Are more troops needed?

[Shaffer]

Should the U.S. send more troops to Iraq?

[MillRatUSMC]

Will this bring Iraq closer to being another Vietnam quamire?

QUAGMIRE

Main Entry: quag·mire
Pronunciation: 'kwag-"mIr, 'kwäg-
Function: noun

a difficult, precarious, or entrapping position. : PREDICAMENT.

PREDICAMENT

Main Entry: pre·dic·a·ment
Pronunciation: pri-'di-k&-m&nt, 1 is usually 'pre-di-k&-
Function: noun

A difficult, perplexing, or trying situation.

Anyway we cut it, it's a difficult, perplexing and trying situation.

We will need close to over 500,000 or more troops to garrison and govern Iraq to keep all these folks from killing one another.

My worst fear is becoming a reality and this isn't "Reality" TV...

Semper Fidelis
Ricardo

[mrbsox]

For my 2 cents...

NO

More troops are not needed, just loosen the reigns on the ones we have there already.

Terry

[vfm]

I agree let's lock & load and take the gloves off. You can't be nice guys and fight a war at the same time. The only way these people will respect you is to beat them into the groun first.
Semper Fi !!!
vfm

[MillRatUSMC]

Phase IV is getting to be a BIG headache.
Where do we seek guidance, on how to govern an enemy after we defeat their army?
We must include that this enemy is driven by religion, and there are other factors, Shiite, Sunni Muslims, Assyrians and Kurds among this mix.
The Assyrians are of other faiths than muslim.
They are going to IDE's besides RPG's to fight us much like Vietnam...there that word again...where we had booby traps and homemade IDE that bled us more than the fighters of the NVA/VC...
Do we look to Japan and Germany after WW II?
Now there's talk about Iran being behind some of the unrest in Iraq.
How do we deal with Iran?
No worst enemy, No better friend, it's up to you which of the two.
~ Major General Mattis, CO 1st Marine Division ~

"World Famous Body Bearers, The Last to Let You Down"

"Want to feel safe tonight? Sleep with a Marine"

"A man or woman is measured
by the footprint,
he or she leaves behind"

"They were the best you had, America,
and you turned your back on them".
~ Joe Galloway ~ Speaking about Vietnam Veterans

“Marines have always been physically and mentally tough.
We must keep squarely in our sights,
the fact that toughness can be decisive in combat.”
~ General Charles C. Krulak ~
31st Commandment of the Marine Corps

TO THOSE WHO GAVE THEIR LIVES
THAT OTHERS MAY SAY PROUDLY
I AM A MARINE

Semper Fidelis
Ricardo

[USMC-FO]

We absolutely need more troops in Iraq. There were never enough to begin with. We went through there a year ago like a hot knife through soft butter with impressive firepower and the good fortune of an enemy who did not want to fight for anything except the chance to go home and stay alive. That is a far cry from what we've delt with since then. The fact that so may reserve and guard units have been called up is ample evidence that we're running low of the right kind of troops. I won't even touch the issue of whether going there was a good idea to have gotten in here in the first place. The fact is we're there now with far to few troops to do what needs to be done. Much as many would like to "MOAB" the place it ain't gonna happen. So we're stuck in this sh*t hole of a sand pile without enough people to do their jobs safely and a government that is to politically afraid to admit they have no real workable plan.

[Toby M]

These people have been dealing with one form of violence or another for hundreds (if not thousands) of years, let our people go in and do their jobs without hamstringing them with politics! Give them the violence they so richly deserve!! They hunger for death-give it to them...If we can't do the job right, brings our troops home. No one will care but us...

[tophor]

I agree with mrbsox we should just loosen up the reigns ALOT! There are way to many of our seervice members being killed because we have to follow the laws of land warfare and the iraqi's are using gorilla tactics, as in another post SO BE IT, let's take off our gloves and fight the way that they iraqi's are. When we start fighting the way that are with the fire power that we have, and let them know that we are going to use the same tactics that those cowardly bas****s are using, maybe they will stop and think a little bit.

[fulmetaljackass]

I'm another one that agrees with mrbsox. We've got plenty of troops there. Just let the commanders, and I mean the commanders, not Pentagon personnel, run this thing. If that happened, I'm confident this would be over in a matter of months, we could bring almost everyone home, and my grandkids would be my age before things got stirred up again and we had to go back.

[MillRatUSMC]

We lost a fireteam overnight, to some it was just four Marines, but to the familes of these Marines, it was a heavy loss...We pray that their griefing will be short and may our Brothers Rest In Peace.
Can we draw on history?
On how to govern the "Peace" after we defeated an enemy.
These folks don't want a democracy in their mist because it would raise many questions of why some govern like they do.
That why radical islam is fighting this in Iraq and Afghanistan.
Before Afghanistan, I asked questions on the logistics or resupply through a region that would be hostile to us.
Because I saw Pakistan as a muslim or Islamtic country.
If the Army takes up arms or revokes against the current government of Pakistan, than those questions will no longer be moot...that will require that we sent more troops to the Middle East...

Semper Fidelis
Ricardo

[G.L.B.]

make that place a parking lot then put a Super Walmart and a McDonalds, and be done with it. Then do the Robin Williams plan for the rest of the world>>>>>F!#K UM.
Too many good people are being murdered for no reason

[newil]

Thank God the U.N. is not directing the war in Iraq. That's what makes this a winnable war and, in my opinion, adds justification to the reason we're there...the U.N. is notorious for protecting and propogating despots and tyrants all over the world. Does anyone remember the old anthem: "Thy banner makes tyranny tremble; thank God for the red, white and blue!" My prayers and thoughts are with our young men and women who are fighting this war. They are, indeed, America's finest.
Semper Fi

[Tom Clear]

If the CO in the region thinks he needs more Marines then lets give them to him. If the goverment will quit worring about the popular vote and finish what we started then all they need to do is tell it to the Marines, If the "Bad Guys" want to hide behind a stone wall they call a Holy place then we remove the wall, If they are truly Holy the will survive... Lets all pray that the powers to be see whats coming and give the go ahead. Semper Fi

[guldsoe]

I am danish. We have 600 soldiers in Iraq, thats fight together with US against this mad Jihadist. I think we should close Iraq for all journalists and observers -and then let our soldiers give them what they deserve-reel war and violence.

Semper Fi

[snipowsky]

I'm glad we got Saddam. But these people aren't worth any American dead. We need to pull out and let these people kill each other and have civil war. They are ungrateful to us and they need to fight their own battles and wars.

Did we as Americans have others fight our revolutionary war or our civil war?

AMERICAN MEN SHOULDN'T BE FIGHTING IN IRAQ AND DYING WHEN IRAQI "MEN" SHOULD BE AND CAN'T DO IT FOR THEMSELVES.

[Devildog98]

Will putting more troops in Iraq help us in our War on Terror? I surely don't think so! The threat in Iraq is gone...it's time to move to the next target! As Marines we adopt the mindset that nobody likes to fight...but someone has to know how! I couldn't agree more! I am now in the Army National Guard, and we are deploying more to Iraq than any other military branch. We are learning first hand that they don't want democracy, and they don't want us there! We need to refrain from trying to "change the world" and concentrate on the greater purpose...the future of this nation.

Semper Fi-

[Mahtowin]

I'm as Gung-Ho as any Marine, wearing my USMC Veteran Cap and "Once and Marine Always a Marine" jacket daily with pride. The USMC colors hang over my fireplace as does the Mamaluke Sword,which, as a WM in the 70's I was not allowed to carry. But haven't we learned anything from Vietnam? Will we need another Wall to stand before to weep for our fallen brothers and sisters? I always thought I had my PTSD under control until Iraq started. Now I cannot watch the news and am back in counseling. No, I wasn't in Nam, but I worked with Marines, especially tunnel rats, when they came home, and I have my own nightmares of what happened to some of us in the days when Women Marines weren't considered worthy to wear the uniform. Hopefully all of this has changed, but senseless wars continue to be fought, and as long as they are, there are those of us who will grieve for the fallen and pray, as I do daily, that none of my grandchildren will have to die so needlessly. As a DAV service officer, I have often said that I wish the DAV could someday go out of business, but sadly, I fear our ranks will only continue to grow.

[arnoldyG/2/5]

snipowsky
__________________________________________________ _
Did we as Americans have others fight our revolutionary war or our civil war?
__________________________________________________ _

As a matter of fact, yes we did. Without the assistance of the French of all countries, it is debatable whether or not we could have won the Revolutionary War. Research your history Marine!!!

[snipowsky]

Sorry I don't study anything of the French, including their history. They are cowards and I don't read books or watch documentaries about cowardly people.

I'm sure that is very true, but I seriously doubt they made a big impact on our new nation.

Only thing I know about the French is they shot at and killed our own men during the (D-Day) Normandy invasion. If it wasn't for the Americans they would be speaking German by now. They are ungrateful people. I've even been to France and quite frankly I could give two ****s about them or their history of helping us.

We are always there for them when they need us, but when we "need" them they aren't ever there. Like we would ever need the French to back us anyways.

Are they helping us now?

[djmadden2002]

I agree with vfm, lock and load and put a real can of whoopass on those raghead, koran readin mf$.........! Let's show them what the armed forces of the good ole United States can really do, especially our revered and beloved Corps.

Semper Fi, and God bless the Marine Corps! Good night Chesty, wherever you are! OOOHRAH!!

[arnoldyG/2/5]

snipowsky
__________________________________________________ _
I'm sure that is very true, but I seriously doubt they made a big impact on our new nation
__________________________________________________

Nor do I like the French ( in fact I hate them), it is not French history, it is American History and they were there when we needed them most (if not you wouldn't be enjoying the freedoms you have.....

[usmc4669]

snipowsky

Sorry I don't study anything of the French, including their history. They are cowards and I don't read books or watch documentaries about cowardly people.
I'm sure that is very true, but I seriously doubt they made a big impact on our new nation.
Only thing I know about the French is they shot at and killed our own men during the (D-Day) Normandy invasion. If it wasn't for the Americans they would be speaking German by now. They are ungrateful people. I've even been to France and quite frankly I could give two ****s about them or their history of helping us.
We are always there for them when they need us, but when we "need" them they aren't ever there. Like we would ever need the French to back us anyways.
Are they helping us now?

You know sniupowsky now I know why the South lost the war between the states (Civil War), it wasn't that the North was better than the South, the French was helping the South.

Look at Canada, that were the French lives, and one of the reasons that Canada is so screwed up, I'm going to get a reply from one of our Marines who lives in Canada, got my flack jacket on Big Y.]:banana:

Then I also have been to France, Had a very nice time in Cannes on the French Riviera, this was back in 48 when you got more for a bar of soap. "Don't The Girls All Get Prettier At Closing Time", "Couldn't Love Have Picked A Better Place To Die". Please don't knock the ladies, they were nice to us back then.

[b]Machinegunners get more! Get more what, easy living?[/b

[HardJedi]

Originally posted by snipowsky
Sorry I don't study anything of the French, including their history. They are cowards and I don't read books or watch documentaries about cowardly people.

I'm sure that is very true, but I seriously doubt they made a big impact on our new nation.

Only thing I know about the French is they shot at and killed our own men during the (D-Day) Normandy invasion. If it wasn't for the Americans they would be speaking German by now. They are ungrateful people. I've even been to France and quite frankly I could give two ****s about them or their history of helping us.

We are always there for them when they need us, but when we "need" them they aren't ever there. Like we would ever need the French to back us anyways.

Are they helping us now?


Lord, do we really need to fight about the french? And yes, they did help us in the revolution, and fought us later, and helped us again. a people who do not study thier own history, have no past, and no future.

[usmc4669]

HardJedi

Lord, do we really need to fight about the french?

Heck no, more fun fighting over French fries.

[snipowsky]

I speak my mind like the constitution says I have the right to and another Marine wants to verbally assualt me calling me an Ahole and telling me I need to be squared away?

Sorry Sgt. Arnold but you might have blasted away the morale of your troops and belittled them when you was in the Corps, but this Marine thinks its funny as hell you have to verbally assualt to make a point!

Your brand of leadership never worked did it? I bet every single one of your troops hated you! Can't say I blame them either. And yes I remember my American history, but I intentionally forget that part because the French forgot about all our good deeds.

If you love the French so much, and love their history so much. Move to Canada or France. I would never verbally assualt another Marine for his opinions but you did. That just goes to show what type of character you really have, and that is sad and pathetic.

Semper Fi "brother"!

[HardJedi]

are you kidding me Snipowsky? What Marine Corps did YOU serve in? Specially if you were infantry and an 0331, I am SURE you put up with more than that. Hell, cussing and name calling was a part of LIFE in the Infantry, at least, it was in an 0311 platoon.

And, To question another Marines Leadership ability? especially one who outranks you? and to say that everyone must have hated him? How would you know? that seems kinda harsh to me. I feel you have the right to say as you wish, and maybe name calling here is out of line, but come one MAn!

[snipowsky]

No HardJedi it don't bother me at all. I think it's a bit harsh name calling when he personally doesn't know me. I just think it's funny he has to verbally assualt someone to make himself feel better. He has no rank over me anymore! He is a civilian just like me. I give respect where I get it and he already messed that up.

Cuss words don't hurt me, but when it comes from a "fellow Marine" maybe it does. That doesn't matter though, my point is don't call me names and expect me to be cool. Sgt. or not, I am a civilian now so I could care less about his rank.

He obviously never learned the Golden Rule of life.


P.S. I never heard a 03 who didn't cuss, but that's not my point. It's all about showing respect, because that's how you get respect, and I won't stoop to his level. IT'S CHILDISH PERIOD.

[cjwright90]

And if you get orders for Baghdad?

[thedrifter]

WE DON'T TOLERATE PERSONAL ATTACKS ON MEMBERS...........TAKE IT TO PM'S AND/OR E-MAILS.....

Ellie

[arnoldyG/2/5]

Yes, Ma'am

[cjwright90]

Thanks, Miss Ellie. I did not see anyone calling anyone names, but somehow it got interpreted that way. We are all on the same team, guys ( Ladies, /miss Ellie).

[thedrifter]

Thank You Marines

With all Your Energies....I need to bottle it Up and Send it Iraq...to Help Your Brothers and Sisters.....LOL

We try to say to Respect Everyones Opinion....We might not agree to it....but Respect it....So it takes a little more of your time to see if that party can see it your way.....but that is in all the fun....


Ellie

[snipowsky]

Thank you Ms. Ellie. My point exactly. I know Roger wouldn't like a Marine being cursed at just for his beliefs and opinions.

[usmc4669]

snipowsky just a simple yes or no would be all you needed to say, Did we as Americans have others fight our revolutionary war or our civil war? had nothing to do with the post. Who is Sgt. Arnold anyway, you sure wasn't very nice to him, is that anyway to respect a Marine Sgt? As Gomer Pile would have said, shame, shame, shame.

HardJedi, we all have gotten off of the subject, haven't we?

thedrifter, ATTENTION ON DECK..................you are so right Ellie, things were getting a little out of hand, got off of the subject. I have seen this happen more than once on post.

[cjwright90]

I agree respect all of us. Does not matter if we are in or out.

[greensideout]

4669,

Are you calling Marines a**holes again in PM's?

I thought we already covered that---LOL.

[GySgtRet]

Let the Marines that are allready there do the job. We don't need any more casualties. My 7 cents worth.

Semper Fidelis

[Flammer]

Time for a FFZ !!

[paul g fleming]

For more Marines and less army is the problem

[David Nix]

give the field comanders what they need . if its more marines so be it . if not just say go get it done and leave them alone .i do believe the news media has no buisness with troupes . we get to mutch half truths with them around ,they dont mnow the situation as the comanders do so keep them away from actual events or as far away as possible.

[Scotty1023]

I can't believe they send in 1400 Marines or 1700 Marines to take a city. Send in a Division! Show overwhelming power and don't let up until they behave. Those kind of people understand one thing, a 2x4 across the head. Some are uneducated thugs. Put em out and put in some Iraqi mercenaries to keep them in place. Semper Fi and God bless all those Marines fighting and dying for our national intrests.

[usmc4669]

Send back Staff Sgt. Ivan "Chip" Frederick and his team, they seem to be able to do the job right, show no mercy. My dry sense of humor.:banana: ::banana:

[Jarhead1775]

I agree with snipowsky--our troops shoudn't be there, as long
as our troops are there, there will be more body bags and more
sadness. Iraq needs to solve its own problems.

[snipowsky]

I like that! "The only thing they understand is a 2x4 upside the head". That's awesome Marine! That's a really good way to win hearts and minds. Bashing them upside the head with a 2x4. Why didn't we think of this before? lol Personally I think the MOAB on Fallujah would work better, but that's my two cents worth.

Semper Fi brothers!

[USMC_INFANTRY]

YEAH!!! I WANT TO BE ONE OF THEM IF THEY SEND MORE.

USMC4LIFE!!!

[DebSantos]

Jarhead1775 and Snipowski, I do respect your opinion. How ever, it is just that! (your opinion) Perhaps you served at a time when we were not at war, or maybe you have been in war, whatever the case maybe it dosent matter that you think our troops shouldnt be there . The fact is they are there! In my opinion, and it is just that! (my opinion) where there is war there is death. In any war there has and will always be those that dont agree we should be there. Please remember this, we have not had a draft in almost 40 years! Every body serving active now including my son and nephew made a choice to serve! people should under stand that first and far most when they join any branch, it is to serve and defend! Some times to defend is to die! (God bless those who have) I also feel, we should be there, our men and women are doing one hell of a job over there and great things are being done for the people of Irac. But if you listen to our American media you will never know this! I will support our troops 110% and if they need help, send in the help! That is what their trained for! God bless them all !!!!!!!

[DebSantos]

In reply to..........

AMERICAN MEN SHOULDN'T BE FIGHTING IN IRAQ AND DYING WHEN IRAQI "MEN" SHOULD BE AND CAN'T DO IT FOR THEMSELVES




So tell me , Would you rather they bring it here to America?
Ya know snipowsky (sorry if I spelled your name wrong) Its now all black and white , sometimes you have to read between the lines............................................. .........(for the record ,this is not a racial quote)


edited.......
Name is now spelled Right....
Ellie

[snipowsky]

YES IRAQI TROOPS SHOULD BE DYING FOR THEIR OWN COUNTRY AND NOT AMERICAN TROOPS!

THEY CAN'T BECAUSE A MAJORITY OF IRAQI'S DON'T HAVE THE INTESTINAL FORTITUDE TO DO SO.

And your comment about letting them bring it here DebSantos...

If you haven't already forgotten they have brought it here. Once in 1993 and again in 2001. We even have the enemy living amongst us! Al Queda cells in America. I think our Government has its priorities all out of whack. Whatever happened to finding and capturing Osama bin Laden? Seems to me Osama isn't the priority he used to be. Why is that? Have we all forgot about September 11th already? I know I haven't! AND I NEVER WILL!

If Iraq was any threat to America the Israelis would have already delt with them. They weren't even a threat to the Israelis. So you tell me why it is we attacked them instead of using all this manpower to find Osama? With all this might we'd have Osama by now! Makes you wonder what this war is really about! You sure it isn't only about oil supplies, gas prices and paybacks for the attempted assasination of George H. Bush? If you haven't thought about these things...you aren't thinking period!

As HardJedi would say:

My words cannot offend you. You can only CHOOSE to take offense.

As I would say:

I CHOOSE NOT TO LISTEN TO IGNORANCE or even a liberal for that matter!


Semper Fi!

[DebSantos]

(in reply to your coment)

If you haven't already forgotten they have brought it here. Once in 1993 and again in 2001. We even have the enemy living amongst us! Al Queda cells in America.


Snipowsky, Of course I have not forgotten! Maybe some day Ill tell you all about my loved one who never made it home from work that day! Dont be so quick my friend , you see a great deal of Binladens support came out of Irac! And who's to say were not on Binladen's @$$ now ???? Just because the media doesnt talk about our troops is Pakistan , doesnt mean were not there!
Maybe things were done in an order that most of us do not agree with but what is done is done! And HELL yes I would much rather have the war going on over there and not over here! As for you choosing not to listen to IGNORANCE maybe you should choose to seek other means of media . It sounds to me like you watch to much CNN. and as far as liberal goes , Not this girl!!!! Let me guess you probably think John Kerry could do better. If Bush pulled out after American lives were already lost, that would be a John Kerry slap in the face to those who didnt make it home! You see in my opinion (and it is just that) it is those who lost their lives in this war and many wars before who define SEMPER FI and it is because of them that we can disagree my friend.

[snipowsky]

Sorry I don't watch the CLINTON NEWS NETWORK. I hope we do have Special Forces inside Pakistan looking for Osama. I prefer to watch FOXNEWS if I have to be watching the news. Anymore I don't watch much news on the tv because there is never anything good reported. I know we are making progress in Iraq. It might be slow, but it is progress.

I'm very sorry for your loss! But as far as John Kerry goes I'd rather be dead then vote for him. I support Bush even if he doesn't make the best decisions, he is all about protecting the homeland. Or so he says! I guess we will see in time if his policies work or don't work.

Honestly I think it's time for career politicians to step down and get some people in Government who really care about where this country is headed. Seems to me like some only want to serve their special needs first and then help America last!

Only my two cents...

I vote and that don't change anything so what else can be done?

[cjwright90]

But if you don't vote, how can you complain one way or the other? True, Snip, you are only one voice. I am only one voice and so is Deb. But all the one voices together make the numbers that count.

[SemperFiGirl79]

Ya know, I sincerely wish that our military (men & women) could decide...I wish it was their choice. Since they are the ones having to do the job & putting their lives on the line! This world is so screwed up! The people in power, those in control of the "desicion making" should not be making the decisions. argh! And I realize that this is not a realistic point of view...but it's just the way I feel.

[HardJedi]

Originally posted by SemperFiGirl79
Ya know, I sincerely wish that our military (men & women) could decide...I wish it was their choice. Since they are the ones having to do the job & putting their lives on the line! This world is so screwed up! The people in power, those in control of the "desicion making" should not be making the decisions. argh! And I realize that this is not a realistic point of view...but it's just the way I feel.

Glad you realized it wasn't realistic. If the mmilitary were given the power.........good LORD ! then there'd be a real mess, cause then it would be the Generals making the choices, and what are they? You don't get to the Rank of General without being SOMETHING of a political monkey for SOMEBODY.

Someone once said that our form of governmetn was the worst form ever invented, except that it works. Well, I'd have to agree (except that it only works most of the time for some of the people) :D

[HardJedi]

Originally posted by snipowsky
[B

As HardJedi would say:

My words cannot offend you. You can only CHOOSE to take offense.


Semper Fi! [/B]

HEY! I WAS QUOTED! WHOO HOOOO!!!! wait till my girlfriend see THAT! man, I am SOOOO in tonight! LOL

( sorry, just a little humor)

[snipowsky]

lol@HardJedi

[DebSantos]

Hardjedi, You go boy!!!! Make her Proud!!(lol)


Snipowsky, May the good Lord bless you with a little tonight as well!!!! (smile)

[snipowsky]

lol@DebSantos! Thank you!