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fathom
06-28-06, 05:01 PM
I have two friends in the Marine Corp right now. One is well on his way to becoming an officer and the other plans on finishing college but does not plan on becoming an officer. These guys are great friends. They've been friends for years. They only time they speak of the fraternization rule is when one jokes about eventually having to salute the other. How is this rule enforced. If I had them both over for lets say a bbq one of them a 2nd Lt. and the other a Sgt. would they still be able to hold the same demeanor with each other as they do now?

Camper51
06-28-06, 05:10 PM
Yes they can still be friends at your BBQ, however in a military context you would not find them going out drinking and partying together. However they could conceivably be invited over to each others quarters on occasion for social visits, like the occasional dinner gathering. Most likely they would not be serving in the same unit as that might cause problems (favoritism, etc...)

Echo_Four_Bravo
06-28-06, 11:41 PM
At the end of my enlistment a good friend of mine showed up on base wearing bars. We would speak to one another from time to time when we saw one another on base and spent a couple of holidays together right before I got out. The only time someone said anything, it became a nonissue when we explained that we had gone to school with one another from sixth grade through sophomore year of college when I enlisted.

Marine84
06-29-06, 07:45 AM
And it doesn't only happen between you guys either.................. :) :angel:

Phantom Blooper
06-29-06, 01:58 PM
When Does Friendship Become a Crime? <br />
<br />
<br />
Fraternization is a violation of the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ). It falls under a subparagraph of Article 134, and is defined by the Manual...

fathom
07-03-06, 01:02 AM
Thanks

300
06-04-07, 06:41 PM
So basically, an NCO and date a Troop, as long as theirs no problems, correct?

Zulu 36
06-04-07, 06:48 PM
So basically, an NCO and date a Troop, as long as theirs no problems, correct?

Troop is an Army term. You mean a non-rate or a junior Marine.

Dating ALWAYS causes problems, sooner or later.

300
06-04-07, 06:52 PM
Troop is an Army term. You mean a non-rate or a junior Marine.

Dating ALWAYS causes problems, sooner or later. Excuse my insult. But according to fratenization, there would be no problem?

Zulu 36
06-04-07, 07:08 PM
My first CO in the Air Guard refused to attend the Officer's Club. He preferred to do his drinking with the NCOs at our club. He also refused to pay his O'Club dues (required). He was a damned good...

Sgt D
06-04-07, 07:50 PM
[quote=Zulu 36]Troop is an Army term. You mean a non-rate or a junior Marine.

or boot.

chili77bowl
06-05-07, 10:57 PM
yeah, i agree with Sgt D...I like boot myself...or F***Tard...

bsktbll2006
02-13-09, 08:24 AM
so if a pfc and a pfc are friends, then one gets CPL and the other stays a PFC. is that Fraternization if you knew eachother before achieving the rank?

giveen
02-13-09, 08:32 AM
Wow, you skipped a rank there ;) Whatever happened to that Pfc getting LCpl?

I haved several friends who were LCpl's when I made Cpl. They and I had to learn the balance of respecting the fact that we are always Marines, even out of uniform, that I do get that respect as an NCO ....BUT I also needed to remember these are my friends and I should treat them as such.

My friends knew when I was just being friends and when I was acting as their NCO.

bsktbll2006
02-13-09, 08:38 AM
ok i know all of that. i want to know if in the order is it still fraternization. so is it still considered fraternization if you hang out?

KawiGunny
02-13-09, 08:41 AM
Wow, you skipped a rank there ;) Whatever happened to that Pfc getting LCpl?

I haved several friends who were LCpl's when I made Cpl. They and I had to learn the balance of respecting the fact that we are always Marines, even out of uniform, that I do get that respect as an NCO ....BUT I also needed to remember these are my friends and I should treat them as such.

My friends knew when I was just being friends and when I was acting as their NCO.

Very true. I have had several friends throughout the years that were junior and senior to me. We hung out from time to time and had a few beers and told lies. No harm no foul. We knew where we stood at work and showed the respect. Even if it was an officer or a junior Marine.

giveen
02-13-09, 08:57 AM
ok i know all of that. i want to know if in the order is it still fraternization. so is it still considered fraternization if you hang out?
It depends on time and place and the situation. Its kinda hard to cover it.

As an NCO, I would just go with what I felt best, for example, if I knew that only LCpl's and below were only going to be at a party, I wouldnt go.

But if I knew a lot of NCO's were going to be there as well, then I would go.

0231Marine
02-13-09, 08:58 AM
ok i know all of that. i want to know if in the order is it still fraternization. so is it still considered fraternization if you hang out?

No!

Fraternization is not designed to keep PFC's from hanging out with Cpl's. In fact, it's a very good thing in my opinion when a Cpl hangs out with his Marines during their off time because it gives him more of an opportunity to mentor his junior Marines.

Fraternization would be more like a PFC hanging out with a Gunny or a SSgt hanging out with his Captain. You'll understand if and when you become a Marine. Non rates and NCO's are ok and usually senior NCO's and SSgt's are alright. Any SNCO's are cool with eachother and then officers kick it with their fellow officer types.

It's not as convoluted once you earn the title.

lthunder
02-13-09, 09:10 AM
Fraternization means not taking a private/boot to drink in the barracks, illiciting regulations outside of the barracks or conveying vital training mission to the guy who is unknownst.

Wyoming
02-13-09, 09:47 AM
Fraternization means not taking a private/boot to drink in the barracks, illiciting regulations outside of the barracks or conveying vital training mission to the guy who is unknownst.

:confused:

0231Marine
02-13-09, 11:24 AM
Fraternization means not taking a private/boot to drink in the barracks.

Good point!


illiciting regulations outside of the barracks or conveying vital training mission to the guy who is unknownst.

What?

Are you saying that you shouldn't keep those below you informed of vital training information?

Could you also elaborate on what you mean by illiciting regulations? I'm kind of foggy on what you mean by that.

SgtUSMC1985
06-07-10, 06:33 PM
Good morning, I have a question that I would like to get an honest oppionion on. I am currently a Sergeant living in Okinawa, I have recently started talking to a Lance Corporal, who is 3 years younger than me. We have talked about dating but do not want to cause any problems. Her Sgt called her out in front of a formation and was asking about the definition of Fraternzation and proceeded to contradict himself by saying usualy its either two ranks up or two ranks down (last time I checked E5 minus E3 is 2 ranks). Anyways, we do not work in the same shop, we dont even work with in 5 miles of each other. We have two completly different MOS's and do not even ever cross paths when it comes to work. I have no effect on her pros/cons, or any say in anything involving her leadership. When I am in uniform, she still refers to me as a Sergeant, and I do the same. She respects me and there is no physical contact while in uniform, nor a show of partialiality. I am just looking for some peoples take on this situation. If you look at the defintions of fraternzation they are:

1) Is there a compromise of the chain of command? ( I donít even know what warehouse she works in)
(2) Is there an appearance of partiality? (REMEMBER: when dealing with the subject of fraternization, perceptions are as deadly as reality). (Donít work anywhere even close to her building)
(3) Is there the potential for good order, discipline, morale, or authority to be undermined? (once again, not even close to where she works, or anything)

FattyTheFerret
06-07-10, 07:01 PM
Most of my friends in the military are officers, either Army or Air Force, one Marine. I've known all of them for nearly ten years, I even dated one of them after she was commissioned and had another crashing at my place for a month when he PCSed. To this day when we hang out absolutely nothing is different except for some of the jokes we tell about the light/dark side but even then the service rarely comes into our conversations.

Lisa 23
06-07-10, 07:08 PM
SgtUSMC1985, there's already a thread on Fraternization in Chesty's Hooch.

SgtUSMC1985
06-07-10, 08:25 PM
Thank you, I took the post over there, I started a new one because the other Frat post has taken a crazy turn and they started talking about sex, and it is not respectable, nor does it answer my question.

crazymjb
06-07-10, 09:03 PM
In my experience it does not matter who your friends are when your not on the job, as long as you can still respect the rank when it counts. But I am in an all male unit.

Having a girlfriend who is a female Marine in a mixed gender unit I can "fraternization" does create problems among other Marines in her unit.

Mike