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kentmitchell
06-20-06, 01:35 PM
There are some things that really bother me about the murder of those two soldiers over the weekend.
From what I've read:
1. They were guarding a checkpoint, which makes me assume they were MPs. The took some fire and all but two or three took off after the people who did the shooting, leaving two guys hanging out to dry.
Someone's head better roll for letting that happen.

2. Why did those guys give up. If they were Marines they'd still be dead but the terrorists would have bled a lot, too. In my day we were trained to fight to the death. Has that changed?

3. Bush has gotten off track. He's been preaching that we're trying to make Iraq safe for Democracy. WE don't have a democracy. Why would we want to inflict it on anyone else. We have a Republic which protects us from being a Democracy. Benjamin Franklin described a Democracy as two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner.
We went to Iraq partly because of rumors of weapons of mass destruction, and there were those kinds of weapons there in the form of poison gas, biological material and possibly nuclear weapons.
The other reason we're there is because al-Qaida is there, and that's a fact. The new al-Qaida leader in Iraq claims credit for killing the soldiers. Said he did it himself.
THAT is the reason we're there. Not for Democracy.
C'mon Mr. President, you've let 'em sidetrack you. Get back on course. You're right and those of us who know better are behind you. We're in a war, we're not spreading Democracy.

Rod Spinks
06-20-06, 05:49 PM
My thoughts and prayers go out to those two poor Army lad's and their families.As a former Royal Marine who served in 45 Commando RM in the Yemen in 64/65 but served 11 yrs as a Royal Marine from 1957/68 I say I think it's all about OIL!! and let's get all the Lad's out of that God forsaken hole ASAP.our Prime Minister Tony Blair seems to be up Bushe's a--- a mile but thats politions for you.They NEVER have to fight.
Regards
Aye
Rod.

Mike McIntyre
06-20-06, 06:01 PM
I do not know if this is a rumor but if it is true I hope we KILL every MAN, WOMAN, & CHILD that even looks like a combatant. These brave Americans had their eyes cut out; their genitals cut off and stuffed in their mouths, and beheaded ALL while their hearts were still beating. God, please say this is not so. WE are not spreading democracy WE ARE AT WAR!

kentmitchell
06-20-06, 06:15 PM
Rod,
I'm not happy with the way some things are being handled over there, but remember one thing--the guys who did this are al-quaida. We're looking for every one of them to kill. They're the *******s who took down the World Trade Center and killed 3000 Americans. We've got them over there where they're in our sights. Kill 'em all, let God sort them out!!!!!!!

junker316
06-20-06, 06:27 PM
To all this is something that isn't just offencive in nature but in retaliation to the US for killing thier leader. It didn't matter so much that minutes before that the post came under attack but that it was planned out that if there was any-one left behind that another ambush would happen. I don't see any Liberals or Left wingers or even extremists of any type parading around like a peacock in defence of these two American Soldiers. These two young men didn't deserve to die while under surrender, if that is what they did, or to be tortured and mutilated and left to rot in the desert sun. We are to create an atmosphere of well being for thier POWs yet they can do to ours what they wish. When some " innocent " is killed under combat conditions these rebel rousers jump out of the wood work to create the ANTI- EVEYTHING agenda. Yet when Two of Americas fighting forces are tortured and slain while under the enemies rule no-one jumps out of anywhere to suggest that maybe there is a reason for collateral damage. No-one comes to the aid of the America families to comfort them and help them throughout the time of loss of a loved military member but instead wish to protest against BUSH while a service member is being placed in the final resting place. The Code Of Conduct , being what it is, is something I am sure that these young men held firmly to. The enemy doesn't acknowledge the Geneva Convention nor do they accept surrender as a means of " Well being " and Fair Treatment of POWs. I feel really Mornful for the families left behind and the Soldiers for facing death the way they must have. We fight an enemy that holds nothing higher than religion and it's purposes for them, to include human life or the lives of their own people, and as military members who have been or are now deployed to these areas we must fight blindfolded and our hands tied around our backs vor fear of the " CNN " issues that we may face for doing our job.

It makes me sick to my stomach to know that here in America we have " Americans " more willing to help the enemy, to rally for illegal immigration, to allow higher gas prices ( price gouging ), and support anti American causes. Than we have Rallies for America Justice against an enemy that is willing to kill for religious purposes and not be tried for thier unjust acts against Americans and other nationals across the globe. We are threatened daily by these extremists and thousands die by their handy work and yet the marches for their rights against us being there continue on our soil. I was raised to believe that America is a proud and up-standing nation worth defending at the price of my life if need be. What happened to America????? The American way of life???? The reasons our fore-fathers fought and died for??? The reasons we fight and die today???? Maybe I let my emotions run a little bit but I wish for all to know that my heart and prayers go out to every militray member that has served, is serving, and will serve in the future that all return home. To a place worth it's wieght in American Lives that I used to know. The same reasons I joined and served proudly for so many years. America is worth saving.

marinegreen
06-20-06, 06:31 PM
This pi**es me off,why do they not have these troops at these check points loaded for bear, unless things have changed these young PFC's more then likely only had there m-16's, these are check points,they should have a 50 cal. gernades,laws to support them,you dont know what will be coming your way. How long were these 2 in country ? The rumor mill has it that there back up arrived 15 mins later,quite along time when these young men were screaming over there radio's we need HELP.Our brass knew there would be retaliations after that fuq zawqari was taken out.If you cant come up with a better plan for our guards at these check points then atleast supply these yung-ens with a capsule of cyanide to pop in there mouths, I'd rather do myself in then to watch as a fellow soilder has his balls ripped out,eyes gouged out and his throat slit or beheaded and then knowing I would be next,why give these sand maggots the glory of killing these young inexperienced troops.Bush should at least make a personnel visit to there familys and attend there funerals.REST IN PEACE SOILDERS,you did what you were asked to do with very lil back up.Rumsfeld should go walk the post, he's the one that said we dont need more troops over there cuz that would make us the occupiers. <<<<<FUQ HIM >>>>>

junker316
06-20-06, 06:59 PM
Since I came back from Iraq in 2005 I will explain about the check poines after I return from a wlak with the fam..

junker316
06-20-06, 08:00 PM
While I was in Iraq the Army was sending Soldiers and National Gaurdsmen in monthly. The Areas that the Marine Occupied were turned over to the Army in alot of cases. The Check points were mostly in " HIGH " danger zones and congestive areas. Like Clover Leaf Highways and along the patrol routes. Of course the lucky Marines had the front or back gates of the Camps. Those not so lucky were sent to the, what we called, " the open range ". When the Army took over in the areas that the Marines had the Army didn't patrol the same areas and left itself open for attack on two to three sides. Marines did a 360 patrol where as the Army did a 90 to 180 patrol. Thus leaving it's check points open to attack as well. In most cases that average Soldier on a check point did not even have a " combat " load of ammo and when the Marines left I don't believe that the Army even had a manned M-240 or 50 cal at many of the check points that they took over. The Marine Corps check points had various weapons to defend ourselves with while the Amry check points had very little other than the M-16 and occassionally a M-203. The patroling areas were reduced due to fear of an open attack by the insurgents by the Army while the Corps contiued to patrol 360 in our areas. The attitude of the Army was very differnet than when I was in the Army from 1988-1992. It was almost as if they expected to fill every body bag they had with tem with one of their own. While the Marine Corps was ready to die if need be but a stronger willingness to live and return home. The Soldiers that I came into contact with acted like they were " back on the block " and payed little attention to detail. The walked around causually and in most times without thier gear even near them. The Army Command didn't think it was important to continue the same patrol routes as the Marine Corps routes but they did think it was important to man cerntain check points at all times even through the patrols wouldn't be near the CP for hours at a time. The only time any Soldier would see a military vehicle while manning a CP on the range was when thier relief was coming or chow. I remember Soldiers telling me of how they would play cards or a gameboy or even listen to music on a CD Player to pss the time away. I took this as they weren't concerned about what was happening around them because of the distraction they created for themselves. I'm not saying that this is what happened on this occasion. The 101st Airborne is known for it's fighting capablities and it's hardness. But then again that was also years ago when I tried out for the 101st and broke my leg on a jump. The training was some of the roughest I had in my life and at that time it meant everything to be Airborne qualified.

But as it is The Army Command has allowed itself to be centered on a weak defensive strategy and a half assed offense while in country. I Blame the Army Commanders for failing these two Soldiers and the one that died in the Hummer. From a witness stand point, of which I don't talk much about to any-one, The Army Command in Theater has thier heads in thier tird point of contact and are sacrificing the lives of thier men and women lives because of **** poor planning. They would rather be politically bound for thier own personel glory than to properly protect and patrol as they should be doing.

I have also been told, and was present within ear shot of Army and Marine officers, that the Army Command in Theater has left most of the " patroling " up to the Company Commanders of the units and not enforcing the check points with the proper equipment. I watched as IEDs killed Soldiers because they didn't know what to look for. They didn't watch for wires or would pick up something for a sovenier to take home. I watched as Soldiers looked skyward during Mortar and rocket attacks like they were going to see them coming and know which way to run. I seen Marines and Soldiers alike get surprised by the enemy but the reactions from each were totally different. The Marines went for cover while the Soldier looked confused as to what to do next. I am not saying that all Soldiers had these problems but alot of them did. Marines were living minute to minute and second to second but the Soldiers were living day to day and week to week. I don't think that the Army check points are now or were then prepared for such an enemy as they are facing in Iraq or Afghanistan. As I stated before My heart and prayers go out to those that served, are now serving, and will be serving in the future that they return home.

Even when I went to Kuwait for the redeployment back to the USA the Soldiers, Nation Gaurdsmen, and Reservists there thought they were on vacation until they looked at those coming out of the Battle Ground. Severe Lack of training was what I noticed while in Kuwait and I am sure that it went into Iraq as well with the US Army.

garryh123
06-20-06, 08:24 PM
War for oil......That's funny...Did we free Kuwait for their oil fields? Funny, we don't seem to control those. We totally control iraqs oil fields so of course prices have decreased dramatically...LOL...libs make me laugh.



My thoughts and prayers go out to those two poor Army lad's and their families.As a former Royal Marine who served in 45 Commando RM in the Yemen in 64/65 but served 11 yrs as a Royal Marine from 1957/68 I say I think it's all about OIL!! and let's get all the Lad's out of that God forsaken hole ASAP.our Prime Minister Tony Blair seems to be up Bushe's a--- a mile but thats politions for you.They NEVER have to fight.
Regards
Aye
Rod.

mrbsox
06-20-06, 08:50 PM
I do not know if this is a rumor but if it is true I hope we KILL every MAN, WOMAN, & CHILD that even looks like a combatant. These brave Americans had their eyes cut out; their genitals cut off and stuffed in their mouths, and beheaded ALL while their hearts were still beating. God, please say this is not so. WE are not spreading democracy WE ARE AT WAR!

First things first, lets ALL be careful of speculation, spreading scuttle butt, and jumping to conclusions from a few facts and lots of hear say.

As with all of you, my heart and prayers go out to these families. As well, to their buddies in arms. We don't need a 'rouge spear' group going for retribution. This IS another chance for us to show that we are above the brutality that the 'al-quida' (?sp) life offers these people.

I am disturbed that reports say the bodies are coming back to teh states for DNA testing. That suggests that the bodies are unidentifiable in the field, BUT NOTHING MORE.

While the AMERICAN in me is seething at the edges, the MARINE :evilgrin: is saying access the situation. Often, discretion is the better part of valor. Can we make good of this tragedy ?? Gain the momentum in winning the people. After all, THEY are the key to winning this war. Until the common people unite against the barbarism, there will be no 'win/win' situation.

Terry

marinegreen
06-20-06, 09:26 PM
First things first, lets ALL be careful of speculation, spreading scuttle butt, and jumping to conclusions from a few facts and lots of hear say.

As with all of you, my heart and prayers go out to these families. As well, to their buddies in arms. We don't need a 'rouge spear' group going for retribution. This IS another chance for us to show that we are above the brutality that the 'al-quida' (?sp) life offers these people.

I am disturbed that reports say the bodies are coming back to teh states for DNA testing. That suggests that the bodies are unidentifiable in the field, BUT NOTHING MORE.

While the AMERICAN in me is seething at the edges, the MARINE :evilgrin: is saying access the situation. Often, discretion is the better part of valor. Can we make good of this tragedy ?? Gain the momentum in winning the people. After all, THEY are the key to winning this war. Until the common people unite against the barbarism, there will be no 'win/win' situation.

Terry


I have to disagree Terry, I'm sic and tired of us having to play by the geneva convention when these radical we are trying to destroy are using our captured soilders for voodoo dolls, a stick here,a slice there,a poke there.OK we've been there 4 + yrs and it doesnt seem to me that we are winning over that many people, if thats the case wheres that fuqing binladen and granted we got em but it took long enough to kill zawqari. hOW COME WE HAVE TO BE THE ONES TO KILL EM NICELY, War is not pretty and whats the difference if we blow em up into tiny pieces or use them for voodoo dolls.We dont kill our own women and children like they do and I wouldnt forsee it ever happening if war was on our own soil.Kinda like if you challenge me to a fight,I'm not gonna hurt you nicely, I'm gonna make that person regret challenging me by what ever mean nesscesary. Those who read this can call me what you want or any vile names you want:mad: but I know where I stand with this political war. I'm pi**ed knowing this young men were put at a check point not loaded for bear,fuq the next thing we'll read is where our troops couldnt defend themselves, "THEY RAN OUT OF ROCKS TO THROW"

booksbenji
06-20-06, 10:08 PM
I gotta bury A Soldier in TEXAS in the next wk or so. I spents 2 yrs, 4 months and 16 days too long in the Paddies, poop has not changed too much, different weapons, same tactics (maybe ?), Gotts a son over their (2nd Tour), something tells me (like the 4 Marines snipers) it was a set up. GOOKS all over again. You can't tell me any different, the poop has been upgraded. END OF STORY.

books, BTDT 2 many times, luv y'all

http://www.thesquadbay.com/forum2/Smileys/default/handsalute.png

RevMike
06-20-06, 10:22 PM
We need the same outrage of our media over the beheading of our troops who were captured, that is given to the silly claims of the terrorists in Guantonomo.
The lesser claims of that abuse do not compare to this kind of barbaric activity.
America should be outraged as a nation and speak out.

marinegreen
06-20-06, 10:43 PM
We need the same outrage of our media over the beheading of our troops who were captured, that is given to the silly claims of the terrorists in Guantonomo.
The lesser claims of that abuse do not compare to this kind of barbaric activity.
America should be outraged as a nation and speak out.



Hey Rev,
The govt is trying to turn us into bleeding hearts and some have, Its Oh we feel sorry for these soilders but lets not do the same to them, we're sorry you have to have a closed casket.Sorry Rev, but some of these peeps make me wanna puke. SF

jennifer
06-20-06, 11:12 PM
ERRRRRRRRRRRR!!! :devious:

greensideout
06-20-06, 11:34 PM
But as it is The Army Command has allowed itself to be centered on a weak defensive strategy and a half assed offense while in country.

You nailed it on the head!

clemdog
06-21-06, 12:41 AM
The only thing the terrorist respect is terror. So let's give them some terror.

Let's paint the streets red with their blood!
Let's grease the tracks of our tanks with their guts!

Let's stop screwing around with these people!:flag:

horselady
06-21-06, 11:39 AM
We need the same outrage of our media over the beheading of our troops who were captured, that is given to the silly claims of the terrorists in Guantonomo.
The lesser claims of that abuse do not compare to this kind of barbaric activity.
America should be outraged as a nation and speak out.

You want outrage? How about showing some graphic photos of how
badly they mutilated these boys, decapitations and eye-gougings,
genitals etc., and anything else that would turn the stomachs of these
America-haters. Since they can't be recognized anyway, let
the public and the media see exactly what the meaning of torture
is in the Islamic world. I know this would be awful for the families but it is necessary to do something to shock these media scum and liberal traitors out of their fantasyland of what are real Geneva convention abuses. I'd plaster these photos on the front page of every newspaper and political website in America. For starters.

http://bestsmileys.com/angry1/5.gif

ggyoung
06-21-06, 12:13 PM
This seems to be a part of war. The VC did the same to us as alquaida is doing to us now. It happens in every war. And yet we seem to never to do anything about it. When our Marines seem to get in trouble for a song that one made up we are in DEEP ****>

MOUNTAINWILLIAM
06-21-06, 01:41 PM
THIS IS WHAT COMES OF LETTING A PACK OF SELF CENTERED LAWYERS RUN A WAR. Let's see now, they started with Korea, revved it up in SE Asia, played around with Somalia and are now screwing up in the middle east.

The hypocracy is, they pay lip service by running around saying "we support our troops (which is echoed by all of the socalled celebritys)," while all the while restraing the military with things such as, Rules of Engagement. It might come as a shock to some that the Assyrians, Babylonians, Philistines, Persians, etc. do not have rules of engagement restraining them. Incidents such as happened to these troops are SOP for the opposition.

Democracy iin any country in the middle east be damned, Sh_ _! or get off the pot.

junker316
06-21-06, 03:10 PM
This War whether in Iraq or Afghanistan is a gentlemen's war for our Government. They think that we shoud not shoot unless assaulted. Not to strike unless struck first. Maybe they forgot the lives of 9/11, the lives being payed for by the grieving loved ones left behind, or the life lost while doing the duty he/she was trained to do. It really doesn't matter what hey think because none of them are putting thier lives on the line day after day and minute after F%$#&^@ minute. They go home to a hot supper at the end of the day and dream of the voters electing them as the next great leader. Our Military goes out and fights for these scum F---ers to be able to relax at home. They choose what days to go to " work ", which has become a debate on it's own, while we as Service members serve our Country in any land at any time. Our Government makes Sacrifices. So far it has sacrificed the Pledge of Allegence, The Public display of the " Ten Commandants " or any other form of " religious " item " in public places, our very rght to keep illegals out of our nation unless they go through the process correctly, and even the wasted tax dollars for thier own parades of glory. Many of us on this Site have sacrificed way more than any politian can ever of. Yet many of us returned from one enemy to return home to face another enemy. That GOD for the Vets before my time. Thank GOD for all the service and stabilizing they have caused for the Vets of today and the Vets of tomorrow.

Our Government says it is leading the USA into the future. But as I see it they are leading us into failure. Every great nation since the dawn of time has crumpled because of political coruption. Is ours next????

redneck13
06-21-06, 04:11 PM
:mad: :evilgrin: :flag: I've slap run out of things to say about this entire mess over there. I do have very tearful sympathy to their families. I wish somebody would post how we could get their family names, and if they have e-mail, or an address, so we could send them our feelings of sorrow. And I don't care if they're Army or Boot's, they are our fighting men, and if we don't stop this "diplomatic Killing" as in, "Hold it, I have to see if I am allowed to shoot you or not, then you're dead."
there will be more of this sheet. What in the Sam Hill was their superior's thinking? For Pete Sakes, they might as well just left them without any weapons. I don't want get ahead of anything that might happen. But, my thinking is this......"WE HAVE TO PLAY BY THE RULES." OKAY, WE WILL, BUT IF YOU GET IN MY Way, YOU'RE THREATENING MY LIFE, "boom" NOW LET'S GET 'EM." "I'VE SAID THIS BEFORE OVER AND OVER, "LET THE MARINES, SOLDIER'S, NAVY, AIR FORCE, NAT'L GUARD EVERY COMMANDER, LET THEM DO THEIR DAMN JOB'S AND GET RUMMY DUMMIE OUT OF TOWN." WE CAN'T FIGHT A WAR WITH SOME JACKASS CIVILIAN RUNNING THINGS." "WAKE UP BUSH!!" I GUESS I DIDN'T RUN OUT OF THINGS TO SAY...CUZ, IT FLAT PEEZ'S ME OFF." AND TO LET THESE CREEPS DO THIS, HELL NO DON'T KILL THEM, THEY SHOULD BE HANGED IN PUBLIC. IF WE CAN CATCH THEM. I JUST CAN'T FATHOM WHY BIN LADIN AIN'T BEEN CAUGHT? I'M GOING TO SHUT UP NOW, OR I'LL GET ALL LATHERED UP. My heart, prayer's go to them their families, Pray for their souls. SF

Shadowman777
06-21-06, 06:26 PM
While I was in Iraq ....

That was an excellent assessment Junker.

sgt tony
06-21-06, 09:56 PM
:flag: Well it is a sad thing that this has happened to any of our troops. If they were not armed with what they should have had then we need to have the Commanders stand the watches these young mem did and leave him and 2 others to see how it feel. That the problem with the officers now days they stay way back and not up with there men.
I am here to supoort the troops not the politics, right or wrong they are there and we all should suck it up and help them all.:iwo:

Arlene Horton
06-21-06, 10:30 PM
:mad: I just don't understand how the "hotshots" in D.C., sitting in their air-conditioned offices with "interns" running to satisfy their every need can have the nerve to hold to "Rules of Engagement". What makes these a###-##%%&&** "think" that those ignorant animals are going to follow any kind of restriction of what they want to do to anyone they capture? Then to read that they are subjecting our Marines & soldiers to possible Courts Martial even the possibility of execution for "murdering" those creatures is just mind boggling to me. They sent our military to Iraq to bring a democratic government to that ignorant bunch of********. They have no shame and no sense of decency towards each other, treat their women like chattel and say they do it "for Allah". :sick: :no:

Rod Spinks
06-22-06, 04:30 AM
:thumbup: Hi Arlene couldn't agree more I am a former Brit Royal Marine served from 1957/68 and hate political people as they are a load of ###### ours are as bad as the US one's and out top dog Tony Blair is up G Bush's a### a mile and also hasn't a clue.My heart go's out to ALL the troops out there in Iraq & Afganistan,there is no solution to those people we should remove all troops ASAP and let them get on with it as they do not appreicate what our boy's are doing for them!!
Take care Arlene
Regards
Aye
Rod.
Just been to watch a passing out parade of 22, 18 yr old Marines they will be attached next week to Royal Marines Commando Units around the Globe and as I watched proudly at them receiving their Green Berets my thought went to when I was 17 and was on active service in Cyprus and my Mate Dave Witham aged 17 was killed only a week after we went there,makes you think Eh!! God be with them one and all.

Arlene Horton
06-22-06, 03:40 PM
From your dates of service, Rod, you must be close to my age. That's probably why we think so much alike :) . My prayers are always with all those lovely young men & women who go into these miserable battle zones, not knowing if they will ever return to their families. Happy to meet you Rod.
Take care....Semper Fi....Arlene

OLE SARG
06-22-06, 07:38 PM
It gripes my arse that the Marine Corps is pushing the "Sensitivity Training". YOU KNOW WHAT THEY CAN DO WITH THEIR SENSITIVITY TRAINING - STICK IT UP THEIR POOP CHUTE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We need to get down on the terrorists' level and play dirty just like they do!!!!!!!!!!! Shoot, cut, slice, and dice!!!!!

SEMPER FI,

Shadowman777
06-22-06, 07:57 PM
It gripes my arse that the Marine Corps is pushing the "Sensitivity Training". YOU KNOW WHAT THEY CAN DO WITH THEIR SENSITIVITY TRAINING - STICK IT UP THEIR POOP CHUTE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We need to get down on the terrorists' level and play dirty just like they do!!!!!!!!!!! Shoot, cut, slice, and dice!!!!!SEMPER FI,

God I love this guy ! LOL!

If I ever make it out to Kansas City, I'd like to shake your hand Sarge!

Arlene Horton
06-22-06, 08:38 PM
:beer:
God I love this guy ! LOL!

If I ever make it out to Kansas City, I'd like to shake your hand Sarge!:beer: If you ever make it to Milwaukee, I'd like to buy you a few beers or whatever!! A man after my own heart!

OLE SARG
06-22-06, 08:51 PM
Steve and Arlene,
You guys warm the cockles of my heart - if either of you EVER get to KC, I'll buy the brews!!!!!!

SEMPER FI,

Arlene Horton
06-22-06, 08:55 PM
You're on! Semper Fi

RevMike
06-22-06, 09:00 PM
Ol Sarge, just wondering............ are you a BOR premium member? Just wondering?

Rev. Mike

marinemom58
06-22-06, 09:37 PM
There are some things that really bother me about the murder of those two soldiers over the weekend.
From what I've read:
1. They were guarding a checkpoint, which makes me assume they were MPs. The took some fire and all but two or three took off after the people who did the shooting, leaving two guys hanging out to dry.
Someone's head better roll for letting that happen.

2. Why did those guys give up. If they were Marines they'd still be dead but the terrorists would have bled a lot, too. In my day we were trained to fight to the death. Has that changed?

3. Bush has gotten off track. He's been preaching that we're trying to make Iraq safe for Democracy. WE don't have a democracy. Why would we want to inflict it on anyone else. We have a Republic which protects us from being a Democracy. Benjamin Franklin described a Democracy as two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner.
We went to Iraq partly because of rumors of weapons of mass destruction, and there were those kinds of weapons there in the form of poison gas, biological material and possibly nuclear weapons.
The other reason we're there is because al-Qaida is there, and that's a fact. The new al-Qaida leader in Iraq claims credit for killing the soldiers. Said he did it himself.
THAT is the reason we're there. Not for Democracy.
C'mon Mr. President, you've let 'em sidetrack you. Get back on course. You're right and those of us who know better are behind you. We're in a war, we're not spreading Democracy.

My Father, Sgt, Cobbs, Edward, used to say, "Marines would never be captured alive, they fight to the death". I grew up hearing that all my life. My son, LCPL Graves, Christopher, US Marines now serving his second deployment
to Iraq, says the same thing. I understand that. I just wonder, were those two boys unconscious when they were captured? It is so maddening and as a mother, it makes me want to go to that god-forsaken place and join in the fight and bring all of those boys home!!!!

marinegreen
06-22-06, 09:44 PM
Good chance they ran out of ammo MM5, or after seeing there buddie killed they could have thrown up there arms,it could be a number of reasons.We'll have to wait and see what the spin will be.

marinemom58
06-23-06, 12:44 AM
Thanks for answering. Yes You could be right on all accounts. I would like to know the whole story.

thedrifter
06-23-06, 02:08 PM
Three slain troops were left behind to guard bridge, military says
Associated Press

TIKRIT, IRAQ - Two missing soldiers whose mutilated bodies were found after a massive search had been left alone at a checkpoint near Baghdad while other vehicles in their patrol inspected traffic, a military spokesman said Thursday.

Soon after Pfc. Kristian Menchaca of Houston and another private vanished and another soldier was killed last Friday, one Iraqi told reporters that insurgents had managed to separate a three-Humvee convoy by opening fire and forcing two of the vehicles to give chase.

Other Iraqis told reporters that the vehicle carrying Menchaca and his two companions had fallen behind the convoy and was attacked by insurgents.

Those reports now appear to be wrong, said Lt. Col. Michelle Martin-Hing, a U.S. spokeswoman in Tikrit.

Menchaca and the two other soldiers had been left with one Humvee to guard a hydraulic bridge at a Euphrates River canal about 12 miles south of Baghdad. When the Humvee was attacked by insurgents, others in the unit could not see the vehicle and were checking on their colleagues by radio, Martin-Hing said.

She said a focus of the investigation will be to determine why the three-man team had been left at the canal. Army protocols are designed to prevent such attacks.

"The investigation is going to look at whether proper procedures were followed," Martin-Hing said.

The bodies of Menchaca, 23, and Pfc. Thomas Tucker, 25, of Oregon were found late Monday in Yusufiya, a few miles from the attack scene, during a search by about 8,000 U.S. and Iraqi troops.

The bodies were sent to Dover Air Base in Delaware for DNA testing. The body of the third soldier, Spc. David Babineau, 25, was found Friday at the scene of the attack.

marinegreen
06-23-06, 02:18 PM
A ARSE-NINE DECISION,Heads need to roll !!!!

Osotogary
06-23-06, 02:40 PM
I don't know 'cause I wasn't there but it sure reads like someone knew the three Humvee convoy was heading their way even though "Those reports now appear to be wrong."
Was there a pattern of travel set, eg., three humvees, all the time, same departure and arrival time, same amount of people and supplies in each humvee?
Somehow I think back to what I've heard or read about how the tactical mindset has changed from once being the hunter to now that of being the hunted. Why that comes to mind, I don't know but these kind of stories do not reinforce hunter mentality...in my opinion.
(Note: I am not a military expert on tactics defensive or offensive. It's just that this whole scenario seems so wrong.)
May their souls rest in eternal peace.

marinegreen
06-23-06, 02:48 PM
Believe me Gary, they have people pooping and snooping on us(recon,gathering imfo) and yeah,these rag heads are still in the fight,hell look at how long the AFGAN people kept Russian in the fight (10 yrs.) If they can kill our men/women by whatever means availble they'll do it.There chitten in tall cotton if they can kill one of us.

Osotogary
06-23-06, 03:13 PM
Marinegreen-
I'm in total agreement with your assessment. This, I heard, happened not too long ago and I would never assume that this would never happen again.
Dammmed if someone didn't discover one of the "locals", who had been "in good faith" employed, trying to steal a truck full of explosives! Don't know what happened next but the explosives were returned.

FistFu68
06-23-06, 04:55 PM
:usmc: REST IN PEACE~SOLDIERS! :usmc: YOU DIED WITH YOUR BOOT'S ON!:usmc:

junker316
06-24-06, 08:12 PM
Gary

There are these things known as " Ambush areas " that alot of Marines have gaurded until the Army stepped in when it was a little quieter for them. After that the Amry Commanders would not patrol the same areas or even send as many gaurds to these known points. Most likely the Insyrgents had scouted the areas for days and noticed some routine pattern, Same amount of vehicles, same amount of men, limited weapontry, watched as to how these areas were being gaurded, at what points on the clock the gaurds were moving, etc...and devicied a plan accourding to what the actions of the Army were. When the Marines were on outposts like this we were always told that if there was action to take appropriate actions and if the enemy left to call in and allocate the direction and such so that some-one could pick them up and take action. Not to chase them or put ourselves into a more dangerous areas or even to abandon our post because of fyrther actions that could be taken by the enemy. I guess the Army High Command didn't get these briefings or just plain ignored them. If you read other of my posts on this issue from earlier it will explain why I say what I say. But the damage is done and it took the lives of three Soldiers to teach the Army High Command that what the Marines were doing was done for a reason.