Rumsfeld Sued Over Torture

[thedrifter]

Rumsfeld Sued Over Torture
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
By Daniel Pulliam
dpulliam@govexec.com

A lawsuit alleging that Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld is responsible for the prison torture scandal in Afghanistan and Iraq moved to federal court Wednesday against the wishes of government lawyers representing the Pentagon chief.

The lawsuit was filed by the American Civil Liberties Union and Human Rights First on behalf of eight Afghani and Iraqi men who say they were tortured while held in U.S. prisons in Iraq and Afghanistan.

A panel of seven judges -- the Judicial Panel on Multidistrict Litigation -- moved the lawsuit to the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia, consolidating pretrial proceedings of four lawsuits filed by the ACLU. The other lawsuits were filed against Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez, who commanded U.S. forces in Iraq when the alleged abuse occurred, Brig. Gen. Janis Karpinsky, who commanded U.S. military police forces in Iraq at the time and Col. Thomas Pappas, who commanded U.S. military intelligence and military police forces in Iraq at the time.

According to the ACLU, lawyers representing the military commanders wanted the case tried in the Eastern District of Virginia, rather than elevating the case to the federal level.

"This brings us one step closer to proving in court that the legal responsibility for the systemic abuse and torture of detainees in U.S. custody in Iraq and Afghanistan lies at the top of the chain of command and not at the bottom," said a statement from Lucas Guttentag, the lawsuit's lead counsel and director of the ACLU's Immigrant's Rights Project.

Chief Judge Thomas F. Hogan will hear the case.

"We welcome this decision and hope that we are closer to having a federal court reverse policy decisions that have led to torture and abuse," said Michael Posner, executive director of Human Rights First in the statement.

Calls to the Justice Department for comment were not returned in time for publication.




Ellie

Unfrickinbelieveable!!!

These despicable pricks will do anything to stop and derail our war efforts. Anything!
Unfortunately, they are succeeding.

Now let's see...the American Communist Lawyers Union is sueing the Secretary of Defense for torture of enemies of the United States...now is the same ACLU GOING TO SUE THE FIVE JUSTICES THAT DECIDED TO VIOLATE THE CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS OF UNITED STATES CITIZENS by breaking their oaths to uphold and protect the Constitution of the United States?

"The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name ‘liberalism’ they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, until one day America will be a Socialist nation, without knowing how it happened..

So...could we sue the ACLU for distracting our elected officials from doing their duty to protect us?

[mrbsox]

I DID IT

IT WAS ME

RUMSFELD KNEW KNOTHING

I'LL TAKE THE RAP

GOD BLESS AMERICA

[CplCrotty]

Lawsuit this, ACLU mother@$%!*&$ !

It all starts to crumble from within.

[OLE SARG]

ACLU sucks (includes all the dumbass lawyers too). What a bunch of a#%holes.

Losers forever & forever & forever, etc.

SEMPER FI,
OLE SARG

[LivinSoFree]

"ACLU sucks (includes all the dumbass lawyers too). What a bunch of a#%holes."

"Lawsuit this, ACLU mother@$%!*&$ !"

"American Communist Lawyers Union"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Just a few notes on the above comments:


- In 1931 in Scottsboro, Alabama, two white women arrested riding a freight train claimed to have been raped by nine black boys. The boys were promptly tried and all but the youngest were sentenced to death. The ACLU intervened, calling the proceedings a "legal lynching" and appealed. The United States Supreme Court overturned the convictions. In a second series of trials, one of the women then recanted her story, and the case was dismissed.


- Throughout the 1930's, ACLU director Roger Baldwin became increasingly disenchanted with Stalin and the Soviet Union as news of famine and the Stalinist "purges" reached America. Finally, in 1939, the Soviet Union signed a Non-Aggression Pact with Hitler's Nazi Germany. Baldwin became a fierce "anti-totalitarian" and conducted a purge of his own, removing the ACLU's remaining Communists, including co-founder Elizabeth Gurley Flynn.

- The ACLU became involved in the unsuccessful Korematsu case in 1944, challenging the internment of Japanese-Americans in concentrations camps, called by the ACLU "the worst single wholesale violation of civil rights of Americans citizens in our history."

- In Buckley v. Valeo, (1976), the ACLU successfully promoted constitutional limits on campaign finance reform law.

- In a motion filed 12 January 2004, the American Civil Liberties Union of Florida said state law enforcement officers violated Rush Limbaugh’s privacy rights by seizing the conservative radio talk show host's medical records as part of a criminal investigation involving alleged “doctor-shopping.”

---------------------------------------------------


What a horrific organization this "ACLU" must be! Defending falsely accused, unlawfully imprisoned, unlawfully investigated individuals regardless of their color, creed, or politics, while keeping "those damn commies" out of their ranks! Who would ever want a group like that around?!

I respectfully suggest getting a grip and looking at the case from the standpoint of it's legal merits (or lack thereof), in terms of law and precedent, instead of waving the flag and letting emotion get in the way of reason.

The Marine Corps trained me to be cold and calculating, to get the job done and accomplish the mission first, before allowing myself the luxury of emotions. Analyze the situation. In a fight the one with the cooler head will always prevail.

[Joseph P Carey]

Originally posted by LivinSoFree
"ACLU sucks (includes all the dumbass lawyers too). What a bunch of a#%holes."

"Lawsuit this, ACLU mother@$%!*&$ !"

"American Communist Lawyers Union"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Just a few notes on the above comments:


- In 1931 in Scottsboro, Alabama, two white women arrested riding a freight train claimed to have been raped by nine black boys. The boys were promptly tried and all but the youngest were sentenced to death. The ACLU intervened, calling the proceedings a "legal lynching" and appealed. The United States Supreme Court overturned the convictions. In a second series of trials, one of the women then recanted her story, and the case was dismissed.


- Throughout the 1930's, ACLU director Roger Baldwin became increasingly disenchanted with Stalin and the Soviet Union as news of famine and the Stalinist "purges" reached America. Finally, in 1939, the Soviet Union signed a Non-Aggression Pact with Hitler's Nazi Germany. Baldwin became a fierce "anti-totalitarian" and conducted a purge of his own, removing the ACLU's remaining Communists, including co-founder Elizabeth Gurley Flynn.

- The ACLU became involved in the unsuccessful Korematsu case in 1944, challenging the internment of Japanese-Americans in concentrations camps, called by the ACLU "the worst single wholesale violation of civil rights of Americans citizens in our history."

- In Buckley v. Valeo, (1976), the ACLU successfully promoted constitutional limits on campaign finance reform law.

- In a motion filed 12 January 2004, the American Civil Liberties Union of Florida said state law enforcement officers violated Rush Limbaugh’s privacy rights by seizing the conservative radio talk show host's medical records as part of a criminal investigation involving alleged “doctor-shopping.”

---------------------------------------------------


What a horrific organization this "ACLU" must be! Defending falsely accused, unlawfully imprisoned, unlawfully investigated individuals regardless of their color, creed, or politics, while keeping "those damn commies" out of their ranks! Who would ever want a group like that around?!

I respectfully suggest getting a grip and looking at the case from the standpoint of it's legal merits (or lack thereof), in terms of law and precedent, instead of waving the flag and letting emotion get in the way of reason.

The Marine Corps trained me to be cold and calculating, to get the job done and accomplish the mission first, before allowing myself the luxury of emotions. Analyze the situation. In a fight the one with the cooler head will always prevail.

Congratulations, you found Five cases since 1931, and for the record, Rush should have gone to jail!

When you get a couple of years under your belt, more so than just out of Boot Camp, and you get out of your head out of your Sociology Prof's rear end, you will feel very different. Come back and talk to me in five years, maybe by then you can mount an argument on behalf the ACLU, but I doubt it!

As far as purging Communist from the ACLU, It could not have happened, or they would have lost their own way! How could the ACLU eliminate anyone from their system? It would be discrimination on their part! You have got to get better, and more discerning, books, kid!

[CplCrotty]

Lawsuit this, ACLU mother@$%!*&$ !

It all starts to crumble from within.

[OLE SARG]

When you get an organization (THE ACLU AND IT'S DUMBASS LAWYERS) that defends a website that gives instructions on how to lure little boys for purposes of molesting them, that's a scum organization!!!!!!!!!!!! AND THEY ARE A SCUM ORGANIZATION AND I CAN'T THINK OF ANYTHING GOOD TO SAY ABOUT THEM!!!!

Give better examples of something the ACLU has done recently that means a **** to anybody. I CAN'T THINK OF ANY!!!!!

Unless you can give some kind of defense for the above, THEY, THE ACLU, ARE SCUM OF THE EARTH!!!!!!!!

SEMPER FI,
OLE SARG

[LivinSoFree]

The ACLU is something that's better to understand from an abstract point of view. They are, in a word, absolutists by nature. While you can characterize them as "left-wing" or "overly liberal" if you so desire, the reality is that they are not overly liberal, but rather, America has become more conservative in recent years.

Do we always like or agree with the people that the ACLU defends? Of course not, that's the point. They keep us honest when it comes to the Constitution. You cannot assert to operate under a system of true liberty, and then choose to make that liberty available on a selective basis, based on whether or not you find the personal politics of the recipient to be to your liking. The ACLU operates under a true "blind justice" principle. If they were, in fact, such whackjobs of the sort that many individuals assert that they are, then they would not have won so many cases of such a large variety, in so many different parts of the United States, over the last roughly 100 years. They keep us honest, even when we don't want to be. It would be easy to say "no, your views are not acceptable, and you do not enjoy the constitutional protections afforded other Americans." But that is an entirely subjective approach, and not one I'm willing to take. I'll take the nutjobs and the less desirable individuals along with the rest of it, if that's what it takes to maintain liberty. There is no room to maneuver- you are either a nation of free people, or you are not, and the second you begin to qualify and delineate the freedoms you claim to enjoy, those freedoms become entirely defunct.

I am beginning to become disturbed with the reactions on this board. It seems that intelligent discourse and rational discussion is being increasingly supplanted with capitalized outbursts and obscenity. That's not what I was trained to do as a Marine. I was trained to keep my head when everyone else was losing their cool, and see the situation for what it truly is, then decide on a course of action. That's what I know to be the difference between a leader and a career spent cleaning the head.

Call me inexperienced, call me young, call me ignorant, but back it up. For all the strident criticism directed at my arguments here, there's been little in the way of cold fact presented to back it up... some vague references to nonspecific cases, and some criticism of numbers. Sure, I only listed 5 cases, because I thought that would be a sufficient summary. If you'd like, I can dig up more instances where the ACLU defended the rights of free speech and due process... I don't care how morally objectionable the individuals defended are. If they have truly committed a crime (such as murder, child molestation, etc.), then they will be tried and convicted through due process in a court of law. UNTIL THEY HAVE- their rights remain intact. PERIOD. We need to behave the way a superpower ought to behave- with greater restraint and respect for human rights than everyone else. We ARE the big kid on the block, and its up to us to decide whether we play the bully or the leader. I'm not suggesting pacifism or a weak foreign policy- I'm suggesting one that lives up to the standards we set for ourselves. THAT, ladies and gentlemen, is what we ALL signed up to defend.

[radio relay]

There ain't nuthin' "abstract" about the ACLU!!!

They hate any "right" thinking American, and are determined to change this country into a leftwing, communist paradise that caters to perverts, atheists, and feminazis.

They make no bones about it. They are not abstract. Their position is as clear as the nose on Stalin's face.

You support the ACLU, and you will be "WishinYouWereLivinSoFree"!!

[LivinSoFree]

From the ACLU Homepage:

---------------------------------
The ACLU is our nation's guardian of liberty. We work daily in courts, legislatures and communities to defend and preserve the individual rights and liberties guaranteed to every person in this country by the Constitution and laws of the United States. Our job is to conserve America's original civic values - the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.

The American system of government is founded on two counterbalancing principles: that the majority of the people governs, through democratically elected representatives; and that the power even of a democratic majority must be limited, to ensure individual rights.

Majority power is limited by the Constitution's Bill of Rights, which consists of the original ten amendments ratified in 1791, plus the three post-Civil War amendments (the Thirteenth, Fourteenth and Fifteenth) and the Nineteenth Amendment (women's suffrage), adopted in 1920.

The mission of the ACLU is to preserve all of these protections and guarantees:

* Your First Amendment rights-freedom of speech, association and assembly. Freedom of the press, and freedom of religion supported by the strict separation of church and state.
* Your right to equal protection under the law - equal treatment regardless of race, sex, religion or national origin.
* Your right to due process - fair treatment by the government whenever the loss of your liberty or property is at stake.
* Your right to privacy - freedom from unwarranted government intrusion into your personal and private affairs.

We work also to extend rights to segments of our population that have traditionally been denied their rights, including Native Americans and other people of color; lesbians, gay men, bisexuals and transgendered people; women; mental-health patients; prisoners; people with disabilities; and the poor.

If the rights of society's most vulnerable members are denied, everybody's rights are imperiled.

The ACLU was founded by Roger Baldwin, Crystal Eastman, Albert DeSilver and others in 1920. We are nonprofit and nonpartisan and have grown from a roomful of civil liberties activists to an organization of more than 400,000 members and supporters. We handle nearly 6,000 court cases annually from our offices in almost every state.

The ACLU has maintained the position that civil liberties must be respected, even in times of national emergency.

--------------------------

Sounds like they're pretty egalitarian to me...

[MarkT]

Yeah the 'All criminals luv us' sure are the greatest. They defend the constitutional rights of everybody regardless of the results.

they even defended the rights of the american Nazis to march in Skokie, through a neiborhood filled with Halocaust survivors, Yessirree, they are tops, and they have sued that perverted group called the Boy Scouts, and defend the rights of all those poor illegal aliens sneaking across the border claiming they deserve due process. They have sued high schools because there is a prayer before a high school football game,

Yeah boy the aclu is really doing yoeman work when it comes to civil rights.

There newest defense is to defend pedeophiles, you know the nasty little people who molest little children. The Aclu thinks John Evander Couey is being railroaded by the evil system.

No Sir. the ACLU must be put out of business. They get govenment funding, that should be cut off. These people are also sponsored in part by George Soros a self styled communist, whose main objective is to destroy the united states.

[OLE SARG]

Well said MarkT and I agree - If anyone is blind it is the turds in the ACLU AND again I say they are "Scum of the Earth". The ACLU wears out the First Amendment, our right to due process, your right to privacy, and our right to equal protection. According to the ACLU, all these rights exist for all the vermon out in our society. These rights, according to the ACLU, apply to only vermon (child molestors, illegal aliens, Nazis, etc.) and not the everyday citizen!!

Yeah boy the ACLU is really doing, or was that screwing with, people's civil rights.

AGAIN, I say the ACLU is "THE SCUM OF THE EARTH".

I can see that the ACLU has brainwashed another to their side of the fence (LivinSoFree). That ACLU homepage is pretty damn self-serving.

SEMPER FI,
OLE SARG

[LivinSoFree]

Actually, the ACLU is entirely independent of government funding, a fact that's made quite clear... gentlemen, I suggest checking your facts.

Take note- Yes, the individuals that the ACLU defends are often offensive or objectionable. This does NOT mean that they are to be denied due process. The guilty will be punished, but we need to do it the RIGHT WAY. By bringing these cases to court now, the ACLU prevents hundreds of other just convictions from being thrown out on a technicality in the future. But you have to take the long view to see that.

"Those who would sacrifice liberty to obtain peace deserve neither liberty nor peace."

[MarkT]

Ok liveSoFree

There is a source of government provided for the ACLU, this has been documented. And the funding is convoluted at best and should be cut out.

they are suppose to be constitutional lawyers, slip and fall best describe them, but the cases they pick and choose are controversial at best.

They continue to insist that there is a 'Wall of separation' in the first ammendment, this is how they got 'prayer' removed from school, any religious symbol removed from the courthouses at Christmas time, Judge Roy Moore was removed for refusing to remove the 10 commandments from the courthouse. Because there is a supposed Wall,

The ACLU is quick to remove these Christian articles but have not the same fortitude when it comes to the koran, oh well we might offend the 'towel heads'

This is certainly a double standard. The ACLu was indignant when News Week came out with the 'LIE' of our troops flushing the koran, well hell it is only an article of religion right ? Separation of church but no the ACLU defends these low life and their 'koran' the islamic book of violance.

They are now suing the federal government, for what, since when does the ACLU have any say in what the US Government does for foreign policy.

since you, at the ACLU are so up on precedent perhaps the administration should suspend Hebeas Corpus just like President Lincoln and jailed the seditionists without a trial, about 13000 people were jailed this way. Then they were tried by Military Tribunal, How can you run a war with this kind of sedition running amok in a nation where even the congress is giving Aid and comfort to the enemy.

The bottom line here is the ACLu is a shill for Moveon.org, and the communist george soros.

You mention Korematsu above, This much I agree with you on yes it was bad but you nor I were alive during the second world war, but my parents were and lived through it. The didn't have the internet, television all they had was their Radio, The Japanese were looked at as a horrific monster, and moreso than the Germans. There was a panic expecially in the Bay area and of most of california, and it was discovered that there were japanese spies from that area, which does give the government the right to protect it people and its borders by interning these people.

But Also I notice that the ACLU never defended Joe McCarthy or Richard Nixon rather they defended the communists, Hmmmm coincidence, I think not. What about their right to free speech ?

The ACLU, has an agenda as spelled out by David Horowitz, Radical son , written by one who was one of you. Their ultimate gain it to subvert the government, and destroy it from with in.

But Mr ACLU there are still enough of US old Marines who say to you " Hell NO".

[MarkT]

Child pornography is another pet project of the ACLU.

This year alone, several high profile cases involving children being abducted for the satisfaction of a sexual deviance and we are still talking about the possibilities because the ACLU continues to believe that owning this trash should be legal. Images of children engaging in sexual acts expands the need for predators such as the likes of John Evander Couey to act on their urges. Urges sparked and heightened by these very images.

Where is the conscience of the ACLU? Do they not see that these images are harmful to the children of this nation? Can they not make the connection between the legalization of this material and pedophilia? A blind man can see this. But the ACLU continues to push issues like these.

This all falls into the Communist agenda in America. Destroy the morality of this nation and Communism would have no obstructions. And how do they do this? By starting in the schools, television, video games, and other child rich activities.

There is nothing American about the ACLU. Have you ever seen the ACLU defend the second Amendment,, most particularly the right to bear arms ?

Recently there was a 5-4 supreme court decision about property rights, comes right out of the fifth amendment, Where was the ACLU when these ordinary property owners were losing their property to eminent domain. They were conviniently silent.

Most infamously, judges are now the tool by which the ACLU pursues its obsession against displays of the ten commandments on public property. The ACLU in fact, has filed so many suits against public display of the ten commandments that a separate page on its website is devoted to them.

By the standard activist judges use today, I wouldn't be surprised if at some point displaying the Declaration of Independance is challanged.

After all , the Declaration of Independance speaks of "Laws of Nature and of Natures God" and that all men ... are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights"

It declares that the founders are " appealing to the supreme judge of the world and relying on the protection of devine providence."

If our rights are not unalienable, if they don't come from a source higher than ourselves, then they're malleable at the will of the state.


This is a prescription for Tyranny.

[MarkT]

David Parker of Lexington, Mass. only wanted one thing. He wanted to be informed and be able to make a parental decision about whether or not his 6-year-old son was exposed to discussions about homosexual relationships. Because of it he was arrested.

Parker approached staff at Joseph Estabrook School in Lexington, Mass., Wednesday after his son brought home a copy of the book “Who’s in a Family,’’ that included characters who are homosexual parents, the Boston Herald reported.

According to the Herald report, Parker would not leave when Superintendent Bill Hurley advised him that he would not honor his request to be notified when his son is exposed to any discussion about same-sex households as part of classroom instruction.

Now, you’d think the ACLU would be all over this one, right? How dare a school tell this father he had no right to control when his child was exposed to same-sex marriage? Read on:

I called the American Civil Liberties Union of Massachusetts.

I called their contact number (617-482-3170) and spoke with a lady (who suprisingly wouldn’t give me her name) about the issue. I asked her if the ACLU had a stance on this case and if so how can I donate to help. She placed me on hold for a few minutes and returned to advise me that the ACLU would not take a stance on this issue. She advised that she spoke with a few people and that they would not be taking ANY stance on this. She acknowledged that they knew about the case and when I inquired about why they weren’t helping she advised that they wouldn’t take a stance and will not be addressing the issue. I asked how I could help. She said, “I am sure his name is in the phone book, you can call him”.

Now if that father was angry because his child was being taught religion, I bet we’d already have heard about it.

You know, my first-grader son came home after a few weeks at school and mentioned casually out of nowhere, “What if I wanted to marry a boy?” I asked him why he would ask that, and he replied, “Because Mrs. P—- says that boys can’t marry boys here, but in Canada they do.” My son still thinks that babies come “from mommies’ tummies after God puts them there”, and that’s just fine by me. He’s 7. Not 10, not 12. And if anyone teaches him about sex and its proper place, it’ll be my husband and I. The sad thing, here in Michigan, I’d have to have the talk before second grade, since mandatory HIV talks begin in second grade here.

Thank God I’m moving out of state.

[radio relay]

Here's one for you, LivinSoFree. Unlike yours, this one makes sense, and speaks truth. FYI, the ACLU was founded by those "freedom loving" (sic) communists!!!
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ACLU: The Beginnings of Tyranny [Part 1]

December 27, 2004
by Sher Zieve

No one knew it at the time. But, 21 January 1884 would prove to be a crucial date for the United States of America. This is the date that Roger Nash Baldwin was born. Raised by self-proclaimed “agnostic Unitarians” parents, Baldwin grew up in Wellesley Hills; a suburb of Boston, MA. Note: How precipitous, as Boston was both one of the cities that worked toward the founding of the USA as well as, now, working toward its demise!

As he grew, Baldwin’s training was (putting it mildly) to the left of center…very left. He proved to be an extremely apt student. Baldwin’s eventual belief system would lead him to tout that the “progressive” left should unite to bring down the ‘dreaded right’. Already on its way toward becoming the leftist institution it is today, Baldwin attended Harvard and completed his M.A. degree. After moving to New York and just prior to World War I, Baldwin became a leading figure in and voice for such organizations as the American Union Against Militarism and the National Civil Liberties Bureau. Then, Baldwin resolutely and intentionally violated the US’ Selective Service Act, was tried and spent time in jail. After his release, he temporarily joined the leftist International Workers of the World, met and married attorney Madeleine Doty. Shortly thereafter the ACLU was spawned. Baldwin believed that only an elite class of people should be members of his newly formed group, as he worked toward reshaping the US Constitution; specifically the First Amendment. Although Baldwin appeared to believe that he and the ACLU were working to assist the ‘downtrodden’ in societies, today his organization has become the perpetrator of the subjugation; working toward silencing and oppressing all who disagree with the tenets of its far left mission. In fact, the ACLU, via its actions and court cases, ascribes its agenda to the 10 January 1963 “Communist Goals” as they appear in the US Congressional Record (Appendix, pp. A34-A35). A few of the 45 stated goals include:

* Provide American aid to all nations regardless of Communist domination
* Grant recognition of Red China. Admission of Red China to the U.N.
* Get control of the schools. Use them as transmission belts for socialism and current Communist propaganda. Soften the curriculum. Get control of teachers' associations. Put the party line in textbooks
* Infiltrate the press. Get control of book-review assignments, editorial writing, policymaking positions
* Control art critics and directors of art museums. "Our plan is to promote ugliness, repulsive, meaningless art"
* Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as "normal, natural, healthy"
* Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with "social" religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity which does not need a "religious crutch"
* Eliminate prayer or any phase of religious expression in the schools on the ground that it violates the principle of "separation of church and state"
* Discredit the American Founding Fathers. Present them as selfish aristocrats who had no concern for the "common man"
* Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate, old-fashioned, out of step with modern needs, a hindrance to cooperation between nations on a worldwide basis

All of the above stated goals, as well as most not listed, have already been achieved by the Communist factions with the assistance of the ACLU. What they and the other leftists in the US cannot gain by way of the vote, they will implement through the leftist and activist court system. Already, myriad voter approved bills have been overturned by the courts; most recently and notably in California and Arizona. If the voters do not follow the ACLU’s agenda, it simply overturns the vote by stating that it is “unconstitutional”. If the ACLU does not like Christian displays (and it does not), it merely threatens communities with costly lawsuits. These have been the consistent and, thus far, very effective ploys of this organization. And, it’s only the tip of the iceberg of its Master Plan to take over the country. The Communist Manifesto appears to be alive and well in the offices and courtrooms of the ACLU. Chillingly, this is only its beginning salvo.

Sher Zieve

--------------------------------------------------
Sher Zieve is a conservative political commentator who firmly believes that if Leftists ran the country (left to their own devices), it would be the end of the United States as a sovereign nation. Sher’s articles can be found on Google, MSN Newsbot, US-News.Net, Useless Knowledge and other news sites. Ms. Zieve welcomes you comments and can be reached at: earthseed@iwon.com.

[radio relay]

ACLU: The Beginnings of Tyranny [Part 2]

January 11, 2005
by Sher Zieve

Although many historians have written that Roger Nash Baldwin retreated from his Communist philosophies toward conservatism, when in the 1930s he expelled communist Elizabeth Gurley Flynn and the ostensible ban of communists and fascists from the ACLU’s board and staff, I view his actions as leaning more toward a pragmatic motivation. I do not believe Baldwin’s Communist bent ever truly left him. Although one might argue that Baldwin experienced an epiphany, I find it difficult to accept that he went from staunchly pro-Communist (with his written and spoken reverent views of the Soviet Union) within a matter of months. From his early and steadfast beginnings as a “progressive”, Baldwin espoused and advocated the Communist philosophies and agendas. For him to, virtually overnight, become rabidly anti-Communist seems disingenuous at best. However, until Roger Baldwin expressed an anti-Communist viewpoint, his ACLU was a fringe organization. But, after completely changing his expressed viewpoint, coupled with the change in philosophy of the organization, the ACLU was finally “mainstream” and became accepted into American culture and society. If planned, this was a truly admirable ploy and one which would help grow the ACLU into the fierce and intimidating entity it is today.

Baldwin, also, articulated a “strong admiration” for J. Edgar Hoover and Douglas MacArthur; to the point that he was able to firmly establish and ingratiate himself with the political power players of his time. After World War II, he was even invited by Gen. MacArthur to assist in democratizing Japan. Did Baldwin’s early wealthy elite status finally overtake him or did he have another agenda in mind? Could it have been the Communist philosophy of infiltration and destruction of a culture from within? Well prior to his death in 1981, at the age of ninety-seven, he was long past the point of being considered a threat. Then President Jimmy Carter even awarded him the Congressional Medal of Freedom. Baldwin had, inexorably, become a force majeure and the elder statesman for the progressive leftist movement in the United States. This leftist philosophical bent not only took root within the offices of the ACLU but, in my opinion, has begun to destroy the building. This root-system is so persistent and so vast in its growth pattern that it has even begun to uproot US citizens’ private homes. Was this the intent of Baldwin’s plan? If not it is, nonetheless, his legacy; a legacy fraught with suppression of religion, individual rights and movement toward the dissolution of the US Constitution.

The ACLU has become not only an instrument of oppression but, the hammer used by activist judges to eliminate the basic citizen-liberties upon which the United States was founded. This organization uses its legal force to beat and crush all those who would dissent with its agenda. It’s current highly-visible tack is the elimination of any symbols of the Christian religion from government; including but not limited to Christmas displays.

In Los Angeles, the ACLU forced the removal of a small cross from the County seal. Los Angeles opted not to fight them. In smaller communities and schools, the mere threat of a lawsuit from the deep-pockets ACLU is enough to instill abject fear. These communities and schools, with limited funds to fight the ACLU, consistently submit to its will. The ACLU is ensuring that it, not us, is in control of our lives. If our value systems do not mirror its agenda, the ACLU only has to threaten a lawsuit and we are crushed like tissue paper. The ACLU demands freedom from religion for everyone. In doing so, it establishes a new law: “No religion, especially Christianity, will be tolerated!” If the ACLU continues, unchallenged, in its intimidation and removal of Christianity, will it be long before it mandates that churches are no longer allowed? I doubt it. One only has to look to Canada to see how quickly a secular “no Christians allowed” society can be formed. Orwell’s 1984 is now here…it just arrived a little late.

Note : Part 3, of this series, will begin the exploration of the ACLU’s legal maneuverings toward its Socialistic (if not fascist) goals for the United States.

Sher Zieve

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Sher Zieve is a conservative political commentator who firmly believes that if Leftists ran the country (left to their own devices), it would be the end of the United States as a sovereign nation. Sher’s articles can be found on Google, MSN Newsbot, US-News.Net, Useless Knowledge and other news sites. Ms. Zieve welcomes you comments and can be reached at: earthseed@iwon.com.

[Ed Palmer]

Let talk about Rumsfeld and Kennedy
Monday, June 27. 2005
Different Standards
The quote of the day yesterday at Political Wire (HT: Polipundit) was,

"In baseball, it's three strikes, you're out. What is it for the secretary of Defense?" (Sen. Edward Kennedy (D-MA), quoted by Newsday, to Donald Rumsfeld at a Senate hearing last week).

Alexander at Polipundit suggests one answer Secretary Rumsfeld might have given: (to paraphrase) "I don't know, but in Massachussetss it's around 30 shots and then the Senior Senator is out."

Other answers I would have LOVED the secretary of defense to give:

"Unless you're a Kennedy, it's one dead girl at the bottom of a lake and you're out."

"Well, Senator, I didn't expect to have to explain the constitution to you, but cabinet members serve at the pleasure of the president, not on the whims of senators from Massachussetts."

[sgt.lane]

ACLU: Breakfast of Champions--BIG BOWL OF FROSTED DUMBA**!!!!

[Osotogary]

While we are at it , let's sue Osama bin Ladin, the taliban, the "insurgents". I'm wondering if the ACLU will help sue the above mentioned? Wouldn't that be fair?

[MarkT]

Today the Supreme Court handed down two decisions pertaining to the 10 commandments.

Brought to us by the All Criminals Love Us, aka ACLU.

One suit was shot down but one was upheld in Kentucky.

Another pin supporting the structure of our country has been knockled out from under its support.

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"

This is known as the establishment and free exercise clause. Can anyone show me where it says there is a wall of separation between Church and State. ?

According to Old history the kind they taught in the 1950s when I went to school , the reason for this clause was, the colonists were tired of having the king tell them what or whom they shall worship.

Not to belabor the God reference, but in light of the Anti-christian, and actually anti-American assault by the ACLU on the values that have made this country great.

The supposed wall of separation was never written into the Bill of Rights, it comes from a letter written to the Danbury Bishops after the election of Thomas Jefferson. The letter was in reference to explain why he did not call for National holidays of fasting and thanksgiving.

This was the whole essence of Jeffersons letter, nothing more nothing less.

Fast forward 200 years and the ACLU would have you believe something entirely different. That a prayer at a high school football game is violating the 1st amendment.

As I said 'when I was a kid it was a free country', and what the majority said was the rule of law.

Now you have the ACLU and their convoluted interpretation of our constitution telling, private clubs, public schools that if they say the, "pledge of allegiance" because it mentions the word God
they are promoting a religion.

The whole idea shoved forward by the ACLU is non-sense, but is it they have no problem pushing the koran on any school, so why the double standard, because this corrupts the ideals of the United States. This is what the ACLU is all about.