Leadership tips?

[DS12]

This may not be an exact Marine question but I figured this forum would accept my question.

As some of you may know from my other thread, I am in a military school and I'm the S-4. Now I know staff members don't really display leadership as much as platoon sergeants and first sergeants and such but I would still love to have tips from NCO's, SNCO's, and officers.

My rank as of now is c/SSG and I am the Supply Sergeant for my school. Anyway how do I handle those who are violating the uniform and making it look like **** effectively? I mean making them do push-ups isn't going to solve all problems and it makes me feel weird to yell or discipline those who are in the same grade as me since they've been with me since the beginning. I'm usually a laid back and chill guy but I have a feeling people will take my personality for granted.

Another thing, my school has a program similar to these service academies with the whole calling freshmen certain names like plebes and rats and all good NCO's and officers are assigned to a group of freshmen and we mentor them by teaching them drill, ranks, and teaching them military knowledge. I don't want to be like last year and be chill and laid back with my freshmen and be the cool guy while my SNCO partner did all the work and disciplining, I don't want to be all D.I. on them but I want them to know I'm not the one to **** with. How can I establish that?

Any other tips on how to be a good NCO would be great too. Thanks in advance, Marines.

[Marine1011]

My advice would be to hold off for awhile on this. Your tone in this post and in some of your others doesn't indicate good leadership qualities. And you admitted to still smoking marijuana, but you say you are williing to give it up in order to join the Marines.
All in all, it sounds like you are too self-focused to be an effective leader, no offense at all, just one of those things. Good luck to you.

[DS12]

My advice would be to hold off for awhile on this. Your tone in this post and in some of your others doesn't indicate good leadership qualities. And you admitted to still smoking marijuana, but you say you are williing to give it up in order to join the Marines.
All in all, it sounds like you are too self-focused to be an effective leader, no offense at all, just one of those things. Good luck to you.
I have leadership qualities and have used them at many times. I'm a leader which has led me in my position but I want to be a great leader if you get what I'm saying. As far as the marijuana smoking, it's more of a social thing. I do it about once or twice a month, doesn't make it right compared to a stoner who smokes all the time but I'm trying to discuss things to improve and work on for this school year and not discuss my private life. I haven't smoked in about a month and a half and most likely will keep it that way. Besides, almost all of us have skeletons in our closet. But yeah.. just asking for a few tips, that's all.

[Lisa 23]

I haven't smoked in about a month and a half and most likely will keep it that way.

Most likely......it's either you will quit or you won't quit, there's no in between.

[DS12]

Most likely......it's either you will quit or you won't quit, there's no in between.
I will since it's getting boring.

[Phantom Blooper]

Expensive too..........

[DS12]

Expensive too..........
Hell yeah.

[Marine1011]

The "tone" is still there. You would do better to change it a little, instead of trying too hard to fit in. You probably have great capabilities or you wouldn't be in a leadership position right now, but there is still that element of self-focus.
Good luck.

[DS12]

The "tone" is still there. You would do better to change it a little, instead of trying too hard to fit in. You probably have great capabilities or you wouldn't be in a leadership position right now, but there is still that element of self-focus.
Good luck.
Wasn't quite aware with my tone but you have a point. Thanks for the first actual advice and thanks.

[Quinbo]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMzfIlk9cjo&sns=fb

[03Mike]

Ahhh... Benedictine High School. Know it fairly well.

Okay, at this level, what are some tips for a cadet/student in a leadership billet.

1. Set the example. Make sure that your uniform is always squared away. Make sure that all of your "stuff" is in one bag -- it absolutely has to be "do as I do" and not "do as I say."

2. Remember your position - this is high school, and while you may hold "rank" over the other students / cadets there, it isn't the military. You will be a more effective cadet leader if you have their cooperation rather than if you are an authoritarian.

3. Set and uphold the school's standards -- I'm sure Benedictine has a new cadet handbook. Those are the standards, not ones that you make up. If you start implementing your own standards, then your cadets aren't going to know what to do in absence of direct instructions.

4. Don't be a d*ck - seriously, uphold the standards, gig the guys who need to be gigged. Don't let a friend slide when you gig someone else for the same thing. So be firm but fair.

5. Don't try to be everyone's friend - if you are a cadet staff sergeant, then try to make sure that the guys you hang with are also NCOs / SNCOs / officers. It's really tough to be respected by the other cadets if there is any belief that you are showing favoritism (whether you are or not).

6. Don't be afraid to roll up your sleeves. Part of setting the example is to not ask your people to do things you won't do. While you hold rank / billet, it doesn't absolve you of pulling your share of unhappy duty.

7. Don't take advantage of your rank - as an NCO or SNCO, you should make sure that all cadets of lower rank get through the chow line ahead of you. Same goes for when they have to queue up at the quartermasters office. The only exception is when it involves something no one wants to do - in which case, you are at the front of the line to get the crappy experience first. That includes mandated study time -- that doesn't mean that you get to goof off.

8. There is a time for yelling and raising your voice -- but they are rare. No one is going to respect you if you are always yelling. Save it for when you need it. I guess that's what you mean by not wanting "to be all DI on them". You specifically ask about what to do when someone is all dorked up in their uniform. Give them the opportunity to square themselves away - make sure that they know what your expectations are, make sure that you're not letting someone else slide for the same thing, then hold them accountable. Push ups are a great incentive, but after a while, it will become obvious that they have not impact on some folks. Consider having them teach an impromptu class on uniform regulations and the proper way to wear the uniform -- that may have a positive impact as they talk about the right way to wear it and they look like a sack or doorknobs - a little self-humiliation can go a long way in front of their peers. If that doesn't work, then gig them and give them extra tours. If that doesn't work, send them up the chain of command.

Bottom line, use the system - that's what it is there for. But, be advised, if you slide by the regulations (see number 1 above) then no one else is going to do anything you say. If during down time you're always shooting the breeze about all the "smoking and joking" that you do when you're off post/campus, well, then you'll get what you get. Don't pretend to be a saint, but don't be an obvious dirtbag either. You have to set the example - but don't be phony or they'll see straight through it.

Remember number 2 above -- you're not in the military - you are in a military high school. I don't mean that in any kind of denegrating way - just as a way of lending perpesctive.

Hope that helps.

[DS12]

Ahhh... Benedictine High School. Know it fairly well.

Okay, at this level, what are some tips for a cadet/student in a leadership billet.

1. Set the example. Make sure that your uniform is always squared away. Make sure that all of your "stuff" is in one bag -- it absolutely has to be "do as I do" and not "do as I say."

2. Remember your position - this is high school, and while you may hold "rank" over the other students / cadets there, it isn't the military. You will be a more effective cadet leader if you have their cooperation rather than if you are an authoritarian.

3. Set and uphold the school's standards -- I'm sure Benedictine has a new cadet handbook. Those are the standards, not ones that you make up. If you start implementing your own standards, then your cadets aren't going to know what to do in absence of direct instructions.

4. Don't be a d*ck - seriously, uphold the standards, gig the guys who need to be gigged. Don't let a friend slide when you gig someone else for the same thing. So be firm but fair.

5. Don't try to be everyone's friend - if you are a cadet staff sergeant, then try to make sure that the guys you hang with are also NCOs / SNCOs / officers. It's really tough to be respected by the other cadets if there is any belief that you are showing favoritism (whether you are or not).

6. Don't be afraid to roll up your sleeves. Part of setting the example is to not ask your people to do things you won't do. While you hold rank / billet, it doesn't absolve you of pulling your share of unhappy duty.

7. Don't take advantage of your rank - as an NCO or SNCO, you should make sure that all cadets of lower rank get through the chow line ahead of you. Same goes for when they have to queue up at the quartermasters office. The only exception is when it involves something no one wants to do - in which case, you are at the front of the line to get the crappy experience first. That includes mandated study time -- that doesn't mean that you get to goof off.

8. There is a time for yelling and raising your voice -- but they are rare. No one is going to respect you if you are always yelling. Save it for when you need it. I guess that's what you mean by not wanting "to be all DI on them". You specifically ask about what to do when someone is all dorked up in their uniform. Give them the opportunity to square themselves away - make sure that they know what your expectations are, make sure that you're not letting someone else slide for the same thing, then hold them accountable. Push ups are a great incentive, but after a while, it will become obvious that they have not impact on some folks. Consider having them teach an impromptu class on uniform regulations and the proper way to wear the uniform -- that may have a positive impact as they talk about the right way to wear it and they look like a sack or doorknobs - a little self-humiliation can go a long way in front of their peers. If that doesn't work, then gig them and give them extra tours. If that doesn't work, send them up the chain of command.

Bottom line, use the system - that's what it is there for. But, be advised, if you slide by the regulations (see number 1 above) then no one else is going to do anything you say. If during down time you're always shooting the breeze about all the "smoking and joking" that you do when you're off post/campus, well, then you'll get what you get. Don't pretend to be a saint, but don't be an obvious dirtbag either. You have to set the example - but don't be phony or they'll see straight through it.

Remember number 2 above -- you're not in the military - you are in a military high school. I don't mean that in any kind of denegrating way - just as a way of lending perpesctive.

Hope that helps.
Ahh... Benedictine. Faced you all many times at drill comps. Nice to have someone reply that went to a military high school. I appreciate this and I know I'm not in the military.

I appreciate all of those who commented and helped. Even if people seem to focus on what I do on my personal time. Thanks

[PJones64]

Those who spoke about "tone" have a point.

[SSgtRSD]

If you are at a military school and have the intentions of one day being a Marine, guess what? Your "personal time" will always be focused on. We are Marines 24/7 not just 9-5. The current USMC policy on substance abuse us ZERO TOLERANCE. If you want to be take. Seriously as a leader, you must lead by example. By smoking marijuana, you are not. It is great to hear you are wanting to develope your leadership abilities, good initiative. However, Do not get defensive about something you are in the wrong for.

[Phantom Blooper]

what I do on my personal time


In any branch of the military until your end of enlistment your personal time is yours persay...but you belong to the government 365 24/7 and are subjected to the UCMJ.

You need to give serious consideration on what you do with your personal time while going to school......read some of the Poolee Forums and Ask A Marine Forum threads where young potential poolees took the wrong way with their personal time and now are asking for waivers or can't join the Marines or any branch.....because your personal time can come and bite you in the azz and last for many years.

I don't know you.....but I would say that you need to quit what you are doing and if you are influenced by friends i would choose other friends ASAP.

You maybe getting away with it now....but you never know....whatcha gonna do when they come for you?

If you get caught you ain't gonna join the Marine Corps.....because as stated zero tolerance and no waivers.

One of the characteristics of a leader is to set the example.....and once you become a Marine you will be judged on your leadership abilities.

You will not be able to make decisions that may involve life and limb....if you are high.



Leadership Traits

Judgement (Can't have clear judgement whether in military school or military if you stay fuked up!)

The ability to weigh facts and possible solutions on which to base sound decisions.

Justice

Giving reward and punishment according to the merits of the case in question. The ability to administer a system of rewards and punishments impartially.

Decisiveness

The ability to make decisions promptly and announce them in a clear, forceful manner.

Initiative

Taking action in the absence of orders.

Dependability

The certainty of proper performance of duty.

Tact

The ability to deal with others with respect.

Integrity

The uprightness and soundness of moral principles. The quality of truthfulness and honesty.

Endurance

The mental and physical stamina measured by one's ability to withstand pain, fatigue, stress, and hardship.

Bearing

The creating of a favorable impression in carriage, appearance, and personal conduct at all times.

Unselfishness

Avoidance of providing for one's own comfort and personal advancement at the expense of others.

Courage

The mental quality that recognizes fear of danger or criticism, but enables one to proceed in the face of it with calmness and firmness.

Knowledge

The understanding of a science or an art. The range of one's information.

Loyalty

The quality of faithfulness to country, service, and to your seniors and subordinates.

Enthusiasm

The display of sincere interest and exuberance in the performance of duty.

Leadership Principles



Know Yourself and Seek Self Improvement.
Be Technically and Tactically Proficient.
Seek Responsibility and Take Responsibility for your Actions.
Make Sound and Timely Decisions.
Set the Example.
Know Your People and Look Out for their Welfare.
Keep Your People Informed.
Develop a Sense of Responsibility in Your Subordinates.
Ensure that the task is Understood, Supervised, and Accomplished.
Train Your People as a Team.
Employ Your Unit in Accordance with Its Capabilities.

[MOS4429]

I have leadership qualities and have used them at many times. I'm a leader which has led me in my position but I want to be a great leader if you get what I'm saying. As far as the marijuana smoking, it's more of a social thing. I do it about once or twice a month, doesn't make it right compared to a stoner who smokes all the time but I'm trying to discuss things to improve and work on for this school year and not discuss my private life. I haven't smoked in about a month and a half and most likely will keep it that way. Besides, almost all of us have skeletons in our closet. But yeah.. just asking for a few tips, that's all.


SON, you missed the whole point of his post!

Let's try it again. "My advice would be to hold off for awhile on this. Your tone in this post and in some of your others doesn't indicate good leadership qualities. And you admitted to still smoking marijuana, but you say you are williing to give it up in order to join the Marines.
All in all, it sounds like you are too self-focused to be an effective leader, no offense at all, just one of those things. Good luck to you." (emphasis added)

Now, read what you wrote him. First word? "I". Next sentence? "I'm," and then "but I want to be great..."

Now, read some of the posts that follow that list character traits and qualities, and see where "I" fits.

I'm not trying to give you a bad time, but this is crucial to leadership. I heard a speaker a couple days ago talking about when he was in the Army and became a Sergeant and how rank had its privileges and he could go to the front of the chow line.

In the Marine Corps, you do not look out for numero uno first.

[Sgt Leprechaun]

And in the Marine Corps, that Sergeant would have known he eats....LAST. Or, after all his Privates, PFC's, Lance Corporal's, and Corporals....

And when he gets his chow, the SNCO's get theirs. What's left goes to the officers.

Just that simple.

IF you are still smokin dope, you are only playing at being in the military. You might just as well be a reenactor dressing up to 'play' army, because you ain't serious yet.

Smoking enough of it will eventually, even if you've stopped, eliminate you from contention from certain jobs (civilian AND military) that have limits on consumption of such things. Law Enforcement, for example.

[MOS4429]

Thanks, Lep, for filling that in. A few of the examples I gave him I left a bit open ended just to see if he would respond back and fill it in himself, in other words understanding you put your men before yourself at all times, but I see he has quit posting here, maybe not checking.

But if so, DS12, just out of curiosity, do the other kids in your school 1) also smoke dope? 2) smoke dope with you, or 3) do not or mostly do not smoke dope?

[Sgt Leprechaun]

My prediction?

We won't get an answer.

[SSgtRSD]

Agreed...

[MOS4429]

My prediction?

We won't get an answer.


All right. Let's take up a pool and see! I throw in the first buck! LOL.
:D

[Phantom Blooper]

You mean he is too fuked up to reply?

Shiat...who would have guessed?

[DS12]

Thanks, Lep, for filling that in. A few of the examples I gave him I left a bit open ended just to see if he would respond back and fill it in himself, in other words understanding you put your men before yourself at all times, but I see he has quit posting here, maybe not checking.

But if so, DS12, just out of curiosity, do the other kids in your school 1) also smoke dope? 2) smoke dope with you, or 3) do not or mostly do not smoke dope?

Yes. My school has a lot of people who drink and quite a few stoners. Not a lot of sober people. It isn't as bad as the civillian high schools in our area/district who allow students to take smoke breaks in bathrooms because it can't be controlled. The reason for the late reply is because school has start and been busy.

[YLDNDN6]

Yep!!!!! Here's a whole stack of waivers just waiting to happen. Best advice that can be given, seriously, is to lead by example. Before you undertake any particular hobby or pastime, ask yourself if it is something you would want your subordinates to see you doing. If you are thinking about a military career, any branch, stick to these tried and true golden rules...
1. Do not get body art of any sort, on any part of your body/face/extremities. You are joining the U.S. Military, not some roaming band of pirates or a biker gang.
2. Do not have extraneous holes poked into your body for the purpose of displaying jewelry. Again, you are not becoming a pirate or a gypsy fortune teller.
3. Continue your high school education until completion. GRADUATE!
4. Do not use drugs of any kind in a recreational manner. If you presently use drugs recreationally, quit yesterday. You can have a life or you can have drugs...seldom both.
5. Make good decisions that will keep you safe and out of trouble with the law. Stay out of the courts and jail. It's not that difficult. You have to TRY to get into trouble. It takes conscience effort to land in jail. Don't go this route.

Sure, there are exceptions to these rules. To get an exception requires your recruiter to apply to the higher-ups for a "waiver." What this means is that he/she is asking the government to make an exception for you. This can add considerable time to your enlistment experience and cause many days and nights of frustration and waiting. Your best bet is to try to stick to these rules, lead your boys by example and seek out the advice and counsel of your superiors when needed. Good luck.

[SSgtRSD]

Do you just not get it?!? You are wrong. Although society may accept your recreational activities, do you honestly believe it is ok to come on a Marine Corps oriented site targeted towards veterans and those wanting to earn the title, try and ask a question about Leadership (from Marines no less), and continuously attempt to rationalize/deflect/downplay the fact that you do not meet our standards. I have lost my mind on just about every post you have made on this thread. Guess what, end story: Leadersip= BY EXAMPLE
USMC policy= ZERO TOLERANCE
Stop minimizing, take the lick, and make a decision: dope or making something of yourself.

[Moderboater]

Yes. My school has a lot of people who drink and quite a few stoners. Not a lot of sober people. It isn't as bad as the civillian high schools in our area/district who allow students to take smoke breaks in bathrooms because it can't be controlled. The reason for the late reply is because school has start and been busy.

The FMF has that type of people in it to, but guess what? They are **** bags and you don't want to associate yourself with them. Being a leader is not about making yourself great. Being a leader means making sure your entire group of Marines functions well as a cohesive platoon, unit, etc. That also means like the other Marines said you get your chow after your subordinates. As a leader you want to make your team the absolute best it can be. Lead by example, do not be afraid to get down and dirty with your men.

[DS12]

Do you just not get it?!? You are wrong. Although society may accept your recreational activities, do you honestly believe it is ok to come on a Marine Corps oriented site targeted towards veterans and those wanting to earn the title, try and ask a question about Leadership (from Marines no less), and continuously attempt to rationalize/deflect/downplay the fact that you do not meet our standards. I have lost my mind on just about every post you have made on this thread. Guess what, end story: Leadersip= BY EXAMPLE
USMC policy= ZERO TOLERANCE
Stop minimizing, take the lick, and make a decision: dope or making something of yourself.
Staff Sgt, I don't know if you saw my post but I said I'm done with it, I've been to busy to even pick up some even if I wanted to. I appreciated all the advice, everyone.

[SSgtRSD]

Was wondering if anyone else saw that...