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10thzodiac
08-06-06, 07:58 AM
Sunday, June 18, 2006
Tribalism is the real enemy in Iraq
STEVEN PRESSFIELD
Forget the Quran. Forget the ayatollahs and the imams. If we want to understand the enemy we're fighting in Iraq, the magic word is tribe.
Islam is not our opponent in Baghdad or Fallujah. We delude ourselves if we believe the foe is a religion. The enemy is tribalism articulated in terms of religion.
For two years I've been researching a book about Alexander the Great's counterguerrilla campaign in Afghanistan, 330-327 B.C. What has struck me most powerfully is that that war is a dead ringer for the ones we're fighting today -- even though Alexander was pre-Christian and his enemies were pre-Islamic.
In other words, the clash of East and West is at bottom not about religion. It's about two different ways of being in the world. Those ways haven't changed in 2,300 years. They are polar antagonists, incompatible and irreconcilable.
The West is modern and rational; its constituent unit is the nation. The East is ancient and visceral; its constituent unit is the tribe.
The tribe is the most ancient form of social organization. It arose from the hunter-gatherer clans of prehistory. A tribe is small. It consists of personal, face-to-face relationships, often of blood. A tribe is cohesive. Its structure is hierarchical. It has a leader and a rigid set of norms and customs that define each individual's role. Like a hunting band, the tribe knows who's the top dog and knows how to follow orders. What makes Islam so powerful in the world today is that its all-embracing discipline and order overlay the tribal mindset so perfectly. Islam delivers the certainty and security that the tribe used to. It permits the tribal way to survive and thrive in a post-tribal and supertribal world.
Am I knocking tribalism? Not at all. In many ways I think people are happier in a tribal universe. Consider the appeal of post-apocalyptic movies such as "The Road Warrior" or "The Day After Tomorrow." Modern life is tough. Who can fault us if now and then we entertain the idea of going back to the simple life?
The people we're fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan live that life 24/7/365, and they've been living it for the past 10,000 years. They like it. It's who they are. They're not going to change.
How do you combat a tribal enemy?
Step one is to recognize that that enemy is tribal. We in the West may flatter ourselves that democracy is taking root in Iraq when we see news footage of blue-ink thumbs and beaming faces emerging from polls. What's really happening has nothing to do with democracy. What's happening is the tribal chief has passed the word and everybody is voting exactly as he told them to.
What is the nature of the tribe? What can sociology tell us about its attributes?
The tribe respects power.
Saddam Hussein understood this. So did Tito, Stalin, Hitler. So will the next strong man who ultimately stabilizes Iraq.
The tribe must have a chief. It demands a leader. With a top dog, every underdog knows his place. He feels secure. He can provide security for this family. The tribe needs a Tony Soprano. It needs a Godfather.
The United States blew it in Iraq the first week after occupying Baghdad. Capt. Nate Fick of the Recon Marines tells the story of that brief interlude when U.S. forces were still respected, just before the looting started. Fick went in that interval to the local headman in his area of responsibility in Baghdad; he asked what he needed. The chief replied, "Clean water, electricity and as many statues of George W. Bush as you can give us."
The tribe needs a boss. Alexander understood this. Unlike the United States, the Macedonians knew how to conquer a country. When Alexander took Babylon in 333 B.C., he let the people know he was the man. They accepted this. They welcomed it. Life could go on.
When we Americans declared in essence to the Iraqis, "Here, folks, you're free now; set up your own government," they looked at us as if we were crazy. The tribal mind doesn't want freedom; it wants security. Order. It wants a new boss. The Iraqis lost all respect for us then. They saw us as naive, as fools. They saw that we could be beaten.
The tribe is a warrior; its foundation is warrior pride.
The heart of every tribal male is that of a warrior. Even the most wretched youth in a Palestinian refugee camp sees himself as a knight of Islam. The Pathan code of nangwali prescribes three virtues -- nang, pride; badal, revenge; melmastia, hospitality. These guys are Apaches.
What the warrior craves before all else is respect. Respect from his own people, and, even more, from his enemies. When we of the West understand this, as Alexander did, we'll have taken the first step toward solving the unsolvable.
The tribe is the most primitive form of social organization. In the conditions under which the tribe evolved, survival was everything. Cohesion meant the difference between starving and eating. The tribe enforces conformity by every means possible -- wives, mothers and daughters add the whip hand to keep the warriors in line. Freedom is a luxury the tribe can't afford. The tribesman's priority is respect within the tribe, to belong, to be judged a man.
You can't sell freedom to tribesmen any more than you can sell democracy. He doesn't want it. It violates his code. It threatens everything he stands for.
I just read an article about Ariel Sharon (a tribal leader if there ever was one.) The interviewer was describing how, as Sharon crossed a certain stretch of Israeli real estate, he pointed out with great emotion the hills where the biblical character Abigail lived out her story. In other words, to the tribesman the land isn't for sale; it's been rendered sacred by the sagas of ancestors. The tribe will paint the stones red with its own blood before letting itself be evicted from the land.
Tribes deal in absolutes. Their standards of honor cannot be compromised. Crush the tribe in one century, it will rise again a thousand years from now. We're seeing this now in a Middle East where the Crusades happened yesterday. When the tribe negotiates, it is always a sham -- a stalling tactic meant to mitigate temporary weakness. Do we believe Iran is really "coming to the table"? As soon as the tribe regains power, it will abrogate every treaty and every pact.
The tribe has no honor except within its own sphere, deriving justice for its own people. Its code is Us versus Them. The outsider is a gentile, an infidel, a devil.
These are just a few of the characteristics of the tribal mind. Now: what to do about this?
You can't make deals with a tribal foe; they won't be honored. You can't buy them; they'll take your money and despise you. The tribe can't be reasoned with. Its mind is not rational, it's instinctive. The tribe is not modern but primitive. The tribe thinks from the stem of its brain, not the cortex. Its code is of warrior pride, not of Enlightenment reason.
To deal successfully with the tribe, a negotiator of the West must first grant it its pride and honor. The tribe's males must be addressed as warriors; its women must be treated with respect. The tribe must be left to its own land, to govern as it deems best.
If you want to get out of a tribal war, you must find a scenario by which the tribe can declare itself victorious. The tribal mind is canny; it knows when it's whipped. But its warrior pride is so fierce, it cannot admit this. The tribe has to be allowed its face.
It took Alexander three years, but he finally got a handle on the tribal mind. (Perhaps because so many of his own Macedonians were basically tribal.) Alexander produced peace by marrying the daughter of his most powerful enemy, the princess Roxane. The tribe understands such an act. This is respect. This is honor.
Alexander made the tribesmen his equals. He acknowledged their warrior honor. When he and his army marched out to their next conquest, Alexander took the bravest of his former enemies with him as his companions. They rode at his side in stations of honor; they dined at his shoulder in the royal pavilion. (Of course he also beat the living hell out of the Afghans for three years prior, and when he took off, he left a fifth of his army to garrison the place.)
In the end, unless we're ready to treat them the way we did Geronimo, the tribe is unbeatable. They're just too crazy. They're not like us. Tolerance and open-mindedness are not virtues to them; they're signs of weakness. The tribe is too rigid to bend, and it can't be negotiated with.
Perhaps in the end, our leaders, like Alexander, will figure some way to bring the tribal foe around. More likely in my opinion, they'll arrive at the same conclusion as did Lord Roberts, the legendary British general. Lord Roberts fought (and defeated militarily) tribesmen in two bloody wars in Afghanistan in the 19th century. His conclusion: Get out. Roberts' axiom was that the farther away British forces remained from the tribesmen, the more likely the tribesmen were to feel warmly toward them; the closer he got, the more they hated him and the more stubbornly and implacably they fought against him.

marinegreen
08-06-06, 11:56 AM
Every Marine should read this thread because it illustrates the gross incompetence of the Bush Administration.

They -couldn't- have been surprised by the insurgency. And in fact, everything that has happened in Iraq was predicted.

I think perpetual war suits the neo-conservatives that run Bush just fine.

They love getting our guys killed. American KIA/WIA's only make their position stronger when people offer knee-jerk support to the Administration policies.

Bush and Cheney are crimnals, if only based on their incompetence.

Walt



I have to somewhat disagree with ya skipper,Its not just Bushco and his Tribe,"Its the whole fuqing lot of em up on the hill !" Like I have stated in other threads,Power watches other powers back,oh sure they bit** and moan about one another but in all reality,they have got each others six. I actually likes 10thzod's article cuz its true chit,alot more peeps need to study there history alittle bity more.Maybe it will enlighten some and maybe some still wont get it.Just goes to show that more and more are turning into puppets. Our FOLKS WHO CONTROL THE "THINK TANK!" want total control over us.Now the next time when the dems get the house back,folks better hide some weapons cuz there going after them,some wont think it wont happen but look how Bush operates,Its my way and Fuq you attitude will roll right on dwn to the next admin,once these fuq'rs get our weapons,there gonna be lining us up for the dog collar or the microchip implant.A NEW WORLD ORDER is a brewing !!!

redneck13
08-06-06, 01:09 PM
Very good Zod. What a great piece of knowledge. Very well written. Even though it lacks a few things, which you have not addressed. Or maybe just one. That is; "When the Iraqi people voted, every "tribe" voted. The new Iraqi Gov't is made up of each tribe. Therefore, the US didn't impose upon them our "Democratic" ways and means, of only a "two party rule." The US recognizes the "tribe" mentality, as this is what is causing the biggest uproar there. One tribe isn't happy with another, thus, "civil war" is on the horizon. Now, is it that one tribe is jealous of another? Or are there "terrorists" in one or more tribe's, that are trying to gain total control? This is why the area has been beefed up with American troop's, to try and help the Iraqi tribes who are clashing, to find a way to solve their difference's other than violence. And which would you rather have, those tribes in our border's, or those tribes where they are? The reason I ask this is because, some of the different tribe's of all mid-eastern nation's have cells loyal to one, who are trying to put their action's to work in all parts of the world. Almost everyday, there are "tribal" terrorist who are lead by one "top dog" who is ultimately trying to regain "supreme" power, all over the world, arrested, either the tribe leader, or member's. Don't think for one minute that American's who are fighting don't understand this power struggle, in the Name of their Religion, which is totally against the real belief's of that Religion, thus, Terrorists, thus, "Radical's" i.e. Saddam Insane.

redneck13
08-06-06, 01:24 PM
Every Marine should read this thread because it illustrates the gross incompetence of the Bush Administration.

They -couldn't- have been surprised by the insurgency. And in fact, everything that has happened in Iraq was predicted.

I think perpetual war suits the neo-conservatives that run Bush just fine.

They love getting our guys killed. American KIA/WIA's only make their position stronger when people offer knee-jerk support to the Administration policies.

Bush and Cheney are crimnals, if only based on their incompetence.

WaltThis statement? Has to be one of the most "Ridiculous, ignorant, so far out in the Ozone" I've ever heard. "Insurgency?" You mean, "Terrorists?" "Predicted, by whom?, YOU?" "The love of getting our guys killed?" You're out of your gord, this is a disgrace, not only to our Marine's, but to the families, and to the Majority of American People, it edges words of "treason, slander, and you call yourself a Marine?" "YOu should be ashamed." "Knee-jerk support?" Explain that? "Criminal's?" I thought you said, "they are criminal's, now you're saying if only base on their incompetence?" What criminal law would you be referring to? You served in the Marine Corps as an Officer? Boy, I'll tell you, you'd be put in jail if you had the balls to say something like this when you were in. It's not even close to the truth, in any shape, form, fashion. Unbelieveable, how you dare expend on this site the views of most of the Terrorist's we're fighting. If you don't like America? Go somewhere else. You should be thankful that we've only been hit hard twice. You are putting down the people who are giving you the very right to express your insidious theories, rhetoric, "MARINE'S." Fighting Terrorism, so you won't get blown up by some sleeping cell of these Radical Religious Fundamentalist Idiot's. You're sick. Now the subject at hand. Tribal "mentality", non-understanding by American's. I have already posted my reply, and thoughts, and you might want to stick to the subject instead of spreading all this vermon hate, garbage.

jinelson
08-06-06, 01:50 PM
Right on Wind Im glad Im not alone. I almost made a "With all due respect sir" comment then mulled it over and decided that the comment and rank were not worthy of a reply.

redneck13
08-06-06, 03:05 PM
It blows my mind how an Officer of Marine's could have such a distorted view of the World, America, and I almost did the same thing as you were thinking. But, I can't stand a Marine knocking "America" no matter who's in office, and those who are fighting for his "sick" thinking, U.S. MARINE'S!! SF J......I will not reply anymore to this "sickness." And as far as I'm concerned, well, enuf said. Thanks for the back, J....
Right on Wind Im glad Im not alone. I almost made a "With all due respect sir" comment then mulled it over and decided that the comment and rank were not worthy of a reply.

10thzodiac
08-06-06, 04:45 PM
It blows my mind how an Officer of Marine's could have such a distorted view of the World, America, and I almost did the same thing as you were thinking. But, I can't stand a Marine knocking "America" no matter who's in office, and those who are fighting for his "sick" thinking, U.S. MARINE'S!! SF J......I will not reply anymore to this "sickness." And as far as I'm concerned, well, enuf said. Thanks for the back, J....


That's like saying, "My Mother Drunk or Sober!"