I've Been Putting This Off For a Long Time...

[Asator]

Afternoon Marines, first poster here.

I'm not quite sure where to start off, so I'll just start doing a brain dump. I'm a prior Sergeant, 7041/0916 with a little over a year of IRR Duty left on my contract. Back in 2006, I was told that if I went in as an Open Contract, I would get an 03 MOS like I wanted. I'm sure you all know where this is going.

Since I was a kid, I had always wanted to join the military and get into an SF position of some sort. Well, fate would have it another way and I got stuck riding a desk for four years. My only outlet for my frustration was being a Martial Arts Instructor and taking Tactical Shooting course slots whenever they would come around.

At the end of my Active Contract, I was slated to go CI/HUMINT. I passed the screening board and got the acceptance letter; however, I made one fatal mistake: I went home on leave for two weeks before signing the contract. I thought home is where I wanted to be and ended up EASing. A few years later, I have a degree in IT, a house after living in multiple apartments, and a girlfriend of 2+ years that I can see myself marrying.

Thing is, something just hasn't felt right since I've been out. Getting stuck in my standard-issue office chair for 4 years despite my original intentions left me overall unfulfilled and still wanting to go out and get some. I know most of you may ask "well, why did you get out in the first place?", and I honestly don't have an answer to that.

I'm tired of sitting at a desk when I'd rather be out in MOUT town or at the range. So, I guess I realize I made a huge mistake and I should have stayed in and lat-moved, but now I'm asking for help. I go through bouts of severe depression when I think about what I wanted to do with my life and the fact that I'm now 26 and nearing the point where most SF Schools won't take me once I age another year (correct me if I'm wrong).

The other thing to this dilemma is the old girl. Please spare me the "you ain't married yet, son. Go do your thing" bs. I heard all of that my entire career in the Marines. It's a different situation when you've lived with them for the entire stint of your relationship. She may as well be my wife. What can I do to relieve myself of this desk that I've been sitting in almost my entire adult life?

-I've considered LEO, but I heard that I'd have to patrol for at least 2 years before I could try out for SWAT or Sniper school.

-I've considered Army Reserves and have actually been in an Army Recruiting office to speak with someone:
1. I'd only get E4, and it probably won't even be Corporal E4.
2. I'm not sure if our relationship can handle the strain of a 1 year Deployment.
3. I'd eventually try out for SF, and they have Reserve SF Units (which is weird to me, but beneficial).

-I've contacted a Prior Service USMC Recruiter about lat-moving to an 03 MOS and going Reserves. He told me I missed the mark by 1 month due to a new MarAdmin. It states that an E5 with 2 years TIG cannot lat-move.

-Considered MARSOC but again, I don't know how difficult deploying with a loved one back home is.

I guess I'm just asking for advice. How do I beat the 1st CivDiv blues, what are my options, what suggestions do you guys have for relationships being put on Deployment strain, similar stories, etc. etc.

Yes, I know and weighed the potential implications of getting into an 03 Unit as an NCO. I've read the stories and heard the complaints. I would have done it and listened to a non-boot LCpl. I'm not dumb enough to assume I know more about combat just because I have more chevrons on my collar. People's lives would depend on me not being full of myself.

**inb4 "lol POG just stay at your desk."

[advanced]

I'm a Nam vet (class of 68-69), served with the 1/5 and 3/5. Believe me, you wouldn't want to have been with us. Nothing but hardship and death all around us. Anyway, being an 03 doesn't seem to be an option for you at this time so let it go.

Do not dismiss becoming a Law Enforcement Officer. When I got out in the beginning of 70 I was recruited and became a Police Officer. I had 1 heck of an experience riding the projects for my 1st 5 years, then I became a SWAT officer. Many heavy experiences feeding my adrenaline addiction. With a degree you could also become a FED, but I do believe that the "excitement" would be in becoming a large city officer in the projects, if you can pass the entry requirements.

Benefits would be better pay, no long deployments in **** holes, more personal decision making, satisfaction in helping people directly and taking ass holes off the streets.

Being a Marine with a degree would open a lot of doors for you.

Point is you must make a decision to be either a "doer" or a "dreamer."

[thewookie]

I guess I'm just asking for advice. How do I beat the 1st CivDiv blues, what are my options, what suggestions do you guys have for relationships being put on Deployment strain, similar stories, etc. etc.


Hey Marine, long winded post but you got it all in there. From my chair it sounds like the girl is the main barrier or point of resistance for you. So, you need to man up and marry her, and then settle down into the IT world. Or get rid of her and boot stomp back in. :)

As far as beating the first civ div blues, man that just takes time. There is no job in the civilian world, maybe LEO - but very few occupations where you get close to that feeling of being in.

Unfortunately we only realize this once we get out. Happens to all of us, or those who didn't do twenty but look back and wonder why.

Just find something you love, and more than one thing if you're like me and get bored quickly - and give it all you have.

Easier said than done.

I have no relationship advice. I am married to a woman I dumped back in the day to go over to Greece and party like a rockstar. Then once I got out we hooked back up and now I'm "living the dream" -- wife, crumb snatcher, house, dog, blah, blah. It's tough to be a Marine or door kicker and be in a relationship. If i were you i would pick one 'goal' and stick to it for a few years. If you get rid of the girl you can go boot stomp for a few years and fill that void, then find another girl.

Or you can settle down and deal with it.......

Good luck

[Asator]

advanced,

Thanks for the response. How often did you get range time as a normal LEO? What sort of training courses are offered to standard LEOs? Were you eligible for SWAT before that 5 year mark you mentioned? Did the SWAT training resemble legitimate military tactics, or was it just a bunch of Cops speculating? The reason I ask, and the reason I'm on the fence about Army Infantry, is that after being in the Marines I don't want to do something else and just feel like a kid with a squirt gun.

Semper.

[Asator]

thewookie,

I appreciate the feedback. You've given me some thinking points to consider, thanks. Yes, hindsight is always 20/20, and I should have just taken my reenlistment package and run with it. I can't just give the old girl the boot, though. I'd be doing the same thing with her that I did with the Marines: ending it and regretting it soon after. I guess life is about learning and moving on despite your mistakes. Perhaps I'll find something to fill the void soon enough.

[Rocky C]

So, do you work at Kent State University or are you a student there ?

[Asator]

Rocky,

I was a student there at one point. Why do you ask?

[Rocky C]

Because if your an ITT Tech like your profile says and you are working at Kent, that seems like a great job and a great life.

Most than most people have right now...

[Asator]

Under colleges attended it says "Kent State University, ITT Tech". ITT Tech is a Technical Institute, not a job title. I work at a small business in Cuyahoga Falls, OH. In my eyes, it doesn't matter how much or how little I have. If I'm unhappy, I'm unhappy. I won't excel doing what I'm not happy doing.

[Rocky C]

Oh, because in your post you never mentioned that.
You said you have a degree in IT, your own home, a nice girl, etc.

We are only trying to help a Brother here because you asked a multitude of questions.

But, if you are unhappy, your unhappy.

Have you thought about being a Private Contractor to fill the void ?

There are members here who are.

[advanced]

Being a Police Officer is much like being a Marine. The training is hard, and the streets are hard. My academy was 16 weeks and there was a weekly test, fail 1 test and you're out. PT every day. Range training is with pistols or revolvers and shotguns. We shot from 7, 21 and 50 yards. Very realistic training and we learned to clear buildings, much like Hue City but you can't just blow the **** out of the place and then go in. You'll also have yearly inservice training, qualifying at least every year, and you can also go to the ranges on your own.

SWAT took me 5 years because I was in the 1st class back in 75, there was no SWAT prior to that in most departments. But you have to be good. I was only 1 of 22 chosen out of an 1,800 man department. Calm, cool, level headed and not afraid to pull the trigger if need be. You'll do so much shooting, combat courses that you'll get tired of it. Drill, drill, drill! You'll become proficient in hand to hand, knife, or just using whatever is available way beyond what I learned as a Marine. You'll repel from helicopters, use full auto weapons, granades and depending on your ability you'll be chosen for sniper, perimeter lockdown or an entry team. I was on 1 of the 4 man entry "Cobra" teams. We neutralized the barricaded hostage situations, and we took them all alive during my time (much higher level compared to just killing them). Though I haven't been through Recon or SF training I would suggest the training is much like that.

But, just being an ordinary street cop is what I enjoyed best. Lots of action, I've been to 8 separate shootings during 1 evening once. Being in high crime areas where we had 3 new holdups going on an no cars to send because we were all tied up on other crimes. Even today when I hear the sirens or see the blue lights, well, it's still like the "call of the wild" to me. And as a benny, you won't believe all the women you'll meet in all the clubs and bars and the nurses at the hospitals and the attorneys and on and on and on.

I actually preferred being a cop compared to being a Marine because even back in the 70's we were treated with a much greater degree of respect. It was kind of like being a Centurion back in the legions, we were the law givers. There's an old MC slogan, "you can't understand it from the outside, and I can't explain it from the inside." I just thought of something, just like the MC the cops always kept sending me into all the **** holes. I guess we like what we're good at. Just saying.

[Asator]

Rocky,

My father actually just suggested that, funny you should mention it. I'm doing a lot of research on that particular subject, but there doesn't seem to be a lot of information on it. From what I understand, most PMC companies won't take someone who isn't a combat veteran? Please fill me in if you have relevant information.

[Asator]

advanced,

Again, thank you for all of the information. I sent some questions to a couple Police Academies about an hour ago. Hopefully I'll get some responses here soon.

[thewookie]

most PMC companies won't take someone who isn't a combat veteran?

Can't find out unless you apply.

They like clearances, with a good attitudes - and a willingness to learn.

If you want to be a gunslinger then combat vet/SF background is a plus. But plenty of people work overseas who have neither.

Why not try for something along the lines of what you already know.

Personally, I would explore reenlistment options if you want/are willing to go overseas -- while you are still 'young.'

[Asator]

Well, I have a SECRET and put in all of the paperwork for TS/SCI. It came back as "eligible" but never went any further since I EASd. I'm on the fence between this whole LEO thing and Army Reserves. I think my problem is that even I don't know what I want to do.

[Zulu 36]

I should point out that getting a police job in this job market is hard. Many departments have laid-off officers or have hiring freezes. Even if you apply to an agency that is hiring, there is no guarantee they will hire you. You might bomb the written test or come across poorly on oral boards. Same thing with SWAT.

Assuming you got hired on a department, if it has a SWAT unit, openings don't occur on a constant basis unless it's a really large unit (like LA, etc). You might get a chance early, or maybe not for years. Most larger departments won't take inexperienced officers onto the SWAT unit as they are looking for a track record of personal initiative and good work without disciplinary issues. Smaller teams are more likely to take you on earlier in your career.

Firearms training for the average PO depends a lot on the agency. Some only put you on the range once or twice a year, others more often. SWAT units do get more range time than the average PO, even in a department with an aggressive firearms training program. Bullets cost a lot of money and even police departments are finding them hard to get these days.

Police academies will usually accept you as a "pre-service" cadet, which means the tuition comes out of your pocket and you don't necessarily have a job at graduation. Being already academy trained is a plus in getting hired, but still not a guarantee.

Police work is the same as being a grunt in one respect: It consists mostly of sheer boredom interspersed with moments of sheer terror.

Good luck with your decision.

[HM3 Doc Wilder]

Thank you All for this Inside Education.I am Honored and Prevailaged,to Know you.Asator,since you are a Martial Arts Instructor,you have some Clout there.There are Agencies that will Hire you,like Borough of T.A.F. like my Friend DD.3rd Degree Black Belt in Tai Kwon Do,and Knows 20 Styles of Kung Fu(Systems).Don't put yourself down.It's Only by the Grace of God,that I'm still here.These Marines that answered you really have Balls.Have you Ever See a man Blown to pieces,or Bleed Out in Two,maybe Three Minutes,more.This causes a Shock,that may Prevent you from Being a Hired Gun, Cowboy.Yeah,you can get over it,but you will Never Be the Same Person you are Now;Ever Again.I Apologize,to you Police,S.W.A.T.,and Marines.I can't Hold a Candle to You Guys,but I've seen People Go Mad.Just putting in my 2 cents.You have told Asator very Well,and Make me feel Humble..........I am nothing Compared to You Guys!

[Rocky C]

Your the Best Doc !!!

Semper Fi Brother

[HM3 Doc Wilder]

Thanks again Rocky,Not me but the Real Front Line Corpsman,and Medic's that Gave their Lives,DocGreek included.I got a Glimpse and still feel alien, different than Civilians,even now 45 years later.I could have done more! and should have done more!

[HM3 Doc Wilder]

Half my FMF Class got Killed doing their Real Work.Here I am, retired, doing Nothing.Yeah,I made it,big deal.

[HM3 Doc Wilder]

Do you want to feel like this when you get older Avator?Think about it!........

[Tennessee Top]

Please allow me to add my two cents worth since my situation was vaguely familiar to yours in some respects.

I got out after my first enlistment which was a dumb mistake. This was back in 76 when Jimmy Carter was president, there were no jobs, he granted amnesty to the draft dodgers, and brought the boat people over from Southeast Asia. I used my GI Bill and went to college fulltime which meant living with my parents. Then, I sent for my Nicaraguan sweetheart and married her (all my friends told me she was just looking for a green card but, as you are experiencing, love is blind and makes rational decisions impossible). After a year, my old recruiter called me out of the blue and said he could get me back in if I wanted to reenlist; keeping my Sgt chevrons would require a waiver but he would submit the paperwork. The rank waiver came back approved and the wife was tired of living with my folks so we reenlisted. After 3 years in the FMF, we finally moved into base housing onboard Camp Pendleton; shortly after, my unaccompanied orders to OKI showed up unexpectedly. The wife stayed in our housing unit while I went away for 12 months. She made it to about the halfway point when Jody showed up. So, my friends were right about the green card afterall. We were divorced and she and Jody got married. There is no green card in your situation but I did see how hard long term separations are on relationships. To be fair, many of my friend's marriages did survive their unaccompanied tours overseas (some didn't).

You have not mentioned discussing anything with your girlfriend. If you have, how does she feel about being a military spouse? Have you been honest about the separations and pay/benefits? Does she understand the USMC expects/demands the mission comes first (can she be #2)? Is she aware the sea services have the highest divorce rate among the military branches (because of the deployment tempo)? Our Commandant has made it clear one of his priorities is getting our Corps back to its maritime/forward deployed roots and away from static/land-locked conflicts more suitable for the Army. This suggests more time aboard ships/more deployments (nation's 911 force) and less time sitting at a base stateside. Of course, budget constraints will have a bearing on all this.

It's pretty clear, the girlfriend is a major player in your decision making. If she is against you going back in that closes that door.

[Asator]

Thanks for the reply, Top. A lot of good information there. I've since decided to go the LEO route. A local Department has a spot open, and I've already spoken with someone about taking the Agility Test and written test. If I do well and get selected, they'll pay for my Police Academy and pay me a Police Officer's salary while I am there. The benefits and pay are incredible and there is an on-site shooting range. The more I thought about it, the more it made sense. There are a myriad of different departments in the Police Force, so I should never get bored. I can use my Marine Corps experience to leverage a spot for SWAT when the time comes, and I can always try out for detective if I get bored of patrolling. I've spoken with my other half, and she says this sounds like something I would and should be doing. She's ok with me getting stuck working nights and holidays, because it's better than being totally gone for up to a year.

I want to thank you all for your though provoking and engaging responses. This is a great community. Semper Fi.

[Rocky C]

Outstanding Marine.

Best of luck to you.

Don't be a stranger around here.

Keep us posted Brother.

Semper Fi,
Rocky

[Ceya]

You can also look into Secret Service - both agent and uniformed sections.

I was accidently recruited by them ( I was on recruiter assitance), they called the office asked for Marines getting out. There were none in the office. I decided to go check for my self, and when I got there 20 guys was there all Marines retired, vets and reserves.

The uniformed does the same as Yankee Whites and Embassy Marines but you stay in DC.

You could look into that also.

S/F,
CEYA!

[thewookie]

You can also look into Secret Service - both agent and uniformed sections.



Good point, and a great gig. One of my closest friends from the Corps works for the UD. He's got the life. No degree required but you need to be squeaky clean.