American Legion commander's Vietnam vet credentials questioned; Morin served in N.J.

[thedrifter]

American Legion commander's Vietnam vet credentials questioned; Morin served in N.J.

By: Associated Press

BOSTON -- The national commander of the American Legion never served in Vietnam although he describes himself as a "Vietnam veteran," a newspaper reported Sunday.

Paul A. Morin, who was elected Aug. 31 to a one-year term as commander of the nation's largest veterans organization, spent his time in the Army from 1972 to 1974 at Fort Dix, N.J., The Boston Sunday Globe reported.

Neither the federal government nor the 2.7 million-member American Legion makes a formal distinction between veterans who served in Vietnam and those known as "Vietnam-era" veterans.

"I am a Vietnam veteran," Morin, of Chicopee in western Massachusetts, told the newspaper. His biography on the Legion's Web site also describes Morin as a "Vietnam veteran of the US Army."

The Legion's top spokesman, Joe March, backed Morin's position. He said any current service member stationed in the United States at present could claim to be an Iraq war veteran.

But former Sen. Max Cleland of Georgia said Morin's claim may undercut the credibility of veterans groups that fight for Congressional funding of veterans' programs.

"For the national commander of the American Legion, who never even served in the Vietnam theater, to call himself a Vietnam veteran is a lie," said Cleland, who lost both legs and an arm during combat in Vietnam, and who has been a Legion member since 1969.

Thomas G. Kelley, the Massachusetts secretary of veterans affairs and also a Vietnam veteran, said Morin is misleading people.

"When someone says he is a Vietnam veteran, it means he served in the theater of the war," Kelley said.

Before his national campaign, Morin was a ranking member of the Legion's state office and was described on its Web site as a Vietnam-era veteran who was stationed in New Jersey.

Morin is the superintendent of the Soldier's Home, a state-run facility in Holyoke for needy veterans. He took an unpaid leave to serve as leader of the American Legion.

Morin did not return two calls from The Associated Press seeking additional comment Sunday. March, the Legion's spokesman, also did not return a call Sunday.

On the Net:

Legion: http://www.legion.org/

Ellie

[10thzodiac]

General Smedley D. Butler, refused belonging even to the Marine Corps League and all other organizations believing they were just mouth pieces for big business interest. Reluctantly he did join the Veterans of Foreign Wars as a favor to General Lejeune, but Smedley prided himself as being a “most inactive member” of it.

SF
10th

[drumcorpssnare]

Whenever asked, I openly share that I enlisted in the Marine Corps as the Vietnam war was winding down, and that although I consider myself fortunate that I wasn't asked to serve there...I would have willingly gone and done my duty, if needed.

SEMPER FI:usmc:
drumcorpssnare

[Zulu 36]

I too enlisted as the Vietnam War was winding down for US involvement. All through boot camp we were harrassed by the drill instructors about enlisting too late for Vietnam and were called various names implying cowardice.

However, I ended up going to Vietnam for literally the last nine months before the US signed the Paris Accords. That I am aware of, at least three other guys from my boot camp platoon served in Vietnam (two with me in MAG-12, one in 1st ANGLICO) and a couple of others from the series (also in MAG-12).

When I ran into one of my DIs a few years later on my second WestPac tour, he was rather surprised to see my Vietnam service ribbons.

However, in my opinion, if you didn't get a VN Service Medal, you can't claim to be a "Vietnam Veteran." Serving in New Jersey puts one a little short of the requirements.

Despite some bad experiences, all-in-all I am glad I was able to serve in Vietnam and proudly claim the other title of "Marine Vietnam Veteran."

[ErikHeiker]

I too enlisted as Vietnam was winding down and never got to go. I have always refered to myself as a Vietnam era veteran. As far as I'm concerned, the only ones that get to call themselves Vietnam vets are those who went there. Same goes for today's vets. If you didn't go to Iraq or Afghanistan, then you're a GWOT era veteran. At least this time around I did get to go, so I'm proud to call myself an Afghanistan veteran.

[iamcloudlander]

about six months ago I received a letter from the hq of the American Legion stating it was from the office of Paul Morin. In it he stated that as a fellow "VietNam Vet" he was asking me to join and have a part in the efforts to elevate the status of the VietNam Veterans.

[greensideout]

It sounds like Morin is now doing the dance around the mulberry bush.

Just to show you how things can get confusing however, look at my record---
My DD-214 does not show service in Vietnam.
I do not have a Vietnam Service Medal.
I am not a Vietnam Era Vietnam.

So it would follow that I am not a Vietnam Veteran.
As Paul Harvey would say, "Now for the rest of the story".---LOL

[SuNmAN]

I would NEVER EVER describe myself as an Iraq War Veteran having not been there

it is outright misleading and a lie.

Morin needs to be replaced.

[jinelson]

Ya'll want to know what I find funny? For decades we Vietnam Veterans were the scum of the earth and now everyone claims to be one in public!

Go Figure

Jim

[greensideout]

Good return fire Jim! :thumbup: They had their day, now they want ours. I guess they learned that being a dirt bag and being crass had no honor.

[FistFu68]

:usmc: THEN & NOW~VIETNAM COMBAT VETERAN~DAM PROUD OF IT:usmc:

[10thzodiac]

Ya'll want to know what I find funny? For decades we Vietnam Veterans were the scum of the earth and now everyone claims to be one in public!

Go Figure

Jim

After the war was over and employers frowned on hiring Vietnam Veterans, I was already working at Brach Candy in Chicago as an electrician. They hired a Vietnamese electrician. He was formally the Vice Minister of Industry of South Vietnam, he had a French degree in Electrical Engineering and had pictures of him and Johnson shaking hands.

I didn't care for him and I let him know I didn't like him. Additionally my boss had an ax to grind with me because of the hard time I gave him when I was union steward.

I knew the boss was keeping written notes on me in a folder hoping some day he could fire me. I guess this Nuyen told the boss we were not getting along and the next thing I know the boss was asking me if was I a Vietnam Veteran. I told him yes. It wasn't long after that I saw my boss writing some sh*t in his folder about me.

I could just imagine what he was writing, 10thz doesn't like Nuyen because he's a Vietnam Veteran, giving Nuyen a bad time, he's prejudice.

Nuyen had a photographic memory but couldn't tape two wires together, an accident looking for a place to happen.

Our electric shop was a real motley crew, we had Irish, Lithuanians, Germans, Poles, Greeks, Italians, Chec's, Mexicans, Blacks, Iranians, Palestinians, Indians (dot heads), Koreans and Vietnamese. We actually even had "Tom, Dick and Harry."

The Korean guy wanted to kill the Vietnamese. Nuyen would tease the sh*t out of Kim as being inferior. Kim was big and must of threatened Nuyen because Nuyen started packing. I trying to tell Nuyen to leave him alone after he showed me a gun and that he'd shoot Kim, but the boss thought I was cranking Nuyen up to go after Kim and told me to stop talking to Nuyen. LMFAO.

SF
10thz

[TazMatt]

I, too served during the Vietnam Era and am called a Vietnam veteran although I did not actually go "in" country but as was stated eariler would have gone if I had been ordered to.I realize that not being combat tested is a big difference,but we all still had our jobs to do in support of the Marines in country,how else were they able to do the things they had to do. Many a time I have questioned myself on this matter because as a Marine I sometimes feel cheated about not being able to go in country,but then again I feel fortunate that I did not have to go. I say many thanks to the ones who did go and feel blessed that I didn't have to. I lost a very good friend in Nam who was in the Army and I didn't know it until after he was dead and buried.

[K-Bay Jim]

:marine:
Can we put this Viet Nam veteran and Viet Nam Era veteran bull**** to rest please. I enlisted in November of 65(service no. 217****)
and was told by everyone; my recruiter, Drill Instructors, etc... that it was
next stop-Westpac. Well , the closest I got was K-Bay. When I went to the
gunny to ask permission to request mast to see the CO to volunteer to transfer to the 27th Marines who were training there at the time he told me
to shut the f*** up and get back to work; when the Corps wants you in
Nam ,they will let you know. That makes me a Viet Nam era vet and I've never claimed to be anything else, and I'm very proud of my 3 years service. To think less of Marines who were not in country is wrong.However
it is also wrong to mislead people about your tour of duty, and the new
commander of the American Legion should have been upfront about where he did his.

[Sgt Leprechaun]

This goes to the "Stolen Valor" issue, basically. Not only Vietnam vets, but in wars prior to Vietnam, people have claimed service in places they've never been and things they've never done.

I've never seen combat, unless you count being at the Pentagon on 9/11. Note it's "at", and not "in". To me, there is, in fact, a difference.

I think it's the same for the "Vietnam era" vet thing. There were plenty of guys who served in Korea, Germany, and all over who did what they were supposed to do who didn't see combat, but still should be proud of the service they rendered.

[Zulu 36]

Even in a Marine Corps heavily involved in a war, not being sent to the shooting zone can sometimes be just a matter of luck (good or bad, your choice).

I once worked with a retired Marine GySgt who enlisted in 1940. Naturally he was in when Pearl Harbor happened. His unit was mustered several weeks later and volunteers were asked for a "special assignment." Of course, everyone assumed that meant a special combat unit going for an early crack at the Japs and he raised his hand.

He ended up in Puerto Rico guarding ammo dumps. Then he was sent to be a DI at Parris Island. He thought he might have been the only non-combat veteran DI on the island.

He had just been transferred to a combat unit at Camp Pendleton in training for the invasion of Japan when the war ended. In short, even as a regular Marine, he never saw action in all of WWII.

The Marine Corps caught up to him during Korea and he was at the Chosin in Fox/2/7. Some catch-up.

[drumcorpssnare]

A good friend of mine is the Post Commander of a VFW here in Syracuse. He's also a Legion member. He tells me that whenever Morin was asked, point blank, if he was ever in country, he said, "No." And that as often as Morin used the phrase 'Vietnam veteran', he also frequently used the term 'Vietnam-era veteran.'
Doesn't sound to me as though this guy was blatantly misrepresenting his service. It's almost a matter of semantics. ("You say to-may-to, I say to-mah-to....let's call the whole thing off.")
Just my thoughts...
drumcorpssnare:usmc:

[Sgt Leprechaun]

Dang, Zulu. My story is similiar....Most of my recruit platoon, along with me, was 'Open Contract', 1/2 got selected Infantry (including me) the other half got "Cooks and Bakers school". I was interviewed for 8th n I because I met the height and clearance requirement, turned it down because I wanted to go to the Fleet...didn't happen...they needed me for a 'special' assignment...."You will report to HQBN, HQMC for a period of approx. 30-45 days as a food service attendant"....I'll admit it, I cried like a little girl! After doing 45 days of washing the Commandants dishes, I figured "Great, now I'll get to go to the fleet!"...WRONG. Because the mess duty was considered 'hardship' (??), we were selected to be Marine Barracks Guards (8151), with our choice of any MarBks on the East Coast (later messmen got ANY MarBks, some chose Subic, London, etc). No FMF for me.

Meanwhile, the rest of my platoon goes to the Fleet...and Grenada, Beruit, etc.

After putting in about 10 AA forms, 1stSgt Jack Wierick called me into his office and told me "Stop submitting these G*d*mn AA forms, If I don't get to go, you don't get to go!!!"

While it wasn't WWII, I still feel like I was cheated out of serving in a combat zone...

[OLE SARG]

BUT, there is a difference between a Vietnam-era Veteran (in service during Vietnam) and a Vietnam Veteran (in Vietnam getting shot at and dodging ****ing mortars and rockets)!!!!!

My $.02 worth............................

SEMPER FI,

[Camper51]

BUT, there is a difference between a Vietnam-era Veteran (in service during Vietnam) and a Vietnam Veteran (in Vietnam getting shot at and dodging ****ing mortars and rockets)!!!!!

My $.02 worth............................

SEMPER FI,

Not necessarily, had I gone to Viet Nam I would have been either in Danang or Saigon as a REMF. Relatively safe in either place and definitely never would have gone to the field, nor would have I been put on perimiter duty except maybe as a Sgt of the Guard but considering my MOS probably not. Yet if I had gone I would have been awarded the appropriate awards/ribbons and been able to call myself a Vietnam Vet, however I didn't go so I am quite satisfied with Vietnam Era Vet. I tried time and time again to get my tour in before I got married but the Sgt Major basically told me to fly a kite and as a result I was in Hawaii when the war ended and I got to greet the POW's as they got off the plane and kissed American soil for the first time in many years...

[drumcorpssnare]

Camper51- I was there the same day! Remember the D&B Corps performing for the returning Marines? WOW! Small world.

SEMPER FI!
drumcorpssnare:usmc:

[10thzodiac]

Marines, I spent the better part of two months off shore Vietnam (9th MEB, Aug '64), first Da Nang then Saigon.

They were thinking of having us evacuate all of the Americans out of South Vietnam, too many coup detat's ! America was afraid the next coup would be a total collapse of the South and an ensuing blood bath for all Americans ashore.

The coup never happened and the 9th MEB went back to Okinawa. I was in Battalion Headquarters 2/12. All of our office people and supply personnel that never went with us and stayed in Okinawa were also awarded the AFEB for Vietnam Service.

We can now exchange the AFEM for the VNSM, I have not.

When I asked for my medals in the 1990's I was surprised that they said I was awarded the VNCG unit citation ~ Go figure

They have been in a box in my dresser ever since.

SF
10thz

[FistFu68]

:evilgrin: YOU DIDN'T MISS 'NOTHING BADAZZE'S~CHIT YOU PROBABLY EVEN GOT A PUC.~OR A COMBAT ACTION RIBBON???SEMPER~FIDELIS:evilgrin:

[OLE SARG]

It boils down to you were either in Vietnam or not!!!!!!!! That is not dealing with the hypothesis of what might have happened IF you went to Vietnam. Danang and Saigon were relatively safe but there were lots of Americans killed in both places. I was in Danang, did field duty, pulled perimeter guard duty, outran Russian rockets quite a few times, and sat in a bunker while Charlie sent mortars in.

SEMPER FI,

[10thzodiac]

“I was not prepared to shoot my eardrum out with a shotgun in order to get a deferment. Nor was I willing to go to Canada. So I chose to better myself and learn to fly airplanes.”
~ George W. Bush
1984-05 to the Houston Chronicle

Why should we hear about body bags, and deaths...I mean, it's not relevant. So why should I waste my beautiful mind on something like that?
~Barbara Bush
About the quote: Mrs. Bush spoke these words on ABC's "Good Morning America," March 18, 2003.

[003XXMarineDAD]

10th Is there any post you do that is not a hate Bush or anit american slant.

[10thzodiac]

10th Is there any post you do that is not a hate Bush or anit american slant.

Ah, come on pop's, I didn't say it, the Bushes did. If repeating the spoken words of the President and the First Lady makes one un-American, WTF is this country coming too http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/11.gif


Are we all going insane now ?