Stolen Valor - By commercial entity.

[IndieArms]

Former navy corpsman here. And what brings me here is something I find detestable and could use your help.

Someone trying to profit off the sacrifices the USMC made in WWII on Iwo Jima.

http://www.facebook.com/home.p<wbr>hp#!/photo.php?fbid=2216265911<wbr>82775&set=a.136741659671269.23<wbr>324.128885967123505&type=1 (http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=221626591182775&set=a.136741659671269.23324.128885967123505&type=1)

They have not offered any donations to the Wounded Warrior Project, nor to the Semper Fi Fund for invoking those men's sacrifice. But if you show a 214, you get a discount to play. And they will take any "donations."

Please help me in telling them that what they are doing is disrespectful and cheapens the sacrifice they and all service members made.

I apologize that this is my first post here, but I am a bit upset over this.

Doc Bernard

[devilbones2]

Wow, way to take things over the edge. I hope you go after all of the video game companies next that use the US Military and dont donate to the organizations either. Its an image that represents the military.

[IndieArms]

Maybe I am a bit touchy about the subject. But I visited that statue, and had an old USMC friend tell me stories about Iwo Jima, and what came before that flag raising. Stuff that made me proud and sad at the same time.

To me, that is an icon of valor, sacrifice, and honor. And for this group to use it as an ad for their own profit? Yeah, I look at that as sacrilege. If they used the Vietnam War Memorial, I would be this upset too.

There are some things that should not be tarnished or used for commercial purposes.

[YourPhoneIsMine]

Not even close to qualifying for "stolen valor".

protip: the very freedom fought for at iwo jima is what allows people to be, in your eyes, disrespectful

there are much more important things to worry about

[YourPhoneIsMine]

in fact, how is it any less disrespectful than having a picture on your website of people wearing ACU improperly?

http://i.imgur.com/DzZWl.jpg

soldiers have died in those uniforms and you're showing others wearing them with disregard like everyday street clothes

[iamspartacus]

there are much more important things to worry about

Agreed. Can we please devote this much attention, motivation and effort on things that actually matter? I'm not saying keeping honor in our veterans does not matter, but come on. There are plenty of people out there who openly and deliberately bash our service members. Let's speak out against them instead of trying to read into and psychoanalyze the intent of a random business poster.

[USNAviator]

Steve you need to fill out your profile please then chill. Do a search on Google for images of the Iwo flag raising and see how many times it's been used for commercial, political and yes disrespectful purposes

And this in no way constitutes Stolen Valor which to me means an individual claiming to be something he isn't in regards to the military

Dave has his opinion about this matter and he sees it one way, I see it another but it's just semantics. I think we both agree that to bring dishonor to anyone who has served is disgraceful. Medals are just that, medals. I wouldn't wear an award I didn't earn or was entitled to but some do..They have to live with it

[IndieArms]

Based you what you guys are saying.......maybe I am over-reacting a bit. But I hate seeing things like that.

Yourphoneismine: Glad you brought that pic up. I chewed some a$$ for that sloppy look. If you wear the uniform, you treat it with respect. Or take it off.

To me stolen valor has 2 aspects:

1. Claiming something you have no right to
2. Demeaning the valor of others.

But point taken, Gentlemen. I am getting upset over nothing......If you guys are cool with it.......I should be too. Maybe I should just relax........I still don't like it, though.

[USNAviator]

Based you what you guys are saying.......maybe I am over-reacting a bit. But I hate seeing things like that.

Yourphoneismine: Glad you brought that pic up. I chewed some a$$ for that sloppy look. If you wear the uniform, you treat it with respect. Or take it off.

To me stolen valor has 2 aspects:

1. Claiming something you have no right to
2. Demeaning the valor of others.

But point taken, Gentlemen. I am getting upset over nothing......If you guys are cool with it.......I should be too. Maybe I should just relax........I still don't like it, though.


No sense getting worked up over it Doc. Not much we can do about turds anyway. BTW, welcome

[IndieArms]

Thanks Dave and USNAviator. It just hit a "nerve" with Memorial Day around the corner. Too many people forget the purpose of that day, IMO. Remembering our fallen and honoring their sacrifices.

I guess that's why I got worked up, it re-enforced that opinion.

[USNAviator]

I don't think you're getting upset over nothing, Steve. I think you have a legitimate gripe. And what they're doing is disrespectful and out of line, in that they are using an icon that stands for something that they themselves don't have--i.e. honorable behavior.

But if I claim I was in the Navy SEALS and I was not, does this take away something from the real Navy SEALS? I don't see how it could. They are SEALS, I am not, end of story.
If I claim to be the governor of my state, and I am not, is the real governor still the governor even though I said I was?
Can the disrespectful use of an icon or symbol ever operate to demean the valor of others? How would that work? My dad fought in WWII in the Italian Campaign, they saw some heavy fighting. He got a Bronze Star, but so did many others. If I see a Bronze Star in a pawn shop window, for sale for ten bucks, does that affect my father's service in the 36th Division in 1943-1944? I really don't see how it possibly could. It's a medal in a window. It is not his bravery in the window.

So, I agree with you that these people are idiots and should be called out for what they're doing, they are trying to make a buck using the Iwo Jima photo icon.
Yes, true.
But they cannot steal valor from anyone. No matter what they do. February 19. 1945 has come and gone. The day was over just 24 hours later. What some idiots do NOW cannot affect what happened in 1945, in any way.
It just cannot be done. By anyone. Ever.


Again I'm talking about Stolen Valor not stolen valor. I'm referring to the organization that tried to stop posers from presenting themselves as military personnel who were awarded citations for bravery

I think you can steal Valor in that sense. But I agree the abstract valor cannot be stolen by anyone. And you gave a good example.

[USNAviator]

Sorry, Dan, we posted at precisely the same time


Well that happens quite a bit when you're sharing the same brain......:D

[IndieArms]

Thank you for showing me reason, guys. Occasionally I get hot under the collar, and even make rash decisions sometimes because of it. Thanks for keeping me square.

[YourPhoneIsMine]

Why are we wasting our time talking about people bashing our service members when Japan is still trying to recover from a tsunami?

which reminds me, if anyone wants to talk about disrespect then how about the swath of ****ing idiots that tried to suggest the earthquake was payback for pearl harbor.

as far as this poster, big deal. he's not insulting the image. it's a moment in history and he has every right to use it just like we have every right to use images of the moon landing. they've even gone as far as offering free time for anyone that served, something they don't have to do. I like it when companies use military related images as long as they get them right. it reminds everyone that such events happened and hopefully encourages folks to learn more about them, good and bad.

[USNAviator]

We'll send you a bill, Steve, don't pay Dan's share of it, just pay mine. LOL


Doc's a fellow Squid so doesn't owe me a cent.

Watch him Doc, he use to be an AF JAG.

[YourPhoneIsMine]

I wasn't implying that you were making any such statements, merely that the mention of japan reminded me of that.

[IndieArms]

Oh I will be, LOL! I think I found a good home here. You are my kind of group. And not in DADT kind of way.

[Sgt Leprechaun]

Concur. Lots of stupidity out there....expend your energy on the stuff that matters.

I'm with Dave, 'Phone, and the Commander on this one.

[kenrobg30]

I wear a hat that has Us Marine Corps, Korean War Veteran on the front. I also wear a pair of Suspenders with the Marine Corps Logo on them. Sometimes I wear a T-shirt with the flag raising picture on it. Many times, I've had people come up to me, and thank me for my service, and I often get into conversations with guys who were there. that's why I wear them. Posers do not say thank you, and they sure as hell don't last long in a "Where were you" conversation. I answer the questions when they're asked of me. I turn my back and walk away when I get the wrong answers. I wear the logos in respect for the people who earned them. I'm not sure this is on the subject or not, but I had to say it. :flag::iwo::usmc:
Ken

[IndieArms]

I wear a hat that has Us Marine Corps, Korean War Veteran on the front. I also wear a pair of Suspenders with the Marine Corps Logo on them. Sometimes I wear a T-shirt with the flag raising picture on it. Many times, I've had people come up to me, and thank me for my service, and I often get into conversations with guys who were there. that's why I wear them. Posers do not say thank you, and they sure as hell don't last long in a "Where were you" conversation. I answer the questions when they're asked of me. I turn my back and walk away when I get the wrong answers. I wear the logos in respect for the people who earned them. I'm not sure this is on the subject or not, but I had to say it. :flag::iwo::usmc:
Ken

I guess my beef was with them making a profit off of using that famous picture, and worse...not offering anything back off that profit. You wearing things that you support, at least to me is way different. You are stating your pride in the Corps, without saying a word.

But thanks to some good old-fashioned advice given here...... I am not as "angry"....... disgusted, yeah, that I still am. But foam at the mouth angry? Nope. I am taking an "it is what it is" outlook on it.