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thedrifter
08-10-05, 08:59 PM
Analysis: Amtrac called vulnerable in combat

Courtesy of Mark aka The Fontman

By David Wood
Newhouse News Service

The 14 Marines killed in Iraq on Aug. 3 were riding in a 28-ton, lightly armored amphibious behemoth that experts say was "never intended" for inland urban operations where it is "one of the more vulnerable" combat vehicles on the battlefield.

The leathernecks - members of the 3rd Battalion, 25th Marines, a Reserve unit from Brook Park, Ohio - were killed outside the town of Haditha about 140 miles northwest of Baghdad when a roadside bomb detonated near or beneath their Amphibious Assault Vehicle.

Until now, the amtrac, normally launched from ships and moved ashore protected by tanks and artillery, was considered safe for operations in Iraq. Protected with an inch of aluminum armor - less than that carried by the Army's Bradley Fighting Vehicle or the Abrams tank - the vehicles hold up to 25 combat-loaded Marines and a crew of three.

Amtracs in Iraq have additional armor designed to protect them from the blast of a 155mm artillery shell at a distance of 25 meters, or about 80 feet, said Doug Coffey, a senior official at BAE Systems, the London-based international defense and aerospace company that designed and manufactured the vehicle in the early 1970s.

Even so, Coffey said, the amtrac "is a lightweight amphibious personnel carrier not intended to be a fighting vehicle or anything like a tank. It's one of the more vulnerable vehicles on the battlefield."

That assessment, from Coffey and others, was echoed by Army Brig. Gen. Carter Ham, deputy director of operations for the Joint Chiefs of Staff, who has held senior combat command in Iraq. "Clearly, the AAV does not offer the same protection as a tank," Ham told reporters at the Pentagon.

This is especially true given the situation in Iraq, where insurgents with easy access to explosives and ammunition clearly have studied how to find and exploit the vulnerabilities in U.S. armored vehicles.

Within six months of the U.S. invasion in March 2003, insurgents were devising small roadside bombs that proved effective against the hundreds of unarmored Humvees that Americans used for convoys and patrols. More recently, insurgents have targeted heavier armored vehicles by wiring together such heavy shells as 155mm artillery rounds, the type of device apparently used in the Aug. 3 attack.

"This is a very lethal and, unfortunately, adaptive enemy that we are faced with inside Iraq," Ham said.

Marines often grouse about the amtracs, which are dark and noisy and seem filled with choking diesel fumes.

But officers said they had full confidence in the vehicle.

"Otherwise, we would not be using it," said Maj. Jason Johnston, a Marine Corps spokesman at the Pentagon.

Others contend that the amtrac, which the Corps plans to replace eventually with an all-new "expeditionary fighting vehicle," is obsolete for combat in Iraq, even with added armor.

That's because the entire vehicle must be designed to absorb close blasts. That design requires a flexible frame, liners to protect the crew from flying metal fragments, and restraints to prevent people and gear from being thrown around when taking a hit.

A flat-bottomed amtrac absorbs the full effect of an explosion, while a V-shaped hull deflects the blast, said Daniel Goure, an armor expert at the Lexington Institute, a defense research group in Arlington, Va.

But even with the best vehicles, "the enemy can get lucky," Goure said. "What you have here with the Marines, tragically, is the fortunes of war."

David Wood can be reached at david.wood@newhouse.com


Ellie

micarr57
03-13-10, 05:41 PM
no ship

AAV Crewchief
03-13-10, 07:38 PM
OLD news.....no **** that the vehicle is vulnerable...that generally occurs when armored vehicles that can float and move troops to the shore make progress inland or are used for purposes other than what they were intended. It is incumbent upon commanders to use these vehicles in a way that makes them less of the target than they already are...for instance...after the first Gulf War when Spirit 03 (AC130 gunship) was shot down over Iraq and the entire crew lost, there were different MISCAPs applied to this weaspon system. Nowadays you won't see a gunship leave the flightline for a mission until WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY after dark and unless absolutely necessary return later than an hour prior to sunrise.