Swim qual gone wrong

[thedrifter]

July 11, 2005 <br />
Swim qual gone wrong <br />
4 careers are on the line after a recruit’s drowning <br />
Stories by C. Mark Brinkley <br />
Times staff writer <br />
<br />
<br />
JACKSONVILLE, N.C. — Recruit Jason Tharp was physically...

[thedrifter]

Tharp was told to stand against the wall, and he complied for a moment. Then, the recruit approached the frustrated instructors again. The senior DI struck Tharp with his elbow while allegedly...

[thedrifter]

July 11, 2005 <br />
<br />
Recommended changes <br />
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<br />
<br />
The drowning death of Recruit Jason Tharp forced the Corps to examine the way it conducts training. Along with outlining what happened and placing blame,...

[yellowwing]

Dang! It sounds like anything that could go wrong, did go wrong.

[drillinstructor]

I can probably guess exactly what happened here in this case....

[thedrifter]

Report: Recruit's death 'preventable' <br />
Instructor faces disciplinary action for violation of standard training procedures <br />
By GEOFF ZIEZULEWICZ <br />
The Beaufort Gazette <br />
Published Wednesday, June 29th,...

[KingDonkeyPunch]

It's a shame, these Instructor/Trainers were probably great marines. Yet, now, after an accident, that could of happened to any of us, are the scapegoats for the corps due to the fact that it was blown up in the public's eye. I just hope that they dont get too screwed over by their trial. Yet, I am sure that they will be made a public example of due to the fact that recruiting is at an all-time low already, and the hatred of the Bush Administration. God I hate politics

[Pig-pen]

Well its just my opinion: We have been training young Marine for some 230 yrs. The system works, now because we have become a more libral and sensitive world we are going to install kiddy cams and add a officcer billet?! Excuse me, but I thought we were training fighting men. Men able to handle the stresses of making life and death decisions. Making decisions that may effect the world in a crunch(to put it mildley!). Let the men who know what they are doing continue, lets not change the system to aide one Non-hacker and weaken the whole! I hate it for the Family and the young man. He should for all the reports been booted sooner, and isnt it just like the Marine Corps to try harder to get the young man up to snuff.
Just my two cents worth....Semper Fi G. Burt(Pig-pen)

[Joseph P Carey]

King Donkey,

I do not believe I hate the Administration of President Bush. I do know that given a choice between President Bush and Senator Kerry, I chose President Bush! If I remember correctly so did over 50% of the Voters in this Great Nation.

This may sound hard, but one of 75 or 80 men, or whatever the number is for that platoon died in a pool. For the kid, I am sorry to hear about that. For the Corps, it is one kid that will not die when a boat turns over. Military training is not for the weak, and people get hurt, and sometimes die, just like children in a home pool. There were X amount of people there that did not see the boy go down, or if they did, they thought that they could get him in time. Crap happens!

There are just so many eyes that can see what is going on!

[lprkn]

That's all that these measures are being put in place for, to add a few extra pairs of eyes to the situation. Someoneone died here, if we can prevent another death, why not?

[hrscowboy]

I still say that 1 of the requirements for enlistment to the Marine Corps is that you be able to swim. This incident did not have to happen what so ever, In my eyes this was a bad judgement call and when this young man said he no longer wanted to part of our Marine Corps he should have been taken to the front gate and told to go home. Gentlemen and ladies we are no longer in a world that tolerates any form of abuse regardless if the instructor is trying to motivate this poolie, The Marine Corp has went thru alot of changes since i was in during the 60s and the people of the United States have too. I know i dont like whats going on in my Marine Corps these days for my 2 cents, it should still be the way it was back in what i call the Old Corps, you got your arse whipped for even looking wrong at a drill instructor but those days are over and the Corp needs to look at different ways to cover there asses for deals like this one. Enuff said...

[LivinSoFree]

I agree with Cowboy on this one, this kid was obviously not cut out for it, and should've been tossed. Period.

[MOUNTAINWILLIAM]

It is an unfortunate circumstance that fatal accidents, such as the drowning of this lad, happen. It does not matter whether the person is in the military or not, these things happen. The great hue and cry against the dangerous conditions that recruits are exposed to is.......well......rather hypocritical compared to the murderous conditions the civilian population is subjected to on a daily basis.

This is not to say we shouldn't be concerned, however we must accept that accidents do happen. Condolences to the families affected need to be voiced as well.

I am attaching an article by our local gadfly, a former jarhead, that addresses this incident better than I for your review and comment. Incidentally, I arrived at PI at the time of the McKeon incident which caused an uproar too)

"For all the wrong reasons"
(Bob Flanagan)

"Johnny Tharp, of Sutton, W.Va., wanted to go to college. Whatever drove him to an extreme to accomplish this - lack of financial wherewithal, desire to "make it on his own," or something else - Tharp enlisted in the U.S. Marines to finance his academic dream. I dare not surmise about his mind-set in taking on this demanding challenge; I do know that if you don't want it - attainment of the eagle, globe and anchor device that symbolizes the Marine - to the exclusion of almost everything else, the physical and mental marathon is prohibitive.

In the first five weeks of recruit training at Parris Island, S.C., Tharp wrote home seven times pleading for help in nullifying his commitment. He wanted out! But if every cry for release at PI was granted, there would have been no U.S. victories at Belleau Wood, Iwo Jima, Inchon, Hue and Fallujah, for there would have been no Marines to carry the day. Whether he let his fears overwhelm him, harbored a phobia of water, or some other deadly factor intervened, Pvt. Jason "Johnny" Tharp drowned in late June in the pool at PI during water survival training.

Now, his instructor and three other Marines may face court-martial for not recognizing that Tharp "was too tired" or "so afraid that he could no longer function." Again, an unfortunate accident threatens to become a politically correct dance of contrition. But surpassing his death, whatever the Marines' fate, the tragedy of Tharp's death is that he signed up to a tough job with a tough crowd - for all the wrong reasons.

Recruiters are so stressed in today's unfavorable recruiting atmosphere, and so much money offered to entice kids in - who often ignore what all can be demanded of them for the cash - that tragedies are assured. The program offered funds for college, a dream he could satisfy merely by enlisting, and Tharp did not complete the equation; he accepted it.

The fault lies not entirely with the government. Is anyone who has graduated highchairs unaware of the rigors of combat? And combat - bottom line - is what Marines are about. And in order to function in combat at superlative levels, Marines receive the toughest training possible. Mastering the water is requisite for Marines, who traditionally have gone to their appointed rounds via water transport. Tharp had to know he faced tough times; his parents must have known even better than he. But military service seemed a ready answer for the Tharps.

So it is with National Guardsmen and military Reservists who sign up just for college money, for a car, for travel, or for a host of other attractions, and when it comes time to ante up with hazardous duty, which is, after all, the province of those services, the wailing and gnashing of teeth drown out the Stars and Stripes Forever. The flagrant inability logically to relate A to B, is astounding: "Why do they have to take Freddie?" a mother cries. "He joined to get money for college, not to go to war," and from a whining wife, "We have three kids. Why should Charlie have to go off over there someplace?" all the while ignoring the pay Fred and Charles took for years, without complaint, for weekend drills and summer camps.

A lot of bodies lie on the hillside in Arlington who committed themselves, not for college funds, not to see the wonders of Phu Bai or Singapore or the Naktong River; not even for the allotment to keep baby in formula for the duration, but because they were Americans. They were needed. They went. And many came back in boxes and bags, never having written home asking surcease. They had gone for the right reasons."


:marine:

[MOUNTAINWILLIAM]

It is an unfortunate circumstance that fatal accidents, such as the drowning of this lad, happen. It does not matter whether the person is in the military or not, these things happen. The great hue and cry against the dangerous conditions that recruits are exposed to is.......well......rather hypocritical compared to the murderous conditions the civilian population is subjected to on a daily basis.

This is not to say we shouldn't be concerned, however we must accept that accidents do happen. Condolences to the families affected need to be voiced as well.

I am attaching an article by our local gadfly, a former jarhead, that addresses this incident better than I for your review and comment. Incidentally, I arrived at PI at the time of the McKeon incident which caused an uproar too)

"For all the wrong reasons"
(Bob Flanagan)

"Johnny Tharp, of Sutton, W.Va., wanted to go to college. Whatever drove him to an extreme to accomplish this - lack of financial wherewithal, desire to "make it on his own," or something else - Tharp enlisted in the U.S. Marines to finance his academic dream. I dare not surmise about his mind-set in taking on this demanding challenge; I do know that if you don't want it - attainment of the eagle, globe and anchor device that symbolizes the Marine - to the exclusion of almost everything else, the physical and mental marathon is prohibitive.

In the first five weeks of recruit training at Parris Island, S.C., Tharp wrote home seven times pleading for help in nullifying his commitment. He wanted out! But if every cry for release at PI was granted, there would have been no U.S. victories at Belleau Wood, Iwo Jima, Inchon, Hue and Fallujah, for there would have been no Marines to carry the day. Whether he let his fears overwhelm him, harbored a phobia of water, or some other deadly factor intervened, Pvt. Jason "Johnny" Tharp drowned in late June in the pool at PI during water survival training.

Now, his instructor and three other Marines may face court-martial for not recognizing that Tharp "was too tired" or "so afraid that he could no longer function." Again, an unfortunate accident threatens to become a politically correct dance of contrition. But surpassing his death, whatever the Marines' fate, the tragedy of Tharp's death is that he signed up to a tough job with a tough crowd - for all the wrong reasons.

Recruiters are so stressed in today's unfavorable recruiting atmosphere, and so much money offered to entice kids in - who often ignore what all can be demanded of them for the cash - that tragedies are assured. The program offered funds for college, a dream he could satisfy merely by enlisting, and Tharp did not complete the equation; he accepted it.

The fault lies not entirely with the government. Is anyone who has graduated highchairs unaware of the rigors of combat? And combat - bottom line - is what Marines are about. And in order to function in combat at superlative levels, Marines receive the toughest training possible. Mastering the water is requisite for Marines, who traditionally have gone to their appointed rounds via water transport. Tharp had to know he faced tough times; his parents must have known even better than he. But military service seemed a ready answer for the Tharps.

So it is with National Guardsmen and military Reservists who sign up just for college money, for a car, for travel, or for a host of other attractions, and when it comes time to ante up with hazardous duty, which is, after all, the province of those services, the wailing and gnashing of teeth drown out the Stars and Stripes Forever. The flagrant inability logically to relate A to B, is astounding: "Why do they have to take Freddie?" a mother cries. "He joined to get money for college, not to go to war," and from a whining wife, "We have three kids. Why should Charlie have to go off over there someplace?" all the while ignoring the pay Fred and Charles took for years, without complaint, for weekend drills and summer camps.

A lot of bodies lie on the hillside in Arlington who committed themselves, not for college funds, not to see the wonders of Phu Bai or Singapore or the Naktong River; not even for the allotment to keep baby in formula for the duration, but because they were Americans. They were needed. They went. And many came back in boxes and bags, never having written home asking surcease. They had gone for the right reasons."


:marine: