thedrifter
05-18-07, 06:36 AM
Marine Corps allows some on-base underage drinking
By: WILLIAM FINN BENNETT - Staff Writer
NORTH COUNTY -- The Marine Corps has changed its rules on drinking to allow Marines as young as 18 to drink on Camp Pendleton and other Marine bases on special occasions, a decision that has been cheered by some Marines but has upset anti-drinking groups.
Last month, the commandant of the Marine Corps issued changes to the service's drinking regulations that allow Marines who are at least 18 years old to drink on base on occasions designated by commanders, including the popular Marine Corps birthday celebrations held in November and at welcome-home parties after combat deployments.
The minimum drinking age in California is 21.
The measure has taken effect at Camp Pendleton. And while there have been no events held under the new rule yet, Marines interviewed Thursday said they were looking forward to being able to consume alcohol legally on special occasions.
It was unclear Thursday whether allowing underage Marines to drink on base at Camp Pendleton or other California Marine Corps installations would violate Department of Defense regulations or violate state law.
Officials with the California attorney general's office did not return phone calls Thursday asking whether underage Marines drinking on base would violate state law. Camp Pendleton officials did not respond to phone calls or information requests sent by e-mail.
In addition to allowing some underage drinking on U.S. bases, the new rules also allow off-duty Marines who are 18 and older to drink on port calls in countries where the legal drinking age is lower than 21. Though other services have allowed off-duty troops to drink alcohol in countries where the legal drinking age is lower, the Marine Corps has historically allowed drinking only for troops who are 21.
Marines running errands in downtown Oceanside said Thursday that the new rules make sense in a culture that allows them to fight for their country abroad but not to toast their deployments when they return.
Lance Cpl. Shane Routy stopped into Dorothy's Military Shop and Laundry on Thursday to pick up a uniform. The 20-year-old Marine, who is leaving for his first deployment to Iraq in January, said he agreed with the cliche that, "if you can die for your country, you should be able to drink."
Besides, Routy said, underage drinking, although not condoned by the Marine Corps, is common among underage Marines.
"We don't hide it --- we just don't get caught," said Routy, who is from Riverside. "I think we drink pretty responsibly."
Cpl. Stephen Myers, 23, agreed that he didn't expect the rule change to have much of an effect.
"It doesn't change (things) that much," said the Payson, Ariz., resident, who is returning to Iraq on his second deployment in January.
He said that some of his fellow Marines had been discussing the rule change and the consensus of opinion was that it was not a bad idea.
"Drinking gives us a sense of relaxation when we get back from deployment," Myers said.
Commandant spokesman Johnson said the Marine policy does not condone such "unsupervised" underage drinking.
"Besides, it's illegal," Johnson said.
Dorothy's co-owner Jo Marie Cerda, 45, said that she has mixed emotions about the rule change.
"If you're old enough to serve in war, you're old enough to have a beer," she said. "Besides, they're teenagers, so they're going to drink anyway."
But she wonders how the Marine Corps is going to be able to guarantee that young Marines who have been drinking will stay on the base.
Cerda said she believes the Marine Corps is "setting itself up."
"What happens if they kill themselves or somebody else -- is the Marine Corps liable because they allowed it?" Cerda asked.
The decision to allow underage drinking has upset some groups, such as Mothers Against Drunk Driving, who say the Marine Corps is making a big mistake -- one that could come back to haunt the service.
"We would hate to see a mother or father lose their child here on American soil in an alcohol-related crash or injure somebody else while impaired," the executive director, Pat Hodgkin, said Thursday.
The rule change was released April 19 and signed by Marine Corps Commandant Gen. James Conway, a spokesman for the commandant said Thursday.
Details of the rules, however, make it clear that young Marines can't just starting popping beer-can tabs at will. Underage drinking will be allowed only on base, and with base commander's approval, immediately after combat deployment or in certain "special circumstances," such as the Marine Corps Ball, according to the ruling.
And, "commanders must ensure that appropriate controls are in place to prevent any mishaps to service members and the community," it states in an April 26 Marine Corps news release.
Commandant spokesman Lt. Col. T.V. Johnson said Thursday that even base commanding officers don't have complete autonomy in deciding on which occasions underage drinking will be allowed.
"Commanders, for example, can't say, 'For Earth Day, we are all going to drink,'" Johnson said. "The commandant will prescribe when it is allowed."
A 1995 Department of Defense directive required the minimum drinking age on any Department of Defense installation "shall be consistent with the age established by the law of that state as the state minimum drinking age."
Until 1996, there was also a rule from the Department of the Navy, which covers the Marine Corps, that allowed a lower drinking age on military bases within 50 miles of another country. The policy had been created as a way of preventing younger service members from going to Mexico to drink legally and then driving home while intoxicated.
Up through the mid-1990s, on-base enlisted clubs at Camp Pendleton allowed Marines who were 18 or older to drink beer, and those clubs were packed on the weekends until the 50-mile rule was eliminated by the secretary of the Navy.
Oceanside Police Department spokesman Leonard Mata released a statement from Capt. Tom Jones late Thursday on the Marine Corps policy change.
"The Marine Corps base is an excellent neighbor and we don't foresee any issues with this, but if it did become an issue ... I am sure (it) would be addressed," Jones said through the spokesman.
-- Contact staff writer William Finn Bennett at (760) 740-5426 or wbennett@nctimes.com.
Ellie
By: WILLIAM FINN BENNETT - Staff Writer
NORTH COUNTY -- The Marine Corps has changed its rules on drinking to allow Marines as young as 18 to drink on Camp Pendleton and other Marine bases on special occasions, a decision that has been cheered by some Marines but has upset anti-drinking groups.
Last month, the commandant of the Marine Corps issued changes to the service's drinking regulations that allow Marines who are at least 18 years old to drink on base on occasions designated by commanders, including the popular Marine Corps birthday celebrations held in November and at welcome-home parties after combat deployments.
The minimum drinking age in California is 21.
The measure has taken effect at Camp Pendleton. And while there have been no events held under the new rule yet, Marines interviewed Thursday said they were looking forward to being able to consume alcohol legally on special occasions.
It was unclear Thursday whether allowing underage Marines to drink on base at Camp Pendleton or other California Marine Corps installations would violate Department of Defense regulations or violate state law.
Officials with the California attorney general's office did not return phone calls Thursday asking whether underage Marines drinking on base would violate state law. Camp Pendleton officials did not respond to phone calls or information requests sent by e-mail.
In addition to allowing some underage drinking on U.S. bases, the new rules also allow off-duty Marines who are 18 and older to drink on port calls in countries where the legal drinking age is lower than 21. Though other services have allowed off-duty troops to drink alcohol in countries where the legal drinking age is lower, the Marine Corps has historically allowed drinking only for troops who are 21.
Marines running errands in downtown Oceanside said Thursday that the new rules make sense in a culture that allows them to fight for their country abroad but not to toast their deployments when they return.
Lance Cpl. Shane Routy stopped into Dorothy's Military Shop and Laundry on Thursday to pick up a uniform. The 20-year-old Marine, who is leaving for his first deployment to Iraq in January, said he agreed with the cliche that, "if you can die for your country, you should be able to drink."
Besides, Routy said, underage drinking, although not condoned by the Marine Corps, is common among underage Marines.
"We don't hide it --- we just don't get caught," said Routy, who is from Riverside. "I think we drink pretty responsibly."
Cpl. Stephen Myers, 23, agreed that he didn't expect the rule change to have much of an effect.
"It doesn't change (things) that much," said the Payson, Ariz., resident, who is returning to Iraq on his second deployment in January.
He said that some of his fellow Marines had been discussing the rule change and the consensus of opinion was that it was not a bad idea.
"Drinking gives us a sense of relaxation when we get back from deployment," Myers said.
Commandant spokesman Johnson said the Marine policy does not condone such "unsupervised" underage drinking.
"Besides, it's illegal," Johnson said.
Dorothy's co-owner Jo Marie Cerda, 45, said that she has mixed emotions about the rule change.
"If you're old enough to serve in war, you're old enough to have a beer," she said. "Besides, they're teenagers, so they're going to drink anyway."
But she wonders how the Marine Corps is going to be able to guarantee that young Marines who have been drinking will stay on the base.
Cerda said she believes the Marine Corps is "setting itself up."
"What happens if they kill themselves or somebody else -- is the Marine Corps liable because they allowed it?" Cerda asked.
The decision to allow underage drinking has upset some groups, such as Mothers Against Drunk Driving, who say the Marine Corps is making a big mistake -- one that could come back to haunt the service.
"We would hate to see a mother or father lose their child here on American soil in an alcohol-related crash or injure somebody else while impaired," the executive director, Pat Hodgkin, said Thursday.
The rule change was released April 19 and signed by Marine Corps Commandant Gen. James Conway, a spokesman for the commandant said Thursday.
Details of the rules, however, make it clear that young Marines can't just starting popping beer-can tabs at will. Underage drinking will be allowed only on base, and with base commander's approval, immediately after combat deployment or in certain "special circumstances," such as the Marine Corps Ball, according to the ruling.
And, "commanders must ensure that appropriate controls are in place to prevent any mishaps to service members and the community," it states in an April 26 Marine Corps news release.
Commandant spokesman Lt. Col. T.V. Johnson said Thursday that even base commanding officers don't have complete autonomy in deciding on which occasions underage drinking will be allowed.
"Commanders, for example, can't say, 'For Earth Day, we are all going to drink,'" Johnson said. "The commandant will prescribe when it is allowed."
A 1995 Department of Defense directive required the minimum drinking age on any Department of Defense installation "shall be consistent with the age established by the law of that state as the state minimum drinking age."
Until 1996, there was also a rule from the Department of the Navy, which covers the Marine Corps, that allowed a lower drinking age on military bases within 50 miles of another country. The policy had been created as a way of preventing younger service members from going to Mexico to drink legally and then driving home while intoxicated.
Up through the mid-1990s, on-base enlisted clubs at Camp Pendleton allowed Marines who were 18 or older to drink beer, and those clubs were packed on the weekends until the 50-mile rule was eliminated by the secretary of the Navy.
Oceanside Police Department spokesman Leonard Mata released a statement from Capt. Tom Jones late Thursday on the Marine Corps policy change.
"The Marine Corps base is an excellent neighbor and we don't foresee any issues with this, but if it did become an issue ... I am sure (it) would be addressed," Jones said through the spokesman.
-- Contact staff writer William Finn Bennett at (760) 740-5426 or wbennett@nctimes.com.
Ellie