marine in our parrish who served in Vietnam - two terms of service. Then I added that I would expect many of them to be feeling a bit of fear, a bit anxious, questioning, wondering, thinking about family and friends, and prehaps getting a bit more religious and showing up at Mass or other services to accept communion and strengthen themselves spiritually for what may lay ahead. Then we talked about the situation and the major players and stakeholders.

Being a priest, I didn't fully expect him to be all decked out in glory about the prospect of sending men and women into war. We talked about the long history of the region starting with the construction of the great Hanging Gardens to the present. I spoke about the need to bring stability to that region in the world. Another woman joined our discussions. I could tell the "peace" activitivts were gathering around. But I have never had trouble holding my own.

This woman was so "flip'flop" in her argument I couldn't imagine someone actually "buying" whatever she had to offer. But oh boy, she sent our Priest off into a tangent of being anti-war. At that point I could feel the blood raising to the tip of my head. I felt as if my own mini war-head was about to go off.

Remembering I was in a church, I held my war-head missisle together long enough to think about how best to approach the situation. Make them wear a little "spiritual" egg on face. So I asked her, "If you had a sister living over in Iraq, under a repressive regime, living under the terror of being sent to prison without cause, living under conditions that caused her to not be able to feed herself properly or her children, if she lack the availability of proper medical care for necessary life saving measures, if she were raped - what type of rights would she have? What type of rights are guarded for women under this repressive regime? If you had a sister living under the regime of a evil dictator, would you not want your sister to be freed? To enjoy the same rights and same standard of living as yourself?

This woman looked at me with stark and empty eyes. She knew what the right answer was, so did our Priest. But to be in agreement would take all the "fluff" out of their new cause against the president. Then I added a bit more fuel to my missle:

Who are we as a people, if we do not act and to do that which is right - even if it may not be the most popular thing to do at this moment of time. Who are we as a people if we don't reach out our hands to our brothers and sisters in a distant land so that they can be freed from the grips of an evil dictator? If we profess to being Christians during Mass, then we must be willing to do that which is right, to serve our brothers and sisters. Afterall, hasn't the Almighty granted us with the ability and power and soundness of mind to use that power to His benefit? Who are we as a people, if we do not act?

They both asked, what about the oil? Well, what about it I asked? There are many reasons for being there. But the other reason for being over there is to assist our allies in that region to live free from the threat posed by the "great" Saddam and his growing destructive supply of NBC agents and missles. It is a question of averting a greater war later by taking the actions necessary today. Afterall, I said, my old senior drill instructor would always say over and over again, "**** Poor Planning Results in **** Poor Performance."

Then last Sunday's Mass, my preist preached about the evils of war and the "evils" of the US President! He made Saddam sound like an angel, without naming him directly! I sat in my pew brewing with anger at this liberal puppet of a man. Then when it was time for anyone to offer up a prayer I added one, "For all those who are anti-american -from those in other countries and even here in our own parrish no matter how High Hat they may be, we pray to the lord!" Then I offered up another prayer, "We pray for the liberation of all people enslaved by evil dictators so that all may enjoy the freedoms we have here at home, to this we pray to the Lord."

The Priest avoided me after Mass, so did that woman.

semper fi.
jchristin

[ktriplett]

It's in the schools, it's in the churches....when is it too much, having people in power imposing their beliefs upon people who may think differently? The woman in the church is excusable, but the priest should have known better. As a voice of the church, his responsibility is to convey the message of God, not spew out his own anti-war propaganda. We do not know for sure where God stands for this war, so priests should be required to remain objective or keep their mouths shut.

[eddief]

All Christians have to look at what they believe in when it comes to their understanding of their faith. I am a Christian who is against this war because I believe it will do more harm than good. I don't believe the Iraqi's will see us as liberators. We're going to be dropping bombs on them and not Bibles. I don't protest,because I don't want to have any part of the anti-American factions that always attach themselves to these things.
I support the troops. That is why I pray for peace, and if the war starts I'll keep my views about the war to myself because of my respect for the troops. I'll let President Bush know how I feel in 2004.

[ktriplett]

As an individual, it is your own right to form your own opinions. Like I said above, the lady in the church has a right to her way of thinking. However, men and women in authorative positions (such as teachers, members of the clergy,etc...) represent more than just themselves, so they have a responsibility to not abuse their position by using it as a soapbox for voicing their own opinions. In the case of the priest, he was being irresponsible, both as a public figure and as a man of God, by isolating the Bush supporters in his own church, many of whom are perhaps close friends, or even family and seemingly passing judgment on any with similar ideas.

[JChristin]

For nearly twenty years I have belonged to a society of people who have twelve governing rules that hold their group together. One of those rules is that they do not have opinions on outside issues, hence their primarily purpose is never drawn into conflict of any kind.

When I go to Mass or visit other kinds of churches, Christian or otherwise, I go expressly to hear about some kind of Higher Being, the Creator of the Universe, God, Alla, whatever name you care to attach to this power. I attend to strengthen my character and relationship with that Power, and to deepen my ability to grow spiritually. I do not go there to discuss politics, gambling, sexual dysfunctions, crazy glue, or how the sheep got let out of the pen by the rooster. ktriplett is right on the money. I felt as if my priest was isolating the Bush supports from the one's who are not supportive of the Commander-In-Chiefs efforts.

Don't get me wrong, I am not supportive of the President in most all other matters. However, I am supportive of the CIC in the Iraq matter, 110 %. I've read my history, studied that region. My professor in Middle East History use to be the Minister of Anquities unders the Shan of Iran. I believe in my countries efforts to bring stability to this region.

But I go to church to hear about the Supreme Being that is watching all His kids play - some nice, others not so nice. I think I fall somewhere right in the middle.

semper fi
jchristin

[eddief]

I agree with you JChristin that politics has no business being preached from the pulpit.

[CAS3]

JChristin
A question..
I believe those twelve "guidelines" have something to do with anonymity.
I know I would not want to tell a group of strangers about what 12 step grooup I belong to. That just opens up the window for a lot of hurt. Especially a "newcomer' either to the rooms or here. Not everyone shares the same compassion nor has the same motives.

[wrbones]

It's about clear thinking, to me. I do admit I have trouble with that myself sometimes, but when that happens I try to check with other folks to see if I'm seeing what I think I'm seeing! LOL.

You folks have pretty much said what I was thinkin' I was seein' is about right!

They've been perpetuatin' terrorists acts fer some time now. Not stoppin' 'em ain't gonna stop 'em.

I guess that's my short answer to their latest rationale.

I'll start workin' on the long answer later today or tomorrow. I'll let ya know what I come up with.