Sen. Warner Wants More Info On Marine's Medals

[GyG1345]

Norfolk Virginian-Pilot

January 9, 2003

Sen. Warner Wants More Information On Marine's Medals

By Dale Eisman, Virginian-Pilot

WASHINGTON -- A key senator is asking the Marine Corps to provide additional
information on medals formerly worn by Lt. Gen. Michael W. Hagee, who is to
be sworn in on Monday as commandant of the Marine Corps.

Sen. John W. Warner, R-Va., the new chairman of the Senate Armed Services
Committee, wants "the full body of fact" on Hagee's awards, a spokeswoman
said. It was unclear Wednesday when Marine officials, or perhaps Hagee
himself, might meet with Warner.

Hagee, 58, disclosed Tuesday that he removed three ribbons from his uniform
because neither he nor Marine officials can locate records that would prove
he earned them. He attributed the lack of documentation to sloppy
record-keeping and insisted that he had been authorized to wear the awards.

The awards in question are a humanitarian service award from operations in
Somalia in 1992, a Vietnamese Cross of Gallantry awarded by the South
Vietnamese government during the Vietnam War and a Navy unit commendation
awarded sometime before 1988.

Marine records also indicate that Hagee received at least one award, a
bronze star attached to his Navy and Marine Corps overseas service ribbon,
that he has not been wearing.

Officials indicated this week that the Corps' records branch is continuing a
search of its files for documentation on all of Hagee's awards. Hagee has
said he is still searching his personal records as well.

The proper display of awards on a service member's uniform is considered a
matter of honor in the military. Most ribbons can be purchased with ease
from uniform suppliers, but the wearing of a ribbon that was unearned can be
prosecuted as a violation of the Uniform Code of Military Justice.

The subject is particularly sensitive in the naval services, including the
Marine Corps, because of the suicide in 1996 of Adm. Jeremy M. Boorda, then
the Navy's chief of operations. Boorda shot himself shortly before reporters
from Newsweek magazine were to interview him about his wearing of a "Combat
V" he had not been properly awarded.

The Senate confirmed Hagee's appointment as commandant last fall, after the
Armed Services Committee unanimously endorsed his nomination by President
Bush. He is to receive a fourth star and will become a member of the Joint
Chiefs of Staff when he takes the oath on Monday.

Hagee got a quick vote of confidence from Defense Secretary Donald H.
Rumsfeld on Tuesday, when the discrepancies came to light. But Warner has
refused comment until he receives more information.

The Armed Services Committee typically receives a detailed report on the
record of any nominee to head a military branch. But the report on Hagee
apparently did not note any problem with documentation for his medals.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Re CMC Stops Wearing 3 Medals... (http://www.leatherneck.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3367)

[mikemac64]

NPRC is where all service records for AirForce, Army, Navy, Marines, and Coast Guard are maintained forever.

Any request for verification of all or issuance of awards, correction to DD-214, or a copy of your records, you should write to the center.

NPRC = National Personnel Records Center

Here is a link to their web page, where you can print a copy of a Standard Form 180, their address is on page 2:

http://www.archives.gov/facilities/...d_form_180.html

Send them the completed form along with a copy of your DD-214, and spell out exactly what actions you want them to do, and upon review of your records and verification of awards entitlement, they will respond to you. Since they receive many many requests, it may take them some time to reply. Be patient..

Every veterans is entitled to ONE replacement set of award if requested.

I hope this helps get you started in your quests.

[Joe Gore]

Sen. Werner needs to get a life and leave well enough alone. He would not be saying anything if it wouldnt get him in the papers. There are more things in his state that he needs to worry about such as crime, un employment etc. He needs to worry about his own state and leave the Commendant a lone.

[Barndog]

I read Joe's comment (shows ya we from Michigan have sense anyways - if nothing else LOL)
And, I (being one for factual relevance) decided to 'take it another step further.

To wit:

CHICKENHAWK HEADQUARTERS
Name, Employer, YearBorn, Relevant Conflict Avoided, Lame Excuse Preferred, Activity
Bush, George W Citizenry 1946 Vietnam A.W.O.L.
Cheney, Dick Citizenry 1941 Vietnam "had other priorities"

BARKING HEAD BRIGADE

Hume, Brit Faux TV 1943 Vietnam
Keyes, Alan Faux TV 1950 Vietnam Harvard
Limbaugh, David Radio? 1952 Vietnam National Guard
Limbaugh, Rush Radio 1951 Vietnam anal cysts
Reagan, Michael Radio? unk Vietnam

THE BUREAUCRATIC BATTALION

Abraham, Spencer Energy Sec. 1952 Vietnam Harvard Law
Abrams, Elliott State Dept. 1948 Vietnam bad back college, grad school
Adelman, Ken Bureaucrat unk Vietnam skin rash
Bolton, John State Dept. 1948 Vietnam
Card, Andrew High-Level Flunky 1947 Vietnam
Evans, Don Commerce Sec. 1946 Vietnam Sigma Alpha Epsilon
Hutchinson, Asa Drug Tsar 1950 Vietnam
Perle, Richard Bureaucrat 1941+C59 Vietnam
Pitt, Harvey Bureaucrat unk Vietnam Law school
Stockman, David Budget-Boy 1946 Vietnam
Thompson, Tommy Bureaucrat 1947 Vietnam National Guard
Walters, John Drug Tsar unk Vietnam
Wolfowitz, Paul Bureaucrat unk Vietnam

JAG

Ashcroft, John "Justice" 1942 Vietnam teaching business ed
Kennedy, Arthur Judge of sorts 1936 Vietnam lawyering
Olson, Ted Solicitor General unk Vietnam
Scalia, Antonin Associate Justice Vietnam
Starr, Ken Persecutor 1947 Vietnam psoriasis
Thomas, Clarence Tool 1948 Vietnam

THE POLITICIANS PLATOON

Alexandar, Lamar ex-Gov. (Tenn.) Vietnam
Barr, Bob US House (R-Ga.) 1948 Vietnam
Bartlett, Roscoe US House (R-MD) 1926 WWII
Bauer, Gary None 1946 Vietnam
Blunt, Roy US House (R-Mo.) 1950 Vietnam
Bush, Jeb Gov. - Fla. 1953 Vietnam
Chambliss, Saxby US House (R-Ga.) 1943 Vietnam bad knees running
Craig, Larry Senator (R-Idaho) 1945 Vietnam
DeLay, Tom US House (R-Tex) 1947 Vietnam attended grad school
Engler, John Gov. - Mich. 1948 Vietnam "too fat," by 8 lbs.
Gingrich, Newt ex-US House (R-Ga.) 1943 Vietnam attended grad school
Giuliani, Rudy ex-Mayor, NYC 1944 Vietnam
Gramm, Phil Senate (R-Tex.) 1942 Vietnam marriage deferment
Hastert, Dennis US House (R-Ill.) 1942 Vietnam bad knees wrestling coach (huh?)
Hutchinson, Tim Senate (R-Ark.) 1949 Vietnam
Keating, Frank Gov. - Okla. 1944 Vietnam
Kemp, Jack ex-US House (R-NY) 1935 Vietnam bum knee football
Lieberman, Joe Senate (Conn.) 1942 Vietnam
Lott, Trent Senate (R-Miss.) 1941 Vietnam cheerleader
McConnell, Mitch Senator (R-Ky.) 1942 Vietnam lawyering
Meyers, Herbert House Candidate, Wash. 1943/46 Vietnam
Nickles, Don Senator (R-Okla.) 1948 Vietnam cushy Guard slot
Quayle, Dan Veep 1947 Vietnam National Guard
Reagan, Ronald Prez 1911 WWII Hollywood
Romney, Mitt None yet 1947 Vietnam BYU
Shelby, Richard Senator (R-Ala.) 1934 Vietnam
Souder, Mark US House (R-IN) 1050 Vietnam
Stone, Roger Consultant 1952± Vietnam
Weber, Vin Politician 1952 Vietnam
Weld, William ex-Gov. - Mass. 1945 Vietnam

You decide for yourself. The documentation is there to support it.

Semper FI

[Lock-n-Load]

If Sec.Rumsfeld reaffirmed confidence in USMC Gen Hagee so be it ...case closed...best thing Warner ever did was...to marry Liz Taylor [the lucky bastard]. LtG:chinese:

[USMC-FO]

Jeez L & L you think being married to Liz Taylor makes him a "Lucky Bastard !! He got lucky when they split !! We're both here in the NE and I'm worried that you look at Liz and see sweet meat !!! Yipes UGH !!

:-)

Semper Fi

[GyG1345]

I think--Liz Taylor notwithstanding--that the issue here involves the fact that the media has previously had a circus w/ previous cases of this kind where Adm Boorda ended up committing suicide over being accused of wearing a medal ( a combat V, if I remember corectly) he was not technically entitled to.

Ironically, one of his accusers, Col David Hackworth USA (Ret.) was also shortly later in the same boat and relinquished several of his own decorations some time later in order to appease others. And there have been others.

So the CMC seems to have been well advised to do as he has done to keep the hounds from his door--that doesn't mean that they (the media, etc,) aren't going to play it for all they can get for as long as they can. The CMC is obviously moving as he has done in order to protect himself in order to preclude the criticism that would likely have come otherwise.

Dickg

[MillRatUSMC]

Captain John Warner might a vested interest in this matter. <br />
<br />
Here's his profile; <br />
U.S. Senator John Warner (R) <br />
John Warner was first elected Senator of Virginia in 1978. <br />
He is one of only four...

[Barndog]

Outstanding Ricardo!

Shows you what REAL MEN of Honor and Integrity are about.
I think the Senator has every right, if not a fundamental obligation to the Marine Corps in which he serves, to inquire of the CMC's records.

To bring his marriage to Liz Taylor into it, is nothing more than a cheap political maneuver. Media driven or otherwise, it clearly represents the politics of personal destruction, when there are no other facts to go upon. (SEE: 'ad hominem' attack - thats latin for you that don't know)

Besides, this was about the CMC was it not? Not about a Senator. Diversions don't work in my department. From Marines or otherwise.

Semper Fidelis

[firstsgtmike]

I believe General Hagee commented that he could not find the certificates for the unit awards in question.

I travelled light when I came here seven years ago, and left a lifetime of paperwork and other things behind. But if I remember correctly, I only had certificates for two or three personal awards.

Unit awards, Vietnamese awards, awards for breathing during a specific period of time were merely entries in the SRB. Supply would order them, and the First Sergeant or Company Gunny would come around passing out the ribbons and medals to everyone in the unit, like C-Rats.

I think they made a "to-do" about the first Good Conduct Medal, but after that, I was told by a Company Clerk that I was out of uniform and better buy a star, or another star, to put in it.

If you haven't figured me out by now, I had an attitude, and if they wanted me to wear something, the least they could do was give me the initial issue. I'd take care of replacements out of my clothing allowance.

No. I can't blame the General. It was breathing ribbons, not hero ribbons that he didn't have citations for.

And in Nam, the Pentagon desk jockeys would come over on R&R, just to rate the breathing ribbons. In D.C. they used to fight for the right to escort Senators and Congressmen who wanted a photo op in a combat zone to impress their voters. "Sign my chit, I was here, send me the ribbons."
----------------------------------------------------------------
General Krulak was coming to inspect. I was ordered to install an 8"x8" step so he could look out the window of specified watchtower.

I did. He did. I also suggested that he observe the view from another watchtower. (This one did not have the 8x8 installed) He never did figure out why he could not see out of THAT window.

"ME Sir? NO Sir. I was just trying to be helpful, Sir."

[Lock-n-Load]

If I hurt your feelings...what a shame...many opinions are stated in this forum, and when last I looked, the USA was still a free country with freedom of speech...FYI...I'm not a politico...I could care less who gets elected in Virginia...I don't vote within that state...but I do have a sense of humor...Gung-Ho Semper Fi, Mac LtG :chinese:

[Barndog]

You didn't hurt my feelings. If you were trying, you are going to have to do better than that.
I stand on facts, and facts alone. I care ALOT about the people who get elected in this country. Either here in Michigan, or elsewhere.

The fact remains, that until people stop responding to issues with soundbytes, and START responding with FACTS.....

It's gonna be the same old song and dance over & over & over again. Education is a choice. It doesn't just happen.

Be part of the solution, or continue to be part of the problem.

Semper FI

[Lock-n-Load]

You want FACTS....I believe Sec. Rumsfeld deals directly in ...FACTS...he reaffirmed his confidence in Gen. Hagee to continue...that's enough ...FACTS...for this Marine; plus, it should be good enough to be the...SOLUTION...to Warner's doubts too. Semper Fi, Mac LtG:chinese:

[Barndog]

Neither one of are in any way responsible my paychecks anymore.
I just want the truth. Why, all of a sudden a 'change of heart' bring about removing the three medals?
And, even more so, the man slated to be the next Commandant would feel the necessity to go to that level? (and pin something on he didn't earn or deserve) Or didn't know about it?

C'mon.

[Lock-n-Load]

If your latest question is for me...all I can help you out with...you better ask Sec of Defense Rumsfeld...he knows that answer and he acted accordingly....seems Warner and Rumsfeld don't confer with me on these matters...all I can base MY OPINION on is...I'm in agreement with Rumsfeld's decision...I voted for Pres. Bush, and I have unbounding faith and trust [I like]...in all the choices Bush made as to his Cabinet appointees....it's as simple as that. Gung-Ho LtG :chinese:

[Barndog]

That being said...........

I didn't. And so far, the record shows it economically, and policy wise. I could not concieve that in 2+ years (given 9/11) - this country would go so far backwards. Either fiscally, socially and now - blatent pandering to the rich.
Now, as far as cabinet appointee's - I guess if you are into appointing people indicted for Crimes, Lying to Congress, and so on..... (see Elliot Abrams, Adm Poindexter, Richard Perle, etc) - and thats fact. ( see Iran-Contra)

You got what the corporations paid for. And, that's my opinion.

Semper FI

Not what I voted for

[Lock-n-Load]

Hey Barndog....We are talking the Rumsfeld-Hagee-Warner flap...it's already been decided...Hagee remains at his Post..you just don't get it!!!...you can rant and rave all year long...Pres Bush is the President of the United States whether you like it or not...you sound like Al Gore ...A SORE LOSER...get a life....we live in an imperfect world...the issue at point is the Rumsfeld-Hagee-Warner flap [only]...you just don't get it!!!...LOL...LOL...LOL Sayonara, baby-san.... guys like you make my day...Semper Fi, Mac....LOL...LOL...LOL...LOL..........LtG:chinese:

[1981jarhead®]

Marines don't ****,, Marines don't moan,, real Marines Kick ass the go the F&^% Home. You wanna cry you wanna play, Next time it comes around vote differant on election day!!!!!

[Barndog]

Yeah i get it.

But, in case you didn't -
I don't take bait.

And, I didn't vote for Al Gore.

So, once again, you are incorrect on your assumption.

Pretty sad conduct from a Staff NCO in my Marine Corps I'll say.

Maybe, you need to get the life. I have one.

OHHHH RAH

[wrbones]

Play nice ladies. Facts and figures if you please. Personal insults aren't gonna fly.

[Barndog]

I stand corrected. I *am* out of line and pay grade.

I did NOT draw first blood either.

If I may interject further:
Correct me further if I am wrong Sergeant Bones:
My behavioral display is represenative of the content of my character, is it not?

Semper FI

[Lock-n-Load]

LOL.....LOL.....LOL.....LOL......LOL.....LOL