Recruitment for Non-Americans

[Celtic Tiger]

Hello there lads and ladies,
First of all i want to apologise as i am sure this question has been raised before and please do delete the thread if i have somehow not noticed a designated purpose made thread that already answers my questions.

Basicly I am an Irish citizen of 21 years. I am a member of the Irish Army Reserves now for 4 years and in that time i have grown to love the military and its way of life.

I am looking into the possability of joining the armed forces as a career and the Irish Army to me would obviously be my first calling.
Although i have some first hand experience of the advantages and disadvantages of the Irish Army with my experience in the reserves, thus with such a big decision for a young man of my age i want to make the decision that gives me as many oppertunities and advantages as possible.

As a young boy brought up on hollywood and tom clancy novels I cant help having a nieve and innocent admiration and to some extent obsession with the American Armed Forces and the Marine Corps in particular.

And my rational side also realises the many many advantages in terms of training, equipment/logistics, experience and overall career oppertunities the American Armed Forces would be able to give me potentially.

Overall, i'm not getting any younger and i need to make a firm decision fast about where my life will go. I spent two years in college Studying International Relations and some Security Studies, i dropped out and now finally i am looking to the Armed Forces as a future and as a career.


# As a non-resident and non-citizen of the United States, how difficult would it be for me to enlist in the American Armed Forces?

# I understand you need a minimum of Legal Residency for Enlistment in general yet i hear of latin americans frequently joining up as a *way* to earn Legal Residency (example), can anyone confirm/deny such information?

# From your own experience and knowledge, how much potential for advancement and oppertunity does the American Armed Forces in general give, and would such oppertunities change depending on the Army or Marines? (as i frequently hear that the marines are more dependant on the other branches, and also logic tells me since the Army is a bigger branch, there would be more slots to fill up the ladder)

# Would my experience in the Irish Armed Forces as well as the university courses that i have studied, including a minor in arabic, make any such possability of enlistment as a non-citizen any easier?



I am a ambitious young man with a passion for security affairs, politics and the military in general, if i was to join my ideal area would be intelligence, analysing security threats and political economic environments of interest to the Armed Forces in which i would serve. I have gotten enough lectures from buck private comrades of mine in the irish army that i have been convinced that my goal would also be commissioned as an officer, though i have little idea if i would be capable of such responsability, that is not for me to judge.
Hopefully the above will give you a better idea of who i am and where i am comming from and so with much respect, i do hope you will take the time and patience out of your lives to help out someone who you once were before many years ago.

Thank you.

[Camper51]

sniff, sniff...

sure hope I don't smell him again...

Would hate to have him stinkin up this place all over again...

Nah this one filled out some of his profile...

[Echo_Four_Bravo]

You have to gain legal entry to the US with a visa that allows you to work here. At that point, contact a recruiter and they can set you up.

You will be able to become a citizen more easily if you serve, but it won't help you get here in the first place.

I know a couple of NCOs that are citizens of Canada, so being from another country doesn't hamper your career progress.

Of course, remember we are here to defend America. IF you can't pledge to defend America against all enemies (even if your homeland becomes an enemy) then go somewhere else. The French have a wonderful program for non-nationals that has been romanticized over the years.

[jinelson]

I already did a through IP check and its not him brother. This young man is articulate and respectfull.

Jim

[Celtic Tiger]

The Legion is filled with Irish Men already ;) And honestly the Legion isn't my idea of a military career.

And yes Echo_Four_Bravo i fully understand the importance of a oath of alliegance and also somehow i really do not see American invading Ireland any time soon. Besides the last people who did that ended up with 800 years of permanent guerilla warfare, so i doubt you lads and ladies would really want to anyway ;)

But overall, thank you for your constructive reply Echo_Four_Bravo.

Although you are the first person to tell me that enlistment may be possible with a work visa as opposed to a full on legal residency visa. Thats damn interesting.

[Celtic Tiger]

And thank you for the kind words also jinelson, i wasn't sure what to expect of replys after Camper51's reply.

[devildoghopeful]

If you do join the US Military, at some point (if you gain American Citizenship), I think you'll have to give up Irish Citizenship - it's something to do with pledging to defend America alone. I'm still not certain on this, but I'm pretty sure it's the case as I did some research on it myself (I'm a dual citizen, USA/UK).

Good luck

[jinelson]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v660/jinelson/156100.jpg

Welcome Aboard Fionán


First of all i want to apologise as i am sure this question has been raised before and please do delete the thread if i have somehow not noticed a designated purpose made thread that already answers my questions.

There have been many questions on this subject and we currently have members in Russia, Sweden, England and Germany that I know are in the process of immigrating for military service. Try doing a search of our Poolee Hall and Ask A Marine forums to see their threads and posts. Below are some helpful links and one will explane how to aquire the work permit that Echo Four Bravo spoke of. The other is a article from one of our newspapers. Good luck in your research.

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/18/AR2006101801500.html

Jim

[Celtic Tiger]

If you do join the US Military, at some point (if you gain American Citizenship), I think you'll have to give up Irish Citizenship - it's something to do with pledging to defend America alone. I'm still not certain on this, but I'm pretty sure it's the case as I did some research on it myself (I'm a dual citizen, USA/UK).

Good luck


Thats an interesting, yet disturbing prospect i have to say. I can perfectly understand the logic of it, how can you serve in a force thats existance is to protect its nation when all of your life you have lived and breathed in another.

I love Ireland with every inch in my soul, we have suffered much as a nation, we have fought too long as a nation and now that we are officially a nation, the prospect of loosing that official identity is something i wouldn't look forward to given the possability.
I am not a typical nationalistic young man, i do not fear and despise others, but still i am attached to Ireland.

I guess overall its a question of my motives, as ideally the American Armed Forces would look for loyal recruits ready to step up for America, yet my main rational motives for joining are purely selfish in the nature of a career and personal oppertunity.

Then again something really does attract me to the notion of brotherhood in an armed force, your loyaltys lie with the man in the trench right next to you and thats all you see.

That might not make any sense but its getting me thinking so thank you again for that reply devildog.

[Celtic Tiger]

Thank you very much jinelson for your patience, I will copy your url's and take your advice in relation to thread searching.

Please do what you wish to this thread if necessary.

[Camper51]

My apologies, Celtic Tiger.

Thank you, Jim, since I have no way of checking the IP's.

Welcome aboard, Celtic Tiger.

Your advancement potential is no better, no worse than anyone else. It is all up to you. If you do your job, excel in many areas, and perform above average then promotions will come. On the other hand if you are slovenly, lazy, dodge your assignments, etc., then you can expect to remain a private or PFC most of the time. Promotions are not based on your nationality but on what you do and how well you do it. The Army may offer better advancement in some areas but then you won't be a Marine, will you! I would assume that if you enter the country legally with the intent of living here that you would have no problem entering the Marines. A Marine recruiter, however, would be the expert to talk to since he/she would have the regulations handy (I would hope) and could answer any questions you have.

I really don't know how much good information you canl get without being in the US,where you can go sit down with the people that matter (recruiter, etc...).

Good luck in your pursuits...

[Camper51]

Thats an interesting, yet disturbing prospect i have to say. I can perfectly understand the logic of it, how can you serve in a force thats existance is to protect its nation when all of your life you have lived and breathed in another.

I love Ireland with every inch in my soul, we have suffered much as a nation, we have fought too long as a nation and now that we are officially a nation, the prospect of loosing that official identity is something i wouldn't look forward to given the possability.
I am not a typical nationalistic young man, i do not fear and despise others, but still i am attached to Ireland.

I guess overall its a question of my motives, as ideally the American Armed Forces would look for loyal recruits ready to step up for America, yet my main rational motives for joining are purely selfish in the nature of a career and personal oppertunity.

Then again something really does attract me to the notion of brotherhood in an armed force, your loyaltys lie with the man in the trench right next to you and thats all you see.

That might not make any sense but its getting me thinking so thank you again for that reply devildog.

Dual citizenship is common and you will NOT have to renounce your Irish citizenship to become an American citizen. In fact you do not have to become a citizen to serve, unless you wish to be an officer. As an officer in the armed forces of the United States you MUST be an American citizen...

[Echo_Four_Bravo]

Celtic, I don't see us invading Ireland either. Of course, 20 years ago I would have never dreamed we would invade Afghanistan. They were our allies against the Soviets. 25 years ago Iraq was our ally against Iran. 60 years ago Germany and Japan were our enemies. They are now some of our closest friends. You never can tell what'll happen. The world is a silly place.

[Camper51]

Taken from Wikipedia:

Dual citizenship

Based on the U.S. Department of State regulation on dual citizenship (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_citizenship) (7 FAM 1162), the Supreme Court of the United States has stated that dual citizenship is a “status long recognized in the law” and that “a person may have and exercise rights of nationality in two countries and be subject to the responsibilities of both. The mere fact he asserts the rights of one citizenship does not without more mean that he renounces the other,” (Kawakita v. U.S. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawakita_v._U.S.), 343 U.S. 717) (1952).
The Immigration and Nationality Act (INA) does not define dual citizenship or take a position for it or against it. There has been no prohibition against dual citizenship, but some provisions of the INA and earlier U.S. nationality laws were designed to reduce situations in which dual citizenship exists. Although naturalizing citizens are required to undertake an oath renouncing previous allegiances, the oath has never been enforced to require the actual termination of original citizenship.

[DWG]

[quote=Echo_Four_Bravo].
.

I know a couple of NCOs that are citizens of Canada, so being from another country doesn't hamper your career progress.

Of course, remember we are here to defend America. IF you can't pledge to defend America against all enemies (even if your homeland becomes an enemy) then go somewhere else. quote]


If we go to war against Ireland, I'm not sure where I would stand-at least until I knew who was in control of the supply of Bushmills'!:) I really don't see a major deployment against the Irish in our near future. The Canandians, on the other hand, are a different story-are they still a real country?:p

[Camper51]

[quote=Echo_Four_Bravo].
.

I know a couple of NCOs that are citizens of Canada, so being from another country doesn't hamper your career progress.

Of course, remember we are here to defend America. IF you can't pledge to defend America against all enemies (even if your homeland becomes an enemy) then go somewhere else. quote]


If we go to war against Ireland, I'm not sure where I would stand-at least until I knew who was in control of the supply of Bushmills'!:) I really don't see a major deployment against the Irish in our near future. The Canandians, on the other hand, are a different story-are they still a real country?:p

You just have to know that Yellowwing is gonna get you for that...

[BR34]

[quote=Echo_Four_Bravo].
.

I know a couple of NCOs that are citizens of Canada, so being from another country doesn't hamper your career progress.

Of course, remember we are here to defend America. IF you can't pledge to defend America against all enemies (even if your homeland becomes an enemy) then go somewhere else. quote]


If we go to war against Ireland, I'm not sure where I would stand-at least until I knew who was in control of the supply of Bushmills'!:) I really don't see a major deployment against the Irish in our near future. The Canandians, on the other hand, are a different story-are they still a real country?:p

I hear they have a submarine now.

[jinelson]

Ive always been confused about Canada myself, is it a French or a British colony?

Winky Winky

Jim

[DWG]

[quote=D W George]

I hear they have a submarine now.

But it's still equipped with the original screen doors that came on it from the factory. (In Ireland):banana:

[DWG]

[quote=D W George]

You just have to know that Yellowwing is gonna get you for that...
YW retired NORTH! How smart can he be?:banana: :p :banana:

[Celtic Tiger]

Canada is officially a membership of the Commonwealth of the United Kingdom.
Members of the commonwealth are officially recognised independant nations, its just they have special status with each other when it comes to trade mostly.

I don't know an awfull lot about it personally, just the overall idea of the commonwealth. It has changed alot over the decades for instance. During the second world war members of the commonwealth were obliged to defend Britain and send them troops. But at the same time they could have refused. And now a days i think such political obligations do not exist.

Im not sure, just assuming.

[DWG]

See, even the Irish aren't sure of what Canada is! Only good movie michael moore made was Canadian Bacon. BTW, do the Brits recognize quebec all the time? or just on alternate(english speaking) weekends, like joint custody?:D

[devildoghopeful]

LOL! Tough question actually, although Quebec is part of Canada and so part of the Commonwealth, something at the back of my mind is telling me that it's different because it's part of the 'Francophonie' (the French equivalent of the British Commonwealth). So the answer is "I'm not sure and I'm embarrased because I should know this". I'll check it on the internet. :)

[Celtic Tiger]

No idea, im sure its just some social identity perking up because of the previous french influence that survives today.. Something innocent like that i'd say.

[DWG]

Just pulling your chain kids; of course Quebec is part of Canada, they just don't like to admit it!LOL ;) I just noticed something-as Lee Marvin remarked in "Donovan's Reef" "Where'd all these @#$#@ limeys come from?":p :D

[devildoghopeful]

Hehe, well actually I think Celtic Tiger would strongly oppose being called a Limey (I'm assuming he's from the Republic of Ireland as opposed the the British owned Northern Ireland). But I'm proud to be referred to as a limey! Well I've been here for a while but I tend to keep my trap shut until I feel that have something relatively useful to say.

I can never win - In England I'm referred to as the Yank (Dual Citizenship), and in the US I'm always known as the Limey or 'the Brit'.

LOL

BTW - Most people in England criticize me when they heard me say this, but I've always felt that my allegiances lie with the United States (dont ask why because I don't know).

God Bless the USA.

[DWG]

In the movie (way before your time) Marvins' character was referring to Australians when he made the comment-they didn't take it well! LOL I only watch that movie for Marvins' part-Gilhooley! Good luck to both of you!

[devildoghopeful]

:) Thank you sir!

Come to the UK, I'll buy you a beer (legal drinking age=18. Me=almost 18)

:beer:

[Celtic Tiger]

Hehe, well actually I think Celtic Tiger would strongly oppose being called a Limey (I'm assuming he's from the Republic of Ireland as opposed the the British owned Northern Ireland).

Your assumption is very very very very very very very and *gasps* very correct in that devildog.


(And also just to be stubborn, most Northerners would also take offence, i personally only live 20mins from the border)

[DWG]

Thank you sir!

Come to the UK, I'll buy you a beer (legal drinking age=18. Me=almost 18)


Me=18x many! I've been to the UK, drank the beer; you serve it at room temp; WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE? You Commonwealthians(now doesn't that sound stupid?) ; you limeys and micks get your EGA and I'll stand you to a COLD beer!:beer:

Used to have a neighbor who was Irish; he even had family serving time for gun running to the Republic, his name was Mick (how ironic is that?) :D

[Celtic Tiger]

Mick is a pretty common enough name here in Ireland.

And about room temperature beer.... can't say i've experienced it much, apart from the odd venture to the off licence buying all the cheap beer (which is never kept in fridges for some reason) Beggers can't be choosers ;)

[kerill07]

Hey devildoghopeful ill take that offer for a free beer.... Nothing Better.

[devildoghopeful]

Hehe, sure - when you're next in the UK, look me up...you may be on Embassy Duty as a MARINE! :)

[maysoon]

You have to gain legal entry to the US with a visa that allows you to work here. At that point, contact a recruiter and they can set you up.

You will be able to become a citizen more easily if you serve, but it won't help you get here in the first place.

I know a couple of NCOs that are citizens of Canada, so being from another country doesn't hamper your career progress.

Of course, remember we are here to defend America. IF you can't pledge to defend America against all enemies (even if your homeland becomes an enemy) then go somewhere else. The French have a wonderful program for non-nationals that has been romanticized over the years.

But I thought that Canadians were commonwealth, so they can serve the British Armed Forces, but we cannot. He he he the Eskimos up north don't have Marines. I bet if we wanted Canada to become part of the USA, they would not be a single shot fired. Canadians would not dare, and they would be given the option of becoming British citizens or American citizen. Of course, if I were forced to make that choice as an Eskimo, I would choose to be with the best nation in the entire world, but I could see some would want to go British due to the EU offer. Otherwise, without the EU, I am pretty sure 99% of them would love to be with us! Why isn't Canada taken by us yet? It would go over quite peacefully, and all it would take is a bit of paperwork. Uniting their provinces, they would just sheepishly accept. We would then be also geographically the largest country in the world!!

[maysoon]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v660/jinelson/156100.jpg

Welcome Aboard Fionán





There have been many questions on this subject and we currently have members in Russia, Sweden, England and Germany that I know are in the process of immigrating for military service. Try doing a search of our Poolee Hall and Ask A Marine forums to see their threads and posts. Below are some helpful links and one will explane how to aquire the work permit that Echo Four Bravo spoke of. The other is a article from one of our newspapers. Good luck in your research.

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/18/AR2006101801500.html

Jim

Hey, you know, I think anyone who is willing to fight for our country proved their loyalty to be worthy of being an American! If they should wear the Eagle, Globe, and the Anchor, and join the brotherhood of the US Marines, they not be aliens, but after their tour of duty, they ought to be our brothers and sisters in America as fellow citizens.

How many of you Marines agree? Those who became your brothers in Arms and seen combat in a tour of duty should be made American. Should they die, they should be at that point be pronounced American. Especially those coming from developed nations should be given this automatically. I think this is important for the morale of the troops also. Wouldn't you want your CO's that you must salute to in absolute deferrence be at least an American upon the completion of the contract? The French Foreign Legion gurantees their legionaire to be eligible for French citizenship, upon completion of their contract if they should then apply.

Even the Japanese who make it the toughest in giving out their citizenship to non Japanese, gave the Koreans and the Chinese who joined their army during WWII Japanese citizenship.

So I don't see why those who put their lives up in service not be eligible. I think it ought to be almost unconditional.

[DWG]

Mick is a pretty common enough name here in Ireland.

And about room temperature beer.... can't say i've experienced it much, apart from the odd venture to the off licence buying all the cheap beer (which is never kept in fridges for some reason) Beggers can't be choosers

Thank goodness you Islanders finally stumbled onto refridgeration.:D It's been 30 yrs. since I've been there; what next, the french with indoor plumbing?:p :banana:

[devildoghopeful]

Hehe, of course you know that Celtic Tiger wont take that lying down....as far as I can see he's a proud Irishman, it looks like this means war...;)

[DWG]

Hehe, of course you know that Celtic Tiger wont take that lying down....as far as I can see he's a proud Irishman, it looks like this means war...

As long as he is in no position to shut down the Bushmills pipeline, I don't care. :p If he can stop the flow of Irish whiskey, I will grovel and apoligize shamelessly!:cry:

[Celtic Tiger]

Well i cant talk for bushmills but i have a friend of a friend who works for the Guinness management team in Dublin ;)

[DWG]

Well i cant talk for bushmills but i have a friend of a friend who works for the Guinness management team in Dublin

I have already drank all the Guinness I want ( around half a glass in New Orleans). :sick: I avoid drinking syrup now, it's probably bad for the cholesterol, anyway. Therefore, I have no fear of you as you have no power over me. Plus, I know Bushmills' dirty little secret!:scared: ;)

[Osotogary]

Of coarse you all know the story of Liam, the gentleman that fell into a vat of Guiness at the brewery and drowned ..don't you? When asked by his loving wife Colleen wether Liam had a quick death or not, the answer was a resounding no, Liam had died slowly. When Colleen asked the foreman how Liam could have drowned slowly the foreman replied, " Liam drowned slowly because he got out of vat three time to go pee."

[Celtic Tiger]

You know what scares me, i can actually see that happening ;)



On a side note i got some feedback from the official marine corps recruitment website as follows:

"We're sorry, but if you are a U.S. citizen living outside of the U.S. or the 11 U.S. Territories, we are unable to process your request for more information via this web site. Instead, we encourage you to contact a U.S. Military facility or a U.S. Recruiting facility for more information about enlisting in the Marine Corps.

You may contact recruiting officials in the U.S. at the following numbers:
From the Pacific area: 808-596-0225 (Honolulu office)
From Europe or North Africa: 516-228-3680 (New York office)

Only U.S. citizens or Lawful Permanent Resident Aliens (LPR) with proper credentials from the United States Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS) are eligible by law to enlist in the U.S. Armed Forces. Citizen requirements cannot be waived. Upon establishing permanent legal residence in the U.S., you should address specific questions regarding your enlistment to your local Marine Corps recruiter. "




Which basicly isn't very helpfull to me since its practicly impossible for me to gain a Legal Residency visa since i do not meet any of the requirements, i can only really put my hope into the Annual Visa Lottery, which only takes 50,000 applications per year and the winners are picked completly randomly.
Soooo life really is a lottery isn't it? ;) To think that my future may be decided by the throw of a dice! Marine Corps or Irish Army? Rooooooll the dice!

[maysoon]

You know what scares me, i can actually see that happening ;)



On a side note i got some feedback from the official marine corps recruitment website as follows:

"We're sorry, but if you are a U.S. citizen living outside of the U.S. or the 11 U.S. Territories, we are unable to process your request for more information via this web site. Instead, we encourage you to contact a U.S. Military facility or a U.S. Recruiting facility for more information about enlisting in the Marine Corps.

You may contact recruiting officials in the U.S. at the following numbers:
From the Pacific area: 808-596-0225 (Honolulu office)
From Europe or North Africa: 516-228-3680 (New York office)

Only U.S. citizens or Lawful Permanent Resident Aliens (LPR) with proper credentials from the United States Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS) are eligible by law to enlist in the U.S. Armed Forces. Citizen requirements cannot be waived. Upon establishing permanent legal residence in the U.S., you should address specific questions regarding your enlistment to your local Marine Corps recruiter. "




Which basicly isn't very helpfull to me since its practicly impossible for me to gain a Legal Residency visa since i do not meet any of the requirements, i can only really put my hope into the Annual Visa Lottery, which only takes 50,000 applications per year and the winners are picked completly randomly.
Soooo life really is a lottery isn't it? ;) To think that my future may be decided by the throw of a dice! Marine Corps or Irish Army? Rooooooll the dice!

Celtic Tiger, why go to Canada and join the Joint Task Force? They are as good as the Marines. I did hear from a Marine that while they believe to be the best, they still respect Navy Seals, British SAS, and Canada's Joint Task Force 2 guys as being just as good if not better. They are good enough to not hurt the ego of a US Marine when they are bested by these deserving individuals. Am I right, Marines, you would not mind the Navy Seals saying Semper Fi, or oorah to you guys.

[DWG]

How good is your spanish? I hear the door is wide open down around Texas.LOL. Apparently our new leaders are set to give amnesty to all the border jumpers of hispanic descent.
Seriously, it is a damn shame that someone who wants to be an American for the purpose of serving in the military has this much problem while any lawbreaker that can walk two miles may be offered citizenship on a silver platter. I certainly hope you can attain your goal, Tiger, as I would rather have someone willing to follow the LAW come into this country than a bunch of undocumenteds, like we have now. Good luck in your quest; have you talked to anyone in the embassy?

[DWG]

Of coarse you all know the story of Liam, the gentleman that fell into a vat of Guiness at the brewery and drowned ..don't you? When asked by his loving wife Colleen wether Liam had a quick death or not, the answer was a resounding no, Liam had died slowly. When Colleen asked the foreman how Liam could have drowned slowly the foreman replied, " Liam drowned slowly because he got out of vat three time to go pee."

Now you KNOW this story is BS. If you had said "we pulled him out three times but he fought his way back in" I might have believed it. What Irishman would get out of a VAT of beer just to take a leak?:banana:

[DWG]

maysoon]. They are good enough to not hurt the ego of a US Marine when they are bested by these deserving individuals. Am I right, Marines, you would not mind the Navy Seals saying Semper Fi, or oorah to you guys.[/quote]

Take cover little girl!:evilgrin:

[maysoon]

You know what scares me, i can actually see that happening ;)



On a side note i got some feedback from the official marine corps recruitment website as follows:

"We're sorry, but if you are a U.S. citizen living outside of the U.S. or the 11 U.S. Territories, we are unable to process your request for more information via this web site. Instead, we encourage you to contact a U.S. Military facility or a U.S. Recruiting facility for more information about enlisting in the Marine Corps.

You may contact recruiting officials in the U.S. at the following numbers:
From the Pacific area: 808-596-0225 (Honolulu office)
From Europe or North Africa: 516-228-3680 (New York office)

Only U.S. citizens or Lawful Permanent Resident Aliens (LPR) with proper credentials from the United States Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS) are eligible by law to enlist in the U.S. Armed Forces. Citizen requirements cannot be waived. Upon establishing permanent legal residence in the U.S., you should address specific questions regarding your enlistment to your local Marine Corps recruiter. "




Which basicly isn't very helpfull to me since its practicly impossible for me to gain a Legal Residency visa since i do not meet any of the requirements, i can only really put my hope into the Annual Visa Lottery, which only takes 50,000 applications per year and the winners are picked completly randomly.
Soooo life really is a lottery isn't it? ;) To think that my future may be decided by the throw of a dice! Marine Corps or Irish Army? Rooooooll the dice!

Celtic Tiger, Canada would not deny you entry as you are the Source of Commonwealth. Canada has to roll the red carpet to you and cannot play numbers to a British, although it is more difficult for a Canadian to get access to British. Isn't it funny, that Canada having no bad sentiments for the UK, except for French Canadians, don't have a Union Jack on the corner of their flag? The rest of the commonwealth nations do, like Australia, New Zealand, etc. Perhaps they should put the United States Flag on the Corner of theirs. Most of the naturalized citizens of Canada would be happy to have US and Canada under one flag, so they could go everywhere like the European Union. We should, however, do this without fighting, like the EU have done. The North American Union would not be a bad idea, as we can have their softwood lumber and their alberta oil without fuss. We will in turn protect Canada which will need us for defense.

With a stronger country, I believe that terroism would end. China too would think twice before trying to do anything. I really do believe that Canada can become and US can become North American Union. How many of you Marines are in favor of this?

[DWG]

But then, who could we make fun of, Ay?

[Celtic Tiger]

Good luck in your quest; have you talked to anyone in the embassy?

Yes, i've emailed them and rang them a few times, keep getting the same answer, that they cannot help me and that i should check the Immigration department website. I'm hoping to eventually make it down there in person and perhaps get an interview with the Military Attache (if there even is one in Dublin Embassy), otherwise the Marine Guard Commander if thats at all possible.



Celtic Tiger, Canada would not deny you entry as you are the Source of Commonwealth.

I'm an Irish citizen im afraid maysoon, Ireland is not a member of the Commonwealth, We are an independant nation that has fought for individual status among the nations of the world for over 800 years as oppossed to other ex-British colonys and conquered lands who were given semi- independance on the pretext of admission into the Commonwealth.
Ireland got its independance in 1922 and broke all ties with the British Government soon after, we even demanded that Britain remove its naval bases in key strategic positions in Ireland during ww2 as we wished to remain as neutral as possible during the conflict. Although a compromise was settled when we unofficially agreed to give Allied Aircraft permission to fly over Irish Airspace and hand over to the Allies downed Pilots and captured Axis spies found on Irish Soil.
Great apologies for the history lesson but im very proud of Ireland and where it came from.

Also im pretty sure Canada has a special economic status with the U.S already when it comes to special trade omissions especially. And correct me if im wrong, isn't there already a North American Economic Community of some sorts that Canada is a member of?

[Celtic Tiger]

How good is your spanish? I hear the door is wide open down around Texas.LOL. Apparently our new leaders are set to give amnesty to all the border jumpers of hispanic descent.
Seriously, it is a damn shame that someone who wants to be an American for the purpose of serving in the military has this much problem while any lawbreaker that can walk two miles may be offered citizenship on a silver platter. I certainly hope you can attain your goal, Tiger, as I would rather have someone willing to follow the LAW come into this country than a bunch of undocumenteds, like we have now. Good luck in your quest; have you talked to anyone in the embassy?



Also in relation to the above, i have to agree and i thank you for your sentiments. But also i cannot blame the latinos for wanting to get into a land where good paying jobs and personal security are available. Hell us Irish took advantage of that for a long long time ourselves. We practicly built Manhatten alone.

[DWG]

Also in relation to the above, i have to agree and i thank you for your sentiments. But also i cannot blame the latinos for wanting to get into a land where good paying jobs and personal security are available. Hell us Irish took advantage of that for a long long time ourselves. We practicly built Manhatten alone.

Different situation-The Irish were LEGAL immigrants-they weren't sneaking in in submarines to New York. They also went to work in the most dangerous and back breaking jobs; mining, railroad construction and of course, cannon fodder. They did not sneak in, have a child as a "baby anchor", apply for welfare and send for their parents to put them on social security-in other words, they contributed to society, they did not become a drag on it, drawing resources from taxpayers. As much as they were abused in the early days, they came to BECOME Americans; not a permanent underground foreign presence.

[devildoghopeful]

Celtic Tiger, talking in person to someone at the Embassy is a great idea. Here in London, the amount of Marines guarding the Embassy has drastically decreased but there is still a defence attache: http://www.usembassy.org.uk/dao/index.html.

For Dublin it's: http://dublin.usembassy.gov/ireland/dao.html

Telephone: (353)- 1-668-8777, EXT 2200

[DWG]

Celtic Tiger:!: Marry maysoon, get you a green card:!: Join the Corps; have a half dozen Eskimo-Irish(Eskrish? Irimos?) rugrats; go lifer! The true American dream.:banana: I know this has to be a movie in the making-careful-devildoghopeful may try to steal this idea.LMAO

[devildoghopeful]

Lol, hey maysoon, wanna get with a Brit? ROTFL, Just kidding, I got dual citizenship baby! So Celtic Tiger, I wont stand in your way...

D W George, nice idea, sell this to Spielberg, make billions. :)

[devildoghopeful]

(Too late to add this on to the other post so I apologise for double posting).

Celtic Tiger, if you're serious about the USMC and you need that green card/residency, the best and probably easiest way is to go to university in the USA. I THINK (but I'm not 100% sure) that it'll be easier to get permanent residency in the US having gone to college there. I'll look further into that for you though.

[DWG]

Lol, hey maysoon, wanna get with a Brit? ROTFL, Just kidding, I got dual citizenship baby! So Celtic Tiger, I wont stand in your way...

D W George, nice idea, sell this to Spielberg, make billions.

Screw Spielberg; sell it to Mel Gibson and make multi-billions.:) I may have found a way to retire at last!! As far as going to school here-I think the hadjis have that all sewn up.:devious: Would't hurt to check it out-I hear Notre Dame has a soft spot for the Irish! (Or the University of Washington;) )

[Celtic Tiger]

Celtic Tiger, talking in person to someone at the Embassy is a great idea. Here in London, the amount of Marines guarding the Embassy has drastically decreased but there is still a defence attache: http://www.usembassy.org.uk/dao/index.html.

For Dublin it's: http://dublin.usembassy.gov/ireland/dao.html

Telephone: (353)- 1-668-8777, EXT 2200

Thanks a million devildoghopeful for that information. It helps.




(Too late to add this on to the other post so I apologise for double posting).

Celtic Tiger, if you're serious about the USMC and you need that green card/residency, the best and probably easiest way is to go to university in the USA. I THINK (but I'm not 100% sure) that it'll be easier to get permanent residency in the US having gone to college there. I'll look further into that for you though.

Also yes, i have been thinking seriously about that as a first step atleast. But by the time i finish a degree ill be what... 24? Thats just one year away from the age limit of 25 isn't it? Plus i had my share of college already and i was completly sick of the lifestyle and form of education so im really not sure about the idea.

[devildoghopeful]

Hey no problem.

Hmmm, well if you don't want to go to college, I think probably the best route is to talk to the defense attache at the embassy and state your intentions. The reason for this is that the US gets millions of applications for green cards/citizenship every year, and as we know it's very difficult to get accepted. However, you are one of few that has a clear goal. Many people I know can't get into the US on a green card because they just want to move there, then take life as it comes. Not only do you have a clear direction, you want to serve the United States by joining it's Military and if you go and make a good impression on the defense attache in Dublin, chances are that you'll have their backing when dealing with immigration, and that can't be a bad thing.

Just to make it clear that I am BY NO MEANS an expert on this subject and if anyone knows differently to what I've just said or I've got anything totally wrong, please say so.

[Celtic Tiger]

Aye thats a good point, its one area worth exploring, as i know i'd have alot to offer, all i need is a chance to talk to the right person really to prove myself.

I'd like to think that with my experience and qualifications that maybe i'd have a better chance than the average joe. I've even been studying arabic the past two years in an attempt to tip the balance if it ever comes to it.

But again in that way its about talking to the right person, as otherwise im just another name on a sheet.

Do you even think it might be worth while contacting a congressman/senator? One who gets their votes from the irish american community perhaps? Or would that be wishfull thinking?

[devildoghopeful]

Heck, go for it. Ask a Congressman, send a letter to the Commandant, email the President, what's the worst that can happen? The only thing that it might cost you is time.

Yes, I'd be VERY surprised if your military background didn't make a difference, even if it doesn't help you get into the US, if you do, you might well get contract PFC. Actually, where are/were you on the rank ladder in the Irish Army?

In this case you can only do too little, never too much. So go ahead and contact the defense attache, see what he says, then see if you want to get in contact with a congressman and take it from there.

Stay commited and you'll be heading off too boot camp before you know it.

[Celtic Tiger]

Well im currently a Three Star Private, which is the Irish Army equivilant to PFC.

Although I am doing a Potential NCO's course this comming April, and unless i do something stupid like shoot myself in the legs, thats me comming out with stripes ;)

[devildoghopeful]

Then I'd be really surprised if that didn't help.

[maysoon]

Also im pretty sure Canada has a special economic status with the U.S already when it comes to special trade omissions especially. And correct me if im wrong, isn't there already a North American Economic Community of some sorts that Canada is a member of?[/quote]

You know, I think that just as you mention, US and Canada should thus peacefully form a North American Union, and settle it just like the European Union is doing. Perhaps we can allow Japan to be part of this, so they become part of us rather than with the rest of Asia. We defend them from North Korea and China, but then we will make them a part of us. But this also means that having strategic positions against North Korea and China should they try to attack us. We will have two little girls to be an American Daddy to. One Japanese Hawaiian fellow mentioned that he would like Canada and Japan to form North American Union with us, as the economy would be better for all of us. By uniting, there is more peace in the world too. By being small and divided, squirmishes and war develops.

[maysoon]

Lol, hey maysoon, wanna get with a Brit? ROTFL, Just kidding, I got dual citizenship baby! So Celtic Tiger, I wont stand in your way...

D W George, nice idea, sell this to Spielberg, make billions. :)

Having EU and North American Union would be a good idea.

[DWG]

Having EU and North American Union would be a good idea.

Tiger? Devildog? That sounds like a YES to me.:banana: :D :banana:

[devildoghopeful]

LOL well it sure as **** wasn't a no was it?

:cool:

Celtic Tiger: Have you spoken to the defense attache yet? (He might be on holiday)

[tkmac58]

Aye that's a good point, its one area worth exploring, as i know I'd have a lot to offer, all i need is a chance to talk to the right person really to prove myself.

I'd like to think that with my experience and qualifications that maybe I'd have a better chance than the average Joe. I've even been studying Arabic the past two years in an attempt to tip the balance if it ever comes to it.

But again in that way its about talking to the right person, as otherwise im just another name on a sheet.

Do you even think it might be worth while contacting a congressman/senator? One who gets their votes from the Irish American community perhaps? Or would that be wishful thinking?
I am hearing allot of good ideas about how you can join and its sas to say is that none will work. The Marine Corps has a bible called the MPPM, in it you will find how to become or what it takes to join. In it you will find a list of 40 -50 hostile countries that are a no go. (probably more are being added as we speak). You will find that the rules to join are spelled out, " a US Citizen is defined as being born in the US or US Territory, the other exceptions are certain Indian tribes in Canada, refugees, etc. The non citizens must have a INS 151, 551, and there are a couple more. A more popular one is a I-94 card, arrival/departure with a current stamp meaning you have approved as a resident legal alien. A work visa, student visa, is not acceptable for military entrance. A US Congressman, US Embassy, cannot and will not change the rules, if so we have allot of people to enlist. The examples you are getting on line are all green card (INS Card) holders with legal, bonafide docs. Sorry about that, you have to go thru the system, buts its worth it. I dont know your status but the INS will take there time, at least say they are.

Good Luck
TKMAC58

[Celtic Tiger]

Christ sake.

By the time i get through that beaucracy ill probably be too fat an complacent to give a damn about the corps.

I have the skills, experience, qualifications and most of all i have the will, why cant that be good enough.

I'm willing to give my life yet that's not good enough.

I would understand if i was born in China or Uzbekistan. But christ im an irish citizen.

Sure we have a history of terrorism, but that was nationalist terrorism not religious.

Apologies for the fustration but i've been researching this for a good year or so and i keep getting the same answers.

[jinelson]

Where there is a will there is a way and others have done it. Never give up!

[devildoghopeful]

Like the SSgt said, don't give up buddy, it now seems that the fastest way to get the form filling done.....is to start right now!

Stay Motivated, I know the feeling you're having, I experienced it last year when I was told that I couldn't join the Corps because I had had childhood asthma. I was totally torn apart but it later turned out that it was ok since I hadn't experienced any symptoms since before I was 12 years old.

This will work itself out, you just need to hang in there.

Good luck and Stay Moto!

[Celtic Tiger]

Mmmm less alcohol for me.

Damn holidays.

[tkmac58]

Christ sake.

By the time i get through that beaucracy ill probably be too fat an complacent to give a damn about the corps.

I have the skills, experience, qualifications and most of all i have the will, why cant that be good enough.

I'm willing to give my life yet that's not good enough.

I would understand if i was born in China or Uzbekistan. But christ im an irish citizen.

Sure we have a history of terrorism, but that was nationalist terrorism not religious.

Apologies for the fustration but i've been researching this for a good year or so and i keep getting the same answers.
Your heart seems to be in the right place, but you are going to continue to receive the same line of bs until you change your circumstances. Having the will is great, wanting to fight is admirable, but waiver the rules start with you. If you have as much will as you say why not try and get it over with. Become the solution by doing your part, I served 27 years and had to fight for everything and I was born here. My father fought in the Chosin during Korea as a Marine, he also had to fight for everything and won until his last fight took his life. I have seen people lose 300 lbs to join, give up there children to serve. If this is what you want do it. Your still young.

Good Luck
TKMAC58

[Celtic Tiger]

I see your point there, i have plenty of time ahead of me as a young lad.

The thing is in my situation its not a matter of will or physical/psycological hurdles that i need to jump over.

Its a matter of legal requirements which cannot be bypassed "officially" from the information i have gathered so far.

So far i need a Legal Residency visa, aka: Green Card.

To get that i either need an american parent or prove i am essential to a certain american workforce which pretty much means getting me a sponser that will sign their name on a sheet saying that without me their business would not progress.

The only other way apart from that is applying for the Lottery program that takes in applications every year and selects 50,000 of them completly randomly for automatic legal residency.

Its the lottery im now depending on for that green card, but its random and i cant put all my faith into it, so naturally im still trying to expand my knowledge.

[Camper51]

Christ sake.

By the time i get through that beaucracy ill probably be too fat an complacent to give a damn about the corps.


Apologies for the fustration but i've been researching this for a good year or so and i keep getting the same answers.

And why haven't you spent that year getting on a waiting list to get to America? Seems to me that a year has been wasted because you have not taken the bull by the horns yet!!!

[DWG]

So far i need a Legal Residency visa, aka: Green Card.

To get that i either need an american parent or prove i am essential



Camper51; take the hint-adopt the little mick:!: :D

[Celtic Tiger]

And why haven't you spent that year getting on a waiting list to get to America? Seems to me that a year has been wasted because you have not taken the bull by the horns yet!!!

There is no waiting list, theres the random lottery program as i mentioned, applications open October, winners announced around April of the following year.

I do not qualify for any of the other options, the lottery is my only option.

Thus its simply a waiting game and crossing your fingers every year Camper51, nothing more and nothing less.

But like i said in my previous post, im still exploring other options, or atleast the possability that there actually are other options.

[Echo_Four_Bravo]

Celtic Tiger, you could always learn a skill that would make you a needed worker, which can speed up the process of getting a visa.

[Shrike]

Celtic Tiger (member.php?u=34885), hi to yoy, fellow foreign wannaby :). I'm from Russia and I will get my GC through employment. If you'll loose a lottery it will be only option exept marriage :). As far as I got to know - bachelor degree is a big plus. Without bachelor you will wait GC for years. Anyway, you'll need a lowyer.

So good luck with lottery and godspeed.

[Celtic Tiger]

All of that is so damn long term.

I'm so tempted sometimes to just say screw it and join the irish army full time.

[Shrike]

Celtic Tiger (member.php?u=34885)

I choosed this long way because I want to fight and become a warrior. With Irish army you will quite probably get a good job and good friends, bit it will nothing to compare with life of Marine. So if you don't want to regret in future you should take your chances.

[Celtic Tiger]

Well thats the catch isn't it.

If i am going to actually take the plunge finally and join the military I want to have as many oppertunities as possible when it comes to careers, equipment, training and so forth.
The irish army is great if you want a balanced military life and family life as once you get past basic training your pretty much doing bank security van escorts for the rest of your years besides the odd exercise and U.N mission if your selected.

With the American Armed forces they have bases all over the world, the best equipment and countless training programmes and much better oppertunities for advancement if you want it enough.

Its a tough decision to make, going through all the waiting and hassle just to join the U.S Armed forces, do it all and get the t-shirt, when possibly i could join the irish army right now and go through it all and come out with possibly the same qualifications.

So... a few years of headaches for the Marines?

Or right now for the Irish Army?


Either way though, im gonna be here at home and working for the next year atleast, as for a start i need to get back into shape, but also i need to save up some cash for laser eye surgery and im hoping to go on a sky diving course for my birthday comming up, either way im going to be waiting so i might as well keep pursueing the American Armed Forces ambition.

[jinelson]

CelticTiger you may want to communicate by PM with Shrike I know as a fact that he has researched this inside and out.

Jim

[Echo_Four_Bravo]

Celtic Tiger, I say this as nicly as I possibly can.

I don't think you have the right motivation or enough drive to be a US Marine. This speed bump in your path isn't really that difficult to overcome. If you want to be a Marine, you will find a way to make it happen. Thousands of people manage to get green cards and come to the US each year. If they can do it, so can you.

Why don't you look closer to home? The British Royal Marine would likely be an option for you. The French Foreign Legion would clearly be a possibility. And both of those would present fewer problems for you.

[Celtic Tiger]

Echo with all due respect I'd advise you to look up the Legal Residency visa requirements and match it to my current skills and qualifications before judging my motivation and drive.
I could have applied to the Irish Army Cadets (Irish OTC) two years ago and I know for a fact i would have been accepted. I could have applied to the Royal Irish Regiment two years ago and I know for a fact I would have been accepted. I am a young lad of 20 years of age and I was the only recruit in the history of the Irish Army Reserves to become a Corporal right out of Basic Training, which i later lost when i went to Study War and Security Studies in College in England, but which im trying to get back now that im out of College.
I spent two years studying International Relations, the above course and Arabic language skills. I spent my whole life surrounded by politics being in region of Ireland smothered by it and living in a family with a father heavily involved, developing strategys for him in campaigns. I read old surplus military manuals when i was a young boy when others my age were playing with their Action Men and G.I Joes.

The purpose of me telling you all this isn't arrogance, Its simply for you all to finally realise that I am not here because I am bored. I am here because I have built my life around being the best.
I built my life around the Military, I have always been the best and I want the best career possible in the best Military as possible.

My life and history is my motivation, nothing else.








Overall excuse the rant, not my intention. Echo's comments simply insulted me to the core of my nation nevermind person and being.

[DWG]

Echo is right-you offer more excuses than solutions. There is nothing wrong with the Royal Marines (aside from being Brits)

[Celtic Tiger]

Echo is right-you offer more excuses than solutions. There is nothing wrong with the Royal Marines (aside from being Brits)


I enjoy having kneecaps.

And thank you so much for your pre-judgement.

I speak what i am thinking whether people like what i think or not and I try to be as realistic as possible.

Its all nice for you lads being borin in the states and having gone through the corps now. So please do try not to judge the same is so easy for others to do. Different people are in different situations.

Anyways i got many constructive replies and i thank you all for that, it looks like that is as far as the support i will get now judging from the more recent replies.

Thank you all while it has lasted.

[DWG]

And thank you so much for your pre-judgement.





Just another service I offer!

You have been given a lot of advice on this thread and other areas to check into. Maybe it is now time for you to start checking these avenues-you might luck out and get into something sooner than expected. I think some feel that you are more interested in complaining about your plight than in attempting to overcome it. Marines have very little compassion for that kind of thinking. If we are wrong, then you will eventually find a way to earn your EGA; then you can come back and rub all our noses in it! I don't think there is a Jarhead here that would resent it if you did. Good Luck!:D

[yellowwing]

...And that concludes this episode. Six pages is enough for Celtic Tiger to work with.